Hospital waiting hours in emergency

In todays papers... this...

A&E patients wade through 14 PAGES of touch-screen questions before being asked: Are you losing lots of blood?​



Everyone expects a lengthy wait in A&E these days, even if you are in pain.

But a new scheme threatens to add to the agony – with an iPad check-in system that even asks if you are 'spurting' blood before summoning a doctor.

Astonishingly, there are 14 pages of multiple-choice questions before patients are asked: 'Have you lost a lot of blood?'

The screen then reads: 'We're checking for very heavy bleeding. It would be spraying, spurting or enough to make a puddle.'

NHS England's new 'Urgent Care Centre self-service' programme then requires the patient to find the energy to tap on one of the options: Yes, No, or I'm Not Sure.
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NHS England's new 'Urgent Care Centre self-service' programme requires patients to check themselves in when they arrive at A&E
Anyone fighting to breathe has to wade through the same number of pages before getting to the question: 'Have you got sudden rapid swelling of the lips, face, tongue, mouth or throat?'

And anyone seeking help after trying to kill themselves has to complete even more pages before being asked starkly on the computer screen: 'Are you here because you've tried to end your life?'

It is only at a later stage that they are asked: 'Have you taken or swallowed anything poisonous or harmful? For example, drugs, an overdose of medicine, medicine meant for someone else, cleaning products, plants, or an object like a battery or magnet.'
The new iPad-style A&E devices are already in use across much of South London – with The Mail on Sunday finding them in operation at Princess Royal University Hospital (PRUH) in Orpington, as well as hospitals in Beckenham and Sidcup, similarly run by the King's College Hospital NHS Trust.

When The Mail on Sunday visited PRUH, two non-medical staff behind a glass screen looked embarrassed as they said those needing help had to 'check themselves in on the iPads' in the waiting room, even if bleeding.

A member of the non-medical reception staff at PRUH told the MoS: 'Since they arrived a couple of weeks ago we've been told to send people to the iPads even if they're obviously bleeding.

'We've had people bleeding on the floor down there and all sorts.'

NHS England, which designed the programme, said hospitals were welcome to use it to improve efficiency.

But last night the director of over-60s campaign group Silver Voices, Dennis Reed, said: 'I'm extremely concerned that self check-in screens like this in A&E could be dangerous and lead to life-threatening delays.

'Some patients, including the elderly, will be so stressed or ill when then arrive in A&E that they are not going to be able to cope with filling out a digital questionnaire.

'The first thing they will want to do is speak to a real person, who can ask them what is wrong and triage them appropriately.'
A&E patients asked by check-in survey: Are you losing lots of blood?
 

You would think because he presented as a stroke (or possible stroke) patient, they would have taken him in a lot sooner!

A few months before he died, my husband and I sat in the emergency room all night. To say we were there for 12 to 14 hours would not be an exaggeration. He was finally admitted. The ER in my town is notorious for being overcrowded and not seeing patients quickly unless they are brought in by ambulance.
 
A pensioner who was left in excruciating pain has told how he had to dial 999 from his own hospital bed for help, in one of the most harrowing examples of the crisis in the NHS.

Martin Wild was admitted to Salford Royal Hospital last year after developing a spinal infection following a private operation.

The 73-year-old was denied pain relief because of staff shortages and even left lying in his own urine during his horrifying eight-month stay in hospital, he claimed. Other patients nearby were also shouting and screaming for help.

At one point Mr Wild, who also has Parkinson's, told his wife: 'If I am going to die in this hospital, let it be soon.'

A doctor who assessed Mr Wild described him as being 'the most neglected patient I have ever seen'.

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An investigation by the Northern Care Alliance NHS Foundation Trust, which runs the hospital, found his care caused him 'serious harm' and apologised for its failings.

Mr Wild, a former car salesman, was initially taken to Fairfield Hospital A&E in Bury on May 8, two weeks after an operation to treat spinal stenosis, surgery for narrowing of the spine.

He was transferred to Salford Royal hours later and admitted to an acute medical ward.

Recalling his shocking ordeal, Mr Wild added: 'I asked for some pain relief. They said, "We've got no powers to prescribe [an opioid]." I asked, "Can you get a doctor?".

'They said: "They're busy with over 100 patients, you're not a priority." I was in agony so I phoned 999.'

Mr Wild was eventually given painkillers after multiple calls to hospital receptionists.

He was later discharged despite warning medics he was not well enough and did not have adequate care at home.

But even after he was readmitted days later, Mr Wild claimed that his poor care at the hospital continued.

'I was in so much pain, I was shaking but nobody seemed to bother,' he told the Daily Mirror.

'I told my wife Lorraine, "I can't stand it anymore. If I am going to die in hospital, let it be soon".'

In one grim incident, he also knocked one of the three full bottles of urine which were stood on his table, onto his bed after shaking so much in pain.

Mr Wild claimed he was left lying in urine-soaked sheets for hours before they were eventually changed.
'Most neglected' patient, 73, calls 999 for help from his hospital bed
 
That elderly friend that was admitted to hospital last week is still in. He is waiting for an MRI scan for which there is such a long list. So he is taking up a bed through no fault of his - so far for 6 days. He's fine and wants to go home but can't. His wife is making daily journeys from some distance.
Also, the ward is stiflingly hot, everyone is sweating. Their energy bill must be enormous.
This is the wastage that goes on and of course one day will result in the end of our free system.
 
hollydolly said:
A pensioner who was left in excruciating pain has told how he had to dial 999 from his own hospital bed for help, in one of the most harrowing examples of the crisis in the NHS.

Martin Wild was admitted to Salford Royal Hospital last year after developing a spinal infection following a private operation.

The 73-year-old was denied pain relief because of staff shortages and even left lying in his own urine during his horrifying eight-month stay in hospital, he claimed. Other patients nearby were also shouting and screaming for help.

At one point Mr Wild, who also has Parkinson's, told his wife: 'If I am going to die in this hospital, let it be soon.'

A doctor who assessed Mr Wild described him as being 'the most neglected patient I have ever seen'.

82047447-0-image-a-1_1709627214357.jpg

An investigation by the Northern Care Alliance NHS Foundation Trust, which runs the hospital, found his care caused him 'serious harm' and apologised for its failings.

Mr Wild, a former car salesman, was initially taken to Fairfield Hospital A&E in Bury on May 8, two weeks after an operation to treat spinal stenosis, surgery for narrowing of the spine.

He was transferred to Salford Royal hours later and admitted to an acute medical ward.

Recalling his shocking ordeal, Mr Wild added: 'I asked for some pain relief. They said, "We've got no powers to prescribe [an opioid]." I asked, "Can you get a doctor?".

'They said: "They're busy with over 100 patients, you're not a priority." I was in agony so I phoned 999.'

Mr Wild was eventually given painkillers after multiple calls to hospital receptionists.

He was later discharged despite warning medics he was not well enough and did not have adequate care at home.

But even after he was readmitted days later, Mr Wild claimed that his poor care at the hospital continued.

'I was in so much pain, I was shaking but nobody seemed to bother,' he told the Daily Mirror.

'I told my wife Lorraine, "I can't stand it anymore. If I am going to die in hospital, let it be soon".'

In one grim incident, he also knocked one of the three full bottles of urine which were stood on his table, onto his bed after shaking so much in pain.

Mr Wild claimed he was left lying in urine-soaked sheets for hours before they were eventually changed.
'Most neglected' patient, 73, calls 999 for help from his hospital bed
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Ridiculous.
 
We have several Urgent Care facilities in my area. I thought for sure having those units available would take some pressure off of the waiting rooms at the hospitals.

I took my 88 year old neighbor to the emergency room last year when he fell down the last 4 steps of his staircase leading to his upstairs. I checked him in about 9:30 p.m. and the nurse said it will probably be awhile until he is seen. I asked her what’s awhile? She said probably at least 4-6 hours. He was in and out of Triage in less than an hour, then the wait started.

My neighbor told me to go on home and he would call me when he’s ready for pick up, so I did that. I woke up at 6:30 the next morning and still no phone call, so I called the hospital. The nurse told me he’s with the doctor now. This emergency room has 26 private areas in it, including 4 doctors and 6 P.A.’s.

The doctor who lives up the street from me told me it takes a long while in the emergency room because all the tests that are done also have to be read, so a patient can normally expect to be there anywhere from 6-10 hours. I was also told anyone that comes in via ambulance or helicopter gets seen first to determine their need.
 
In my town in Canada I took my daughter to a virtual doctor on a computer screen inside a Pharmacy.

We just filled out all of the relevant personal info...typed in the health card number...then the doctor appeared on the screen through video and diagnosed my daughter with Strep Throat. Then she faxed the antibiotic prescription to the Pharmacy in about 5 minutes. The whole procedure took us about 45 minutes, and saved us an 8 hour wait at emergency or a walk-in clinic. My daughters don't have a family doctor...she retired.
 
I miss not having the private medical cover that work provided. 13 years ago, I had a hernia that needed a minor op. to fix it. After seeing my GP, it was 3 months before I got to see a hospital doctor and another 3 before I had the 20 minute op. I had checked round all the local hospitals, and the waiting time was the same in them all. I thought that strange. I mentioned to the surgeon that I was annoyed at the wait and she said,'you should have come straight to me. I have my own private list and would have done it right away'.

I have great admiration for the doctors, surgeons and most nurses, but the whole organisation is totally disjointed.
 
Beezer said:
In my town in Canada I took my daughter to a virtual doctor on a computer screen inside a Pharmacy.

We just filled out all of the relevant personal info...typed in the health card number...then the doctor appeared on the screen through video and diagnosed my daughter with Strep Throat. Then she faxed the antibiotic prescription to the Pharmacy in about 5 minutes. The whole procedure took us about 45 minutes, and saved us an 8 hour wait at emergency or a walk-in clinic. My daughters don't have a family doctor...she retired.
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We now have that type of service and I love it.
Virtual care. No need to go to an office. No need to wait in a waiting room with a bunch of sick people. I’ve had better virtual care than in office care.
 
These stories are hideous. I know in the US, my hospital will triage cases after you check in by meeting with you in a separate room from the waiting area. It can take quite a while though to get to that portion of the check in procedure. Many times I have had a loved one wait in a hospital bed in the hallway because there were no rooms available in the Emergency Room. And you really do need someone there to advocate for you. I have had to do it several times. I suspect if you don't have anyone to do that, you will be ignored for the most part.
 
hollydolly said:
A pensioner who was left in excruciating pain has told how he had to dial 999 from his own hospital bed for help, in one of the most harrowing examples of the crisis in the NHS.

Martin Wild was admitted to Salford Royal Hospital last year after developing a spinal infection following a private operation.

The 73-year-old was denied pain relief because of staff shortages and even left lying in his own urine during his horrifying eight-month stay in hospital, he claimed. Other patients nearby were also shouting and screaming for help.

At one point Mr Wild, who also has Parkinson's, told his wife: 'If I am going to die in this hospital, let it be soon.'

A doctor who assessed Mr Wild described him as being 'the most neglected patient I have ever seen'.

82047447-0-image-a-1_1709627214357.jpg

An investigation by the Northern Care Alliance NHS Foundation Trust, which runs the hospital, found his care caused him 'serious harm' and apologised for its failings.

Mr Wild, a former car salesman, was initially taken to Fairfield Hospital A&E in Bury on May 8, two weeks after an operation to treat spinal stenosis, surgery for narrowing of the spine.

He was transferred to Salford Royal hours later and admitted to an acute medical ward.

Recalling his shocking ordeal, Mr Wild added: 'I asked for some pain relief. They said, "We've got no powers to prescribe [an opioid]." I asked, "Can you get a doctor?".

'They said: "They're busy with over 100 patients, you're not a priority." I was in agony so I phoned 999.'

Mr Wild was eventually given painkillers after multiple calls to hospital receptionists.

He was later discharged despite warning medics he was not well enough and did not have adequate care at home.

But even after he was readmitted days later, Mr Wild claimed that his poor care at the hospital continued.

'I was in so much pain, I was shaking but nobody seemed to bother,' he told the Daily Mirror.

'I told my wife Lorraine, "I can't stand it anymore. If I am going to die in hospital, let it be soon".'

In one grim incident, he also knocked one of the three full bottles of urine which were stood on his table, onto his bed after shaking so much in pain.

Mr Wild claimed he was left lying in urine-soaked sheets for hours before they were eventually changed.
'Most neglected' patient, 73, calls 999 for help from his hospital bed
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Now that's a damned shame!!! :mad: I've heard enough hospital horror stories. There were times when I suffered with atrial fibrillation that I knew I should have been in the hospital, including the times that I fainted. But I refused to go. However, I must admit that my mother got excellent care each time she was hospitalized for her transfusions in our local hospital. I did also when I finally had the cardiac ablation to correct the A-fib.
 
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hollydolly said:
I had private medical Insurance, I was on my husband's policy... when he left 2 years ago.. he cancelled my part of the policy....
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I went back to court in 2008, basically begging for my Spousal Support to be reinstated, OR, just for $300 a month so I could use that to pay for my own HMO medical insurance with crappy Kaiser. (Kaiser's motto should be, "If you're lucky, we won't kill you. Take a chance!" )

The court said "no".

That was at the beginning of the Great Recession but I don't think anyone making $100,000+ a year even gave a **** that the Recession had arrived and was going to be devastating. I don't think they even read the daily newspapers. I have begun to believe that people at the higher earnings levels are completely oblivious to the news on the street.

Maybe that is how it all works? IDK. I don't know how any court can be so cold to turn down a mother of multiple children after she has devoted her life to caring for them, and not even grant her $300 a month for health insurance?

What did they think I would spent it on? Booze? Drugs? Coach handbags? What? (I do have one famous-name handbag which my daughter gave me. All my other purses were bought at the Goodwill, Ross, or J.C. Penney.)

IDK how the divorce courts work in the UK, Holly, but I wish you well and I wish you a just and equitable settlement where he is not allowed to hide anything.
 
Rose65 said:
Friends of mine, elderly couple, just spent 14 hours overnight in the hospital as the husband was suspected of having had a stroke.
They sat in chairs all night, he's now been admitted and is very sick. She is exhausted. The night was filled with drunks, drug addicts,ranting and raving persons, ambulances backed up outside.

Another friend's mum broke her arm and they had a 12 hour wait.

Is this, the UK, now a third world country?
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It has become this way all over I'm afraid. I believe we have Covid-19 to thank for that.
 
Hollydolly, that story was truly heartbreaking. If doctors won’t listen to a colleague that’s an expert in the field imagine how doctors feel about regular patients. Ugh!!
 
Rosie56 said:
Unfortunately the same is happening in US hospitals too!
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Usually suspected stroke victims are treated immediately. In cases like that, it's best to call 911 and be transported to the hospital - no waiting room stops.

Average wait time in the US is about 3 hours according to multiple sources. Still far too long but rarely anywhere near 12 hours, at least not in my neck of the woods.

I will add that having visited some third world countries AKA developing countries, there is no comparison between health care availability in the US - even in crappy hospitals - and that of rural Central and South America.
Blessed said:
It should never be on a first come, first seen basis. The ER's near me always do a evaluation, when you arrive. Temp checked, blood pressure, oxygen saturation, and pain level.

If there is blood loss, open wound, high temp, chest pain, trouble breathing, broken bones or a child in trouble, they will always go first. If you have a stomach virus, flu etc, migraine....you will have to wait.
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Ditto.
oldman said:
The doctor who lives up the street from me told me it takes a long while in the emergency room because all the tests that are done also have to be read, so a patient can normally expect to be there anywhere from 6-10 hours. I was also told anyone that comes in via ambulance or helicopter gets seen first to determine their need.
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Very true. If you need a series of tests for them to be certain of a diagnosis, they usually wait for those results before releasing you.
 
Rose65 said:
Friends of mine, elderly couple, just spent 14 hours overnight in the hospital as the husband was suspected of having had a stroke.
They sat in chairs all night, he's now been admitted and is very sick. She is exhausted. The night was filled with drunks, drug addicts,ranting and raving persons, ambulances backed up outside.

Another friend's mum broke her arm and they had a 12 hour wait.

Is this, the UK, now a third world country?
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They did not send him in an ambulance? Most places do not make stroke victims wait.
 
StarSong said:
Usually suspected stroke victims are treated immediately. In cases like that, it's best to call 911 and be transported to the hospital - no waiting room stops.

Average wait time in the US is about 3 hours according to multiple sources. Still far too long but rarely anywhere near 12 hours, at least not in my neck of the woods.

I will add that having visited some third world countries AKA developing countries, there is no comparison between health care availability in the US - even in crappy hospitals - and that of rural Central and South America.

Ditto.

Very true. If you need a series of tests for them to be certain of a diagnosis, they usually wait for those results before releasing you.
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I have noted from what friends have told me that some have spent as much as four to six hours waiting to be seen on a bad night. It's terrible.
 
Myra said:
I have noted from what friends have told me that some have spent as much as four to six hours waiting to be seen on a bad night. It's terrible.
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Not surprising. 3 hours being average so 4-6 could happen on a bad night. ERs are a crap shoot. Could be empty, could be loaded. Hospitals with attached urgent care centers take a lot of pressure off their ERs by skimming off cases of flu, sore throats, UTIs, and so forth.
 
StarSong said:
Not surprising. 3 hours being average so 4-6 could happen on a bad night. ERs are a crap shoot. Could be empty, could be loaded. Hospitals with attached urgent care centers take a lot of pressure off their ERs by skimming off cases of flu, sore throats, UTIs, and so forth.
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We have a lack of nursing staff here. Some of the ER beds are being held up by patients that have been admitted to the hospital that can't get a room due to staffing shortages. I often wonder if there is a pricing difference if one is forced to stay in the ER as opposed to an actual hospital room.
 
We have a service that costs $65 a year that pays your co-pay for an ambulance ride to the ER. The ride usually costs a total of $1,600.00 before medicare kicks in. We found out tater after 8 hour wait in the ER if you call an ambulance you actually get right in. After our 3rd Covid vac my wife developed blood clots and her breathing was impaired.

We called 911 for service, she got a bed & treatment quickly. 3 days later I brought her home on meds & much better. I can only guess the hospital has an agreement with the emergency service to take those patients first. You scratch my back I'll get yours. Guess who we call before the doctor.
 


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