A Conversation about the Homeless

I agree with @Dr. Jekyll's solution where we provide camps for the homeless. Here's the link:
https://www.seniorforums.com/threads/a-conversation-about-the-homeless.75007/page-2#post-2240060

It would be cost effective and it would get the homeless off the streets. I would bet that it would help many homeless people turn their lives around.

I'm the only one who responded to his post. What's wrong with that solution (other than it's socialism)?
 

I agree with @Dr. Jekyll's solution where we provide camps for the homeless. Here's the link:
https://www.seniorforums.com/threads/a-conversation-about-the-homeless.75007/page-2#post-2240060

It would be cost effective and it would get the homeless off the streets. I would bet that it would help many homeless people turn their lives around.

I'm the only one who responded to his post. What's wrong with that solution (other than it's socialism)?
People have tried that approach, Ben, and the city or state moved against them. A lady opened her 2 acre property to the homeless and the city cited her for violating city codes. A man built hundreds of tiny homes and gave them to homeless people and the city threw the people out, loaded up their homes and destroyed them. A man opened his defunct shopping mall to home the homeless and the state sued him.

And military bases are strictly off-limits to civilians who aren't employed there.
 
Although California politicians given homeless and legal advocates using electric prods against them, have moved against such efforts, it is also true enough people protested those actions with media publicity that some are now reluctantly moving in that direction. Homelessness is a huge issue locally on my Nextdoor community of mostly upscale suburban neighborhoods, that local politicians after the SF DA was recalled are now running scared. One thing that has resulted that I like to think my inputs on crime have affected is the renewed use of Automated License Plate Readers, aka ALPR's, that several cities that first trial implemented such, then backed away after the ACLU and others threatened them. So yeah we citizens do have increasing power in this nascent telecom era to affect change.
 

People have tried that approach, Ben, and the city or state moved against them. A lady opened her 2 acre property to the homeless and the city cited her for violating city codes. A man built hundreds of tiny homes and gave them to homeless people and the city threw the people out, loaded up their homes and destroyed them. A man opened his defunct shopping mall to home the homeless and the state sued him.
That's not anything like what @Dr. Jekyll proposed. There's more to it than just providing a place where the homeless can pitch their tents.
 
Yoiks. I'll try to be more appreciative of my affordable (boring, lonely) apartment. If things change somehow and I can't live here any more, the best I can hope for is to buy an old van to live in. Or move to a cheaper country and have a whole new set of problems.
 
I agree with @Dr. Jekyll's solution where we provide camps for the homeless. Here's the link:
https://www.seniorforums.com/threads/a-conversation-about-the-homeless.75007/page-2#post-2240060

It would be cost effective and it would get the homeless off the streets. I would bet that it would help many homeless people turn their lives around.

I'm the only one who responded to his post. What's wrong with that solution (other than it's socialism)?

"Sweep the streets" is the problem. In places like California, the legal system supports the rights of individuals to sleep and even pitch tents in public places.

Also, Dr. Jekyll doesn't mention the problems of addiction, alcoholism, and mental illness, all of which are prime causes of homelessness and require supervision and treatment.

It isn't "socialism", although I'm sure you think socialism is a wonderful thing.
 
I've worked around the homeless for a very long time
But
I've gleaned the most understanding by being homeless myself
It was self imposed, and was quite young, but those folk's mindset stuck with me.
There simply is no 'fix'
They don't wanna be fixed
They mostly just wanna self medicate to deaden the demons crowding their minds
They don't want a Bible
They don't want regulation of any kind
and they certainly don't want you
They don't even want themselves

A large corrugated box is what they want when it's cold
and a jug for self medication

They'll take money, food, coffee, a blanket, a coat

Very frustrating, but can't just pigeonhole 'em into a regimen of any kind
It's why they are where they are

I'm sure @Shalimar can offer some insight on this subject

A little note;
I've backed off on giving much to the corner sign holders
Seems it's become a bit of a racket
 
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They came back? That's a shame.

My son and his wife just came back from a one week vacation LA. They went to see the Rammstien concert. They took a selfie at Venice Beach and it doesn't show any tents or sleeping bags in the background, but maybe they made a point of not capturing any.
Now, you've got me wondering what Santa Cruz looks like now?
Have you been there lately or know anyone?

We used to vacation there when we were kids, and continued to go in to adult hood.
But, haven't been there in years.
 
Now, you've got me wondering what Santa Cruz looks like now?
Have you been there lately or know anyone?

We used to vacation there when we were kids, and continued to go in to adult hood.
But, haven't been there in years.
I haven't been to Santa Cruz since I was in my 30s. I know that over the past 5-6 years the homeless population has been hovering around 2,000 to 2,500 for the whole county. Depends on the weather, probably. Cold misty nights and rainy days will start soon.
 
Now, you've got me wondering what Santa Cruz looks like now?
Have you been there lately or know anyone?

We used to vacation there when we were kids, and continued to go in to adult hood.
But, haven't been there in years.
That's my home town. It had some strange people when I last left in the mid 80's. I can only imagine now. I'm sure it's got plenty of homeless and tent camps. It's worse than I imagined. Do a Google search "santa cruz, ca homeless" OMG WTF
 
At least through last year there were homeless camps on the west end of Santa Cruz on the way to Natural Bridges SP. I wearing jeans t-shirt, stopped one morning a couple minutes to buy a donut at the 7-11 at the corner with Highway 1. A few homeless people were milling about outside I didn't have any interaction with. When I came out they were gone and found one of my tires punctured with an ice pick hole that cost a few hundred dollars as I needed to replace the whole 4 tire set.

Angrily striking back randomly at anyone they see as apparently successful in a world they hate due to their own miserable failures.
 
Also, Dr. Jekyll doesn't mention the problems of addiction, alcoholism, and mental illness, all of which are prime causes of homelessness and require supervision and treatment.
I did say it was a broad overview. I did say "abandoned" military bases and other similar areas. With everything focused in a single location (say one per major city where the worst problems are) then the resources for those problems can be focused there. And again, the doors/gates are never locked. If such an economic refugee camp gives you the resources and help you need to get back on your feet then off you go. On the other hand, if you don't want to work and don't want to expend any energy other than to exist - you are free to do so there - just not in the streets.
 
At least through last year there were homeless camps on the west end of Santa Cruz on the way to Natural Bridges SP. I wearing jeans t-shirt, stopped one morning a couple minutes to buy a donut at the 7-11 at the corner with Highway 1. A few homeless people were milling about outside I didn't have any interaction with. When I came out they were gone and found one of my tires punctured with an ice pick hole that cost a few hundred dollars as I needed to replace the whole 4 tire set.

Angrily striking back randomly at anyone they see as apparently successful in a world they hate due to their own miserable failures.
OMG, I'm so sorry that happened to you! And yes, they can be dangerous.
 
Not in my neighborhood? Well how about my workplace neighborhood? Just heard on the news a tiny village homeless place, ready for move in spring 2023, is going up some place very close to my workplace. No big deal really, we've been dealing with the homeless in the area for years, at this job and my former job which was also close by.

It is needed. I can't remember the number of units. From what they stated it will be transitional type housing and there will be security.
 
I did say it was a broad overview. I did say "abandoned" military bases and other similar areas. With everything focused in a single location (say one per major city where the worst problems are) then the resources for those problems can be focused there. And again, the doors/gates are never locked. If such an economic refugee camp gives you the resources and help you need to get back on your feet then off you go. On the other hand, if you don't want to work and don't want to expend any energy other than to exist - you are free to do so there - just not in the streets.

Your idea is a good one and of course you're not expected to provide all details in a SF post. I'm just saying (again) that homelessness is a very complex problem. It's not just housing but mental health and treatment of various dependencies.
 
I went over and fed the cats at work this AM as I always do. It does not appear this transitional tiny house community is going in right next to my workplace on the vacant lot. According to the map on the local news, it's right there but I can't figure out where else it could go.
 
Your idea is a good one and of course you're not expected to provide all details in a SF post. I'm just saying (again) that homelessness is a very complex problem. It's not just housing but mental health and treatment of various dependencies.
And what about when "the homeless" are given and accept housing.. but are not required to do anything in their own behalf, not even required to address their addictions? "Self-determination" and "rights" can go too far.
 
And what about when "the homeless" are given and accept housing.. but are not required to do anything in their own behalf, not even required to address their addictions? "Self-determination" and "rights" can go too far.
You can't make them "address their addictions" unless you make everyone NOT homeless do the same. Its discriminatory.
 
I think the homeless need "tough love." Before the usual suspects pile on, let me explain.

Most (not all) homeless people have drug, alcohol or mental illness problems. Sometimes all three. They need food and shelter, but above all they need treatment.
Most? Really? And you discovered this "fact" where?
 
Most? Really? And you discovered this "fact" where?
Harvard Health Newsletter -- a quarter to a third of homeless people are mentally ill

The homeless mentally ill - Harvard Health

About a third of homeless people have substance abuse or addiction problems

As to alcohol/drugs:

  • Most research shows that around 1/3 of people who are homeless have problems with alcohol and/or drugs, and around 2/3 of these people have lifetime histories of drug or alcohol use disorders.6
Substance Abuse & Homelessness: Statistics & Rehab Treatment (americanaddictioncenters.org)

When I add one-third and one-third, I get two-thirds. Even allowing for some overlap between the categories, it's more than half. And advocates for the homeless tend to play down these figures, because they lessen sympathy for the homeless, which shouldn't be the case.

That's where I got my "facts". Where do you get yours?
 

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