Elon Musk not as rational a thinker as he thinks he is

feywon

Senior Member
Will post link to full article at end, but headline caught my eye. The question he asked asked that has me questioning his supposed 'brilliance' [except at staying i public eye and making $$$, those he's champ at, for now]is this:
Musk said, “If the universe is really 13.8 billion years old, shouldn’t there be aliens everywhere?”

Anyone with some knowledge of world history and/or has been paying attention to recent archeological finds knows civilizations rise and fall over time, even advanced ones. Their structures and artifacts get buried by nature. And when you factor in the size as well as age of the universe the odds of sentient, technologically advanced civilizations being 'everywhere' at the same time narrows considerably. By the time Conquistadors were moving thru South and Central America and later other European settlers in North America there were ruins of civilizations that were gone when the then current people 'indigenous' had settled there.

Elon Musk On Aliens Asks If Universe Is 13.8B Years Old, Shouldn't They Be 'Everywhere?' (msn.com)
 

dko1951

Member
Will post link to full article at end, but headline caught my eye. The question he asked asked that has me questioning his supposed 'brilliance' [except at staying i public eye and making $$$, those he's champ at, for now]is this:
Musk said, “If the universe is really 13.8 billion years old, shouldn’t there be aliens everywhere?”

Anyone with some knowledge of world history and/or has been paying attention to recent archeological finds knows civilizations rise and fall over time, even advanced ones. Their structures and artifacts get buried by nature. And when you factor in the size as well as age of the universe the odds of sentient, technologically advanced civilizations being 'everywhere' at the same time narrows considerably. By the time Conquistadors were moving thru South and Central America and later other European settlers in North America there were ruins of civilizations that were gone when the then current people 'indigenous' had settled there.

Elon Musk On Aliens Asks If Universe Is 13.8B Years Old, Shouldn't They Be 'Everywhere?' (msn.com)
Musk is an idiot con artist.
 

David777

Member
Location
Silicon Valley
Elon Musk is obviously not the source of some of his own public statements but rather given his wealth as a magnet for exceptional people on all matters, are from those with greater credibility on various subjects that educate and advise him. An example are his statements about the universe and existence being a vast lab simulation. In such cases, those subjects are also controversial within top experts in whatever subjects.

The subject you mention is decades old, otherwise known as Fermi's Paradox that has been greatly discussed and debated over decades with considerable changes in leading hypothesis. I personally have been leisurely studying research and books on the matter for decades. Recently science with our own advancements in artificial intelligence have increasingly moved towards the new hypothesis that any advanced organic intelligent life eventually evolves into non-organic AI without limitations of death, destruction by lethal radiations, or exploration over vast light years. It can also be argued once a race of super AI first establishes itself within a galaxy or vast region of space, it may henceforth dominate in those regions forever forward. It can also be argued that such a race may planet engineer and cultivate organic life on many other potential Goldilocks liquid water zone planets. And if so there are considerable reasons per the Zoo hypothesis why once such life develops technology, they would remain hidden so as not to negatively influence.

One clear sign Earth is such a creation is our otherwise highly unlikely large moon and the Earths perfect axis tilt for changing seasons that greatly enhances earth life. Remarkable that over 4 billion years, the always receding Moon just when intelligent life has arisen is now of size and distance to often perfectly cover our Sun for spectacular Solar eclipses.

Each of the below Wikipedia sections has terse expanded explanations with references for more complete studies:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermi_paradox

Hypothetical explanations for the paradox

5.1 Rarity of intelligent life
5.1.1 Extraterrestrial life is rare or non-existent
5.1.2 Extraterrestrial intelligence is rare or non-existent
5.1.3 Periodic extinction by natural events
5.2 Evolutionary explanations
5.2.1 Intelligent alien species have not developed advanced technologies
5.2.2 It is the nature of intelligent life to destroy itself
5.2.3 It is the nature of intelligent life to destroy others
5.2.4 Civilizations only broadcast detectable signals for a brief period of time
5.2.5 Alien life may be too alien
5.3 Sociological explanations
5.3.1 Colonization is not the cosmic norm
5.3.2 Alien species may have only settled part of the galaxy
5.3.3 Alien species may not live on planets
5.3.4 Alien species may isolate themselves from the outside world
5.4 Economic explanations
5.4.1 Lack of resources needed to physically spread throughout the galaxy
5.4.2 It is cheaper to transfer information than explore physically
5.5 Discovery of extraterrestrial life is too difficult
5.5.1 Humans have not listened properly
5.5.2 Humans have not listened for long enough
5.5.3 Intelligent life may be too far away
5.5.4 Intelligent life may exist hidden from view
5.6 Willingness to communicate
5.6.1 Everyone is listening but no one is transmitting
5.6.2 Communication is dangerous
5.6.3 Earth is deliberately avoided
5.6.4 Earth is deliberately isolated (planetarium hypothesis)
5.7 Alien life is already here unacknowledged

 

I'm somewhat skeptical of Floyd's tale of being abducted by aliens, while he was drinking 'shine' in the swamp. I don't believe space aliens have visited earth, nor will ever visit earth. The universe is just way too vast to have aliens stop by for coffee, and a Danish. After all the nearest star is only 20,000,000,000,000+ miles away. In that vastness, what tiny critters do is totally insignificant, and most probably nondetectable. That doesn't mean they don't exist. We've only had less than a century to be able to listen for them. It may be millennia before, we get proof, if ever.
 

feywon

Senior Member
Elon Musk is obviously not the source of some of his own public statements but rather given his wealth as a magnet for exceptional people on all matters, are from those with greater credibility on various subjects that educate and advise him.
He made the statement on podcast, so--he appropriates the assessment of others and presents as if his own thoughts? Personally i don't find that acceptableand the statement is still not an astute one, IMO.
 

feywon

Senior Member
Has anyone noticed that in recent decades extremely wealthy people have become celebrities?
It seems one sometimes two at a time will trend in news and often on social media for awhile then fade away from public eye. As with so many things these days opinions are sharply divided regarding their character and what value they are to the world. A while back Richard Branson was the media focus ,now it is Musk.
 

feywon

Senior Member
A lot of what comes out of Musk's mouth is tongue in cheek and this is an instance of one I believe.
Are you sure about that? Why?
To me attributing that explanation is kin to "Just kidding", or "Just a joke." While all three are valid explanations at times, they have become, thanks to Social media, knee jerk excuses when someone gets called out in some way.
 

Paco Dennis

Well-known Member
Location
Mid-Missouri
Has anyone noticed that in recent decades extremely wealthy people have become celebrities?
It seems one sometimes two at a time will trend in news and often on social media for awhile then fade away from public eye. As with so many things these days opinions are sharply divided regarding their character and what value they are to the world. A while back Richard Branson was the media focus ,now it is Musk.
Yes, I have noticed this. These Billionaires come into focus when they become the media's focus on some hot topic. They are eccentric in that they are the .01 %. I guess that gives them the power to push their new and innovative and often seemingly crazy grand ideas. I think we need to be very careful when supporting these ideas. Although many a scientific breakthrough has happened by happenstance or genius ahead of its' time, there have been more colossal failures than pie in the sky miracles.
 

Judycat

Well-known Member
Location
Pennsylvania
Never was a fan of Elon Musk but he can go ahead and say whatever he wants. The only thing about him that stuck with me is how he tried to horn his way into the rescue of those 12 kids and their soccer coach trapped in the Tham Luang Nang Non cave over there in Thailand. He had this submarine built that unfortunately couldn't fit in the cave then he became irate because he wouldn't be the hero.
 
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feywon

Senior Member
I think Elon Musk is brilliant!
I think many entities of all vibrations are here on Earth.
Wow! What an erroneous assumption. I stumbled across the article i posted on my browser newsfeed. Then read it to make sure he'd actually said it and it wasn't another case of a misleading headline misrepresenting the actual content.

Generally, i try to look for points of agreement with people even if i have no fondness for them. For example i agree with his low opinion of staff meetings.
 

feywon

Senior Member
Seems a rather intelligent question to me. Do you REALLY have the hubris to think we are the only intelligent entity in the universe?
Actually, i happen to be one who thinks it likely there are, have been and will be in future other forms of senient life in the universe. It is that question that implies there are not just because they are not prolificly evident to us at this point in time.
 

Blessed

Senior Member
I still say vomit. I think he inherited the illness within from his father. So many pictures of him remind me of the "joker" character in Batman. I have never even watched him on TV. All that money does not make him special IMO. There are many very rich people out there that are tennis shoe sucking scum.
 

Nathan

Well-known Member
Elon Musk not as rational a thinker as he thinks he is
As we've seen in recent times, for some being a billionaire tends to warp their own self-perception, causing them to proclaim what "geniuses" they are...as if the pursuit and love of money somehow is a mark of superior intelligence. Greed is not a great indicator of rational thought, perhaps the reverse, I'd argue.
 

feywon

Senior Member
  • Musk has behaved eccentrically from time to time. He has said he has Asperger's syndrome.
Possible, many neuro-divergent Boomers and Gen Xers went undiagnosed well into adulthood. But any slack i'd cut him due to that would be slight and not forthcoming without a doctor's statement.

Before anyone jumps to erroneous conclusions, let me be clear-- i actually value neuro-divergent people highly. My sons are Gen Xers who are still not officially diagnosed but with the newer understanding of variable signs it is fairly clear. They have functioned well in part because i held them responsible for their behaviors, while always encouraging them and listening to them talk thru their thoughts and feelings.
 


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