Went to church yesterday

Mr. Ed

New Member
Location
Cortland NY
I am Christian, although a statement by my pastor yesterday disturbs me and I don't if this line of reasoning is prominent across the Christian faith. Why do Baptist preachers emphasize guilt and remorse rather than living in oneness with God? Once forgiven, forgiveness is everlasting, therefore any remnant of sins past, present and future is automatically forgiven.

Yesterday's sermon overemphasized that Jesus became a man, a lowly, scum of the earth man. I understand God's purpose for Jesus to reunite believers into God's grace. This was God's purpose in Jesus, so why make such a such a big that Jesus became a man, when that was God's plan all along. Why must we feel remorse that Jesus, also God and also man died on the cross so we may be free from sin? It seems to this is cause to celebrate, not mourning the death of a man.
 

I am Christian, although a statement by my pastor yesterday disturbs me and I don't if this line of reasoning is prominent across the Christian faith. Why do Baptist preachers emphasize guilt and remorse rather than living in oneness with God? Once forgiven, forgiveness is everlasting, therefore any remnant of sins past, present and future is automatically forgiven.

Yesterday's sermon overemphasized that Jesus became a man, a lowly, scum of the earth man. I understand God's purpose for Jesus to reunite believers into God's grace. This was God's purpose in Jesus, so why make such a such a big that Jesus became a man, when that was God's plan all along. Why must we feel remorse that Jesus, also God and also man died on the cross so we may be free from sin? It seems to this is cause to celebrate, not mourning the death of a man.
Well, I don't know how many people are aware of it, but around 1979, Fundamentalists took over the Southern Baptist Convention, so it no longer bears any resemblance to the old Baptist teachings.
 

Mr. Ed

New Member
Location
Cortland NY
Original Poster
I grew up Southern Baptist, now American Baptist. My pastor was a missionary in Venezuela.
 

chic

SF VIP
Location
U.S.
I went to a couple of Baptist churches for awhile when I was in college, ( I was born and raised Roman Catholic,) and I was shocked at how sinful the pastors believed their congregation to be. In my brief experience, they NEVER got past it. It was just sin, sin, sin, and damnation all the time.

Maybe the Baptist church isn't for you? There are many other protestant churches who are not like that.
 

terry123

Well-known Member
Location
Houston, Tx.
Raised in a Southern Baptist church until I married and had my own family. A friend of mine invited me to her church and I have to say I have always found her Church to be the one for me. Been a member of the Episcopal Church for many years. Of course my mother thought I was going to hell.
 

Tommy

Member
Location
New Hampshire
I am Christian, although a statement by my pastor yesterday disturbs me and I don't if this line of reasoning is prominent across the Christian faith. Why do Baptist preachers emphasize guilt and remorse rather than living in oneness with God? Once forgiven, forgiveness is everlasting, therefore any remnant of sins past, present and future is automatically forgiven.

Yesterday's sermon overemphasized that Jesus became a man, a lowly, scum of the earth man. I understand God's purpose for Jesus to reunite believers into God's grace. This was God's purpose in Jesus, so why make such a such a big that Jesus became a man, when that was God's plan all along. Why must we feel remorse that Jesus, also God and also man died on the cross so we may be free from sin? It seems to this is cause to celebrate, not mourning the death of a man.
Joy! Joy and gratitude! These are the feelings that are absolutely foremost in my own life as a Christian. Knowing that I never have nor ever will live up to God's expectations and yet, in spite of this, He truly loves me, has made provision for my forgiveness, and will never fail me throughout eternity ... that is truly cause for great joy!

ED, I can relate to your reaction to your pastor's message. Not all sermons are great. Or maybe you found this message particularly convicting which can be very uncomfortable. Also, keep in mind that he wasn't speaking only to you. Others who heard him on Sunday may have been in need of hearing that particular message. Regardless, the fact that God came into our world as a man and made such a sacrifice to save those who believe from the eternal fate we deserve IS a big deal.

If you want to chat, drop me a PM.

Tommy
 

Treacle

Member
I used to go to a spiritualist church which was interesting (not agreeable to most, I suspect). But I found,by chance, a person called Joyce Meyer on TV. I listen to her broadcasts and CDs, read her books and watch her DVDs. Her application of the bible to modern life makes absolute sense, to me, and I think she would decry those that think we should go around lower our heads as sinners and be in constant mourning and deprivation given that Jesus died so we could be free from our sins. She believes we should be joyful and live life as God intended. I really don't think we are on this earth to continue to feel guilt and remorse. She would agree that we will be forgiven both past, present and future, but of course there are consequences as we do have free will. But the point is, I believe, that we are here for the joy of ourselves and others and have been provided with so much for us to enjoy and not to abuse. I remember something that she said that was almost comical but she spoke of how some pastors/preachers etc believe that wearing make up is vanity, sinful, to which she said at least you can make an effort in the way that you look, rather than scare people! I digress, but it frustrates me when words are preached to make you feel so so guilty and sinful. If God gave us the beauty and complexity of being a human being then I feel it is our duty to do the best with what we have, in all it's various forms. I was put in a home run by The Sisters of Mercy, and I can assure you they had no mercy and while they preached about sinfulness it was a case of 'Physician heal thyself' .....but that's another story. Hope I haven't drifted too much from the initial post/thread and make some sense. ☺
 
Catholics have a similar problem. Mr.X has for years raped, killed, sold tainted drugs, burned an orphanage, sodomized little girls, prayed to Satan, and otherwise was a lousy human being. 15 seconds before, he expires from well deserved bullet wounds, he turns to a priest and says, "I'm sorry". According to Catholic teachings, he's now in heaven with JC. Yet some poor guy, who has only one repented sin, years ago, rots in hell.
 

terry123

Well-known Member
Location
Houston, Tx.
I also enjoy the Unity Church. A friend and I have given each other the daily devotionals as Christmas gifts each year. We like the idea that we read the same one each day after our breakfast!. She with her tea and mine with my coffee. They apply the teachings of Christ with daily living.
 
Catholics have a similar problem. Mr.X has for years raped, killed, sold tainted drugs, burned an orphanage, sodomized little girls, prayed to Satan, and otherwise was a lousy human being. 15 seconds before, he expires from well deserved bullet wounds, he turns to a priest and says, "I'm sorry". According to Catholic teachings, he's now in heaven with JC. Yet some poor guy, who has only one repented sin, years ago, rots in hell.
But is that as bad as those that actually teach you have a sure-ticket to heaven after you've been 'saved,' no matter what you do?
 
Catholics have a similar problem. Mr.X has for years raped, killed, sold tainted drugs, burned an orphanage, sodomized little girls, prayed to Satan, and otherwise was a lousy human being. 15 seconds before, he expires from well deserved bullet wounds, he turns to a priest and says, "I'm sorry". According to Catholic teachings, he's now in heaven with JC. Yet some poor guy, who has only one repented sin, years ago, rots in hell.
[/QUOTE


I’m Catholic; not sure on what you base your assertions about Catholic doctrine.

I’ve met people from many faith-traditions who were wonderful people and lived by Christ’s example and teaching.

We all have areas in which we can grow too.
 
Catholics have a similar problem. Mr.X has for years raped, killed, sold tainted drugs, burned an orphanage, sodomized little girls, prayed to Satan, and otherwise was a lousy human being. 15 seconds before, he expires from well deserved bullet wounds, he turns to a priest and says, "I'm sorry". According to Catholic teachings, he's now in heaven with JC. Yet some poor guy, who has only one repented sin, years ago, rots in hell.
I live in a heavily Catholic area and many of my friends/acquaintances are Catholic. I've never heard the above beliefs supported by any of them; most of them believe to the contrary, in the idea that there is a place called pergatory for expiation of sins.

I think, however, that most of Christianity believes in the idea that it is never too late to come sincerely to the faith -- which is different than just saying "I'm sorry" to escape repercussions in the hereafter.
 

StarSong

Well-known Member
I stopped going to church because of the politics, the repeated hammering to bring a friend to church, the endless begging for more, more, more money - and come to more, more, more events, and the constant undercurrent of "we're saved and they're not" that runs through the service.

I miss the friends I made there but none of the rest of it.
 

MarciKS

Senior Fruitcake
Location
my apartment
I stopped going to church because of the politics, the repeated hammering to bring a friend to church, the endless begging for more, more, more money - and come to more, more, more events, and the constant undercurrent of "we're saved and they're not" that runs through the service.

I miss the friends I made there but none of the rest of it.
Also there's less sermon and too much of the other stuff. I like the online services cuz it's mostly learning. I have one I donate to off and on.
 

Mr. Ed

New Member
Location
Cortland NY
Original Poster
My belief remains that of the resurrection and salvation / forgiveness of sin. God is in me as much as I am in Him. This makes perfect sense, obviously my closeness to God is mirrored by His closeness to me. God and I co-exist as one, wherever I go whatever I think and whatever I do God does also.

Understanding the art of conviction, God communicates His will in this manner, however, I've heard my pastor relay this type message before and I believe it is the voice of past mentors and teachers who emphasized this tactful maneuver of persuasion.

Ultimately I choose what to believe and support. Spiritual mentoring, clergymen, pastors and preachers are scrutinized in all they do and say. Less than five years I attended Bible College to fulfill my life calling as a minister. I am glad God led me away into the Human Service field. I tried to be like my dad and go into ministry work as he did, my mental health declined and so did the world around. When I healthy enough to attend college, I thought it to be opportunity to God in His ministry. Thankfully, during my third semester God relieved me of my original yearning so I transferred to a secular and graduated with a human service degree.

My point is I am secure in my actions and beliefs because I am blessed by God who lives within me. I cannot intentionally sin nor do I want to. I am forgiven and God protects me from sinning. I don't have a need to read the Bible while all my fellow Christian tried to convince me it was wrong being a Christian who does not read the Bible. My thoughts on that was and still is God is in me as I am Him therefore God's grace unbinding and flows freely throughout my life.
 


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