Why Americans Die So Much Earlier Than Other Developed Nations

Pecos said:
I found this article in the The Atlantic to be very illuminating and more complex that I would have guessed. Since the time frame spans 30 years, it should not turn political:

Why Is America So Bad at Keeping People Alive? - The Atlantic

@OneEyedDiva @Pinky @SeaBreeze
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The article is good, thank you for posting it.

I find it interesting that it doesn't really mention obesity, which to me is the defining characteristic of "health" in America. Over 60 years we have become a ridiculously fat nation, with corresponding rates of cardiovascular disease, diabetes, and so many other issues.
 
Pecos said:
I found this article in the The Atlantic to be very illuminating and more complex that I would have guessed. Since the time frame spans 30 years, it should not turn political:

Why Is America So Bad at Keeping People Alive? - The Atlantic

@OneEyedDiva @Pinky @SeaBreeze
Click to expand...

Consider Capitalism to be another factor for this. The prices for health treatment and medicines in the States are ridiculously high when compared to all other countries. My wife would buy her medicine (while on insurance) in the States for US$88. The same medicine here costs US$3 (without insurance)!
 
JimBob1952 said:
The article is good, thank you for posting it.

I find it interesting that it doesn't really mention obesity, which to me is the defining characteristic of "health" in America. Over 60 years we have become a ridiculously fat nation, with corresponding rates of cardiovascular disease, diabetes, and so many other issues.
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I agree. However, speaking for some women that have reached menopause - we tend to gain weight very easy. We can smell food and gain weight...men does not have this issue. This is why I try to watch what I eat and exercise..if its just walking a little every other day.
 
CAKCy said:
Consider Capitalism to be another factor for this. The prices for health treatment and medicines in the States are ridiculously high when compared to all other countries. My wife would buy her medicine (while on insurance) in the States for US$88. The same medicine here costs US$3 (without insurance)!
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I know we have discussed this previously, but...all Western European countries (and developed Asian countries like South Korea and Japan) have capitalist economies. So does the US.

All these countries have universal healthcare, which some may consider "socialistic." However, it is clear that universal healthcare delivers better outcomes at lower costs, so maybe it's just good sense.

Universal healthcare is not funded by magic. It's funded by taxes on people and companies who have jobs created within a capitalist system.

If these countries were truly socialist (that is, if government or "the people" owned the means of production) you could expect their economies to tank. That's why the UK, the Scandinavian countries, France and many others have pulled back from nationalized industries and other elements of a real socialist economy.


One other thing: The US spends much of its wealth on defense, about twice in percentage terms what other NATO countries do. I used to support that. Now I'm starting to think it's a near-total waste. If our army can't beat the Taliban or the VC, we may as well give up on the whole concept.

My grandchildren will be speaking Chinese, but I probably won't be around to see it.
 
Ladybj said:
I agree. However, speaking for some women that have reached menopause - we tend to gain weight very easy. We can smell food and gain weight...men does not have this issue. This is why I try to watch what I eat and exercise..if its just walking a little every other day.
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I exercise a lot and I still fight to keep the pounds off. So, yes, I empathize, and I'm not condemning anyone who is not at his/her ideal weight. It's almost impossible to keep weight off once it's gained.
 
JimBob1952 said:
I exercise a lot and I still fight to keep the pounds off. So, yes, I empathize, and I'm not condemning anyone who is not at his/her ideal weight. It's almost impossible to keep weight off once it's gained.
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So far, I am doing pretty good. I've lost a few pounds...have a few more to go. I changed my diet. I eat very little fast food if any..also cut out white pasta and white rice. Changed to whole grain rice and whole grain organic spaghetti noodles when I fix spaghetti.
 
JimBob1952 said:
I know we have discussed this previously, but...all Western European countries (and developed Asian countries like South Korea and Japan) have capitalist economies. So does the US.

All these countries have universal healthcare, which some may consider "socialistic." However, it is clear that universal healthcare delivers better outcomes at lower costs, so maybe it's just good sense.

Universal healthcare is not funded by magic. It's funded by taxes on people and companies who have jobs created within a capitalist system.

If these countries were truly socialist (that is, if government or "the people" owned the means of production) you could expect their economies to tank. That's why the UK, the Scandinavian countries, France and many others have pulled back from nationalized industries and other elements of a real socialist economy.


One other thing: The US spends much of its wealth on defense, about twice in percentage terms what other NATO countries do. I used to support that. Now I'm starting to think it's a near-total waste. If our army can't beat the Taliban or the VC, we may as well give up on the whole concept.

My grandchildren will be speaking Chinese, but I probably won't be around to see it.
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I'm glad you see at least some benefits of mixing socialism with capitalism. I'm not sure about the UK but France and the Scandinavian countries still have some nationalized industries. For instance Norway Government owns and runs 71 companies. It only makes sense that in a "free-market" economy the owners of the companies will work for their profit and benefit and not the benefit of the people in general. One may claim that these companies pay taxes but the legal (and financial) system in the US offers a lot of opportunities for huge corporations and their owners to pay very small amounts to IRS compared to the people.

I agree with you on US defense spending being a near-total waste. The money could be used instead for the development of infrastructure which would benefit the American people.

I don't think that your grandchildren will be speaking Chinese :) but you should consider that one of the main reasons of China becoming such a huge economy is, capitalist countries (like the US) taking advantage of the cheap labor of China and having most of their products manufactured there instead of home. Basically Western capitalism helped China become a huge adversary.
 
CAKCy said:
Consider Capitalism to be another factor for this. The prices for health treatment and medicines in the States are ridiculously high when compared to all other countries. My wife would buy her medicine (while on insurance) in the States for US$88. The same medicine here costs US$3 (without insurance)!
Click to expand...

Our "For profit" health care system is certainly one of the biggest causes for health problems, compared to nations with a Universal care system. Many or our people cannot afford the high costs of health insurance, or the co-pays and deductibles that are part of most insurance policies, so they avoid treatment for minor issues, that eventually become serious.

We spend twice as much for health care as most other nations, and yet, when ranked, the US comes in WAAAY down the list in terms of the nations overall health....here's one that ranks the US at number 37.....

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/best-healthcare-in-the-world

That, plus so many of our people who refuse to try to maintain a healthy lifestyle.....the CDC lists Obesity as being the primary cause for about 1/3rd of the nations health problems.....insures that these numbers are unlikely to improve.
 
Don M. said:
Our "For profit" health care system is certainly one of the biggest causes for health problems, compared to nations with a Universal care system. Many or our people cannot afford the high costs of health insurance, or the co-pays and deductibles that are part of most insurance policies, so they avoid treatment for minor issues, that eventually become serious.

We spend twice as much for health care as most other nations, and yet, when ranked, the US comes in WAAAY down the list in terms of the nations overall health....here's one that ranks the US at number 37.....

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/best-healthcare-in-the-world

That, plus so many of our people who refuse to try to maintain a healthy lifestyle.....the CDC lists Obesity as being the primary cause for about 1/3rd of the nations health problems.....insures that these numbers are unlikely to improve.
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It only makes sense that a "free-market" uncontrolled economy would benefit mostly the ones having the companies. And this, unfortunately, in the US is less that 1%. The situation is a bit better in other western societies where socialism was allowed to mix in certain fields.
 
Our economy is hardly uncontrolled. U.S. regulatory bodies include the Federal Trade Commission, the Securities and Exchange Commission, the Justice Department, the Occupational Health and Safety Authority, the Interstate Commerce Commission, the Environmental Protection Authority, the Food and Drug Administration, and hundreds of other offices just at the Federal level. Every state has similar offices. In fact the complexity and duplication of regulations is a significant barrier to economic health.

And we're not exactly Uzbekistan here. Our per capita GDP is the highest among large countries; we have the world's best universities; we have unparalleled innovation and scientific expertise (a lot of it thanks to immigration). We do have a dysfunctional health care system, but if you do have access to it our doctors and research are amazing.

Wealth distribution is a chimera. The five "most equal" countries in terms of distribution of wealth are:

Ukraine (.241)
Slovenia (.256)
Norway (.259)
Slovak Republic (.261)
Czech Republic (.261)

Other than Norway, I wouldn't want to live in any of them. (I'm not blond enough to live in Norway).
 
Thanks for the article. I have saved it to my "pocket" and will read it tomorrow morning. I have been in the USA many times. What I have seen is a very stressed out urban society with a lot of bad eating habits and hell-bent with "keeping up with the Jones'. I wonder if that article will agree or disagree with my observation?
 
Packerjohn said:
Thanks for the article. I have saved it to my "pocket" and will read it tomorrow morning. I have been in the USA many times. What I have seen is a very stressed out urban society with a lot of bad eating habits and hell-bent with "keeping up with the Jones'. I wonder if that article will agree or disagree with my observation?
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Kind of rude and unpleasant to make unkind remarks about someone else's country. I have been in Canada many times and have lots of general observations to make, but I keep them to myself.
 
I think the article does a pretty good job of answering the question. A lot of it has to do with a higher death rate amongst our poor folks. We have more of them than many other developed countries, and without socialized medicine they have poorer health care here. Throw in the guns and auto accidents and you pretty much have it.

I also think there is something to what others here have said about diet, I think we are fatter than most developed countries.

I suspect fit thin middle class Americans live as long as anybody does.
 

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