Mother Of 12 House Burned Down

win231 said:
LOL. Nice try at making it sound like women just become pregnant automatically; it just happens all by itself without any action on her part. šŸ˜‚
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Nice try yourself.

I never implied that she became pregnant by herself. Do you have any idea how many abused women suffer repeated marital rape? Not that there is evidence that that happened in her case, but it does happen, more frequently than you would think. It's a great way for an abusive male to keep a female under his control.

What I DID ask was just how her having 11 children has anything at all to do with people having no compassion at all with her living space burning down and her now being homeless. That question is still open.
 

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Sunny said:
The house must have been rented by this family, and the owner probably does have insurance.

The article I found said the fire started around 4 AM in the garage. I wonder what was going on in the garage at 4 AM to start a fire? Some of those kids are teenagers. Were they all in bed at 4 AM? So far, I haven't seen one word about the cause of the fire. Could it have been arson? Racism? Teenagers fiddling around with drugs? Who knows? Lots of omissions in this story.

I think the number of children she had is kind of irrelevant. Children are not combustible; if you have more than a certain number, they don't go up in flames. Would the family have been any more deserving of help if there were, say, 6 children? Three? Two? How many is an okay number?

Knight, I'm curious: You mention that the article said she suffered abuse, not necessarily spousal abuse. Why does that make a difference?
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It doesn't make a difference, nor does the number of children.
 
Knight said:
The difference IMO is financial support. If married then the article should have indicated that fact. Financial help from a spouse might explain her ability to live in a 3 to 400 thousand home & have vehicles.

If not married then having children from one or more sex partners over the 22 years would mean to me a way to milk the system of societal support in the form of EBT & welfare. Info lacking in the article about how she was able to afford all it takes to house, feed, clothe & care for the 11 children not available to read. So yes I do suspect she was milking the system. I also suspect the system was about to end support so the fire was a convenient way to extend her benefits. I'm allowed to speculate since no real information is in the article.

Abuse was claimed but the article didn't show what kind or any medical documentation of mental or physical to prove the claim.

If abuse began early in whatever relationship she had and her moral compass was towards providing by her own efforts a good life for a child then she could at any child birth asked to have her tubes tied.

Bottom line the article presents just enough info to generate sympathy for her & especially the children. I do empathize for the children but given the amount of information available over the years to help abused women to separate themselves from that situation. I don't have much sympathy for the "mother".

I'm also speculating that many posting have similar thoughts just to polite to post as I just did.
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If you had ever worked with abused women, you would realize just how little real help there is available to actually help them safely leave, and how few actually manage it, especially those with children. Too many of them are under the threat of "if you try to leave I will find you and kill you and the children." Secondly, I don't think a newspaper article needs to show medical documentation of abuse --it's not a court of law, it's a news story.. Her medical history is nobody's business but hers. Thirdly, it is presumptuous to assume she was "milking the system."
 

Butterfly said:
Nice try yourself.

I never implied that she became pregnant by herself. Do you have any idea how many abused women suffer repeated marital rape? Not that there is evidence that that happened in her case, but it does happen, more frequently than you would think. It's a great way for an abusive male to keep a female under his control.

What I DID ask was just how her having 11 children has anything at all to do with people having no compassion at all with her living space burning down and her now being homeless. That question is still open.
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That question has been answered. And, (as you said) there is no evidence of "Marital Rape."
 
win231 said:
That question has been answered. And, (as you said) there is no evidence of "Marital Rape."
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What? ā€œEvidence?ā€ šŸ˜‚ OMG how ridiculous! Itā€™s a news story, not a police report!

To make sure I wouldnā€™t leave him, I was threatened repeatedly by my abuser variations of the following:

Heā€™d take my kids away from me
I would never see my kids again
Heā€™d make sure my kids came to hate me
My life wouldnā€™t be worth living if I left
He would fine me and make me regret it

And yes, I was also raped repeatedly in my marriage.

As Iā€™ve said here already, until you or anyone else has a thorough education in the abuse dynamic, you canā€™t possibly have a clue, no matter how much you THINK you know. šŸ˜”
 
There may be more to this story we all don't know about but story doesn't pass the smell test for me. Nice neighborhood, size of the house, what did she do to keep an income? If this is Section 8 housing??? WoW Nice. Many know how to work the Government, We have all seen it. Not saying this family has, but something here smells fishy.
win231 said:
Reminds me of those panhandlers with their small children.
They load up their kids & drive home at the end of their shifts - in a $50,000.00 SUV.
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I've seen it at Truck Stops all the time. Panhandlers with children that were suppose to be in school asking for money. They would hit one truck stop after another by driving away in a fairly new big SUV.
 
No one can work the government, unless perhaps if one is already wealthy and powerful. Would it make you feel any better, @ProTruckDriver, if this family lived in a broken down slum with the paint peeling and the pipes exposed?

As for the fire starting in the garage that in no way proves or even indicates that the garage was being used for any purpose other than the intended one. Nor does it prove the garage was occupied at the time the fire started @Sunny.
 
Pepper said:
No one can work the government
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WoW! Where have you been, look around. People on Food Stamps, Welfare, etc while wearing expensive clothing, driving expensive cars etc.... I know people that work the government out of money for themselves.
Sorry to say my parents knew how to work the government out of money for themselves before I was a teenager in the 1950's. My mother according to the government was a single mother collecting welfare. I always wondered why there was a ice cube tray on the table by the window near the door. When the Welfare worker would visit my mother, my mother would stand up the ice cube tray on the inside window sill that could be seen from outside. This was a signal to my father that the welfare worker was present and do not come in.
Pepper said:
Would it make you feel any better, @ProTruckDriver, if this family lived in a broken down slum with the paint peeling and the pipes exposed?
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I believe you missed the point. Section 8 in 400K to 500K brick homes?
Section 8 should live in a decent home not an expensive home some working people could not afford.
 
ProTruckDriver said:
There may be more to this story we all don't know about but story doesn't pass the smell test for me. Nice neighborhood, size of the house, what did she do to keep an income? If this is Section 8 housing??? WoW Nice. Many know how to work the Government, We have all seen it. Not saying this family has, but something here smells fishy.

I've seen it at Truck Stops all the time. Panhandlers with children that were suppose to be in school asking for money. They would hit one truck stop after another by driving away in a fairly new big SUV.
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Having children with them gets them more sympathy (from suckers) than trading dogs with each other.
 
StarSong said:
What evidence or verified news reports indicate this is Section 8 housing?
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It was mere speculation on my part when folks here were wondering how the mom was able to afford housing. Section 8 is an excellent program, but I can see anger & envy when one neighbor gets it and one pays full price.

We are so set against each other and that is deliberate. Divide & conquer, yessir.
 
Ronni said:
What? ā€œEvidence?ā€ šŸ˜‚ OMG how ridiculous! Itā€™s a news story, not a police report!

To make sure I wouldnā€™t leave him, I was threatened repeatedly by my abuser variations of the following:

Heā€™d take my kids away from me
I would never see my kids again
Heā€™d make sure my kids came to hate me
My life wouldnā€™t be worth living if I left
He would fine me and make me regret it

And yes, I was also raped repeatedly in my marriage.

As Iā€™ve said here already, until you or anyone else has a thorough education in the abuse dynamic, you canā€™t possibly have a clue, no matter how much you THINK you know. šŸ˜”
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People who stay with abusers often have self esteem issues & feel they don't deserve any better.
 
One thing I've kept an eye on is the GoFundMe account, where the initial goal was to reach $40,000, and at the time the account was at $31,000 (and change).

I see this morning the account is now at $59,000 (and change).

I don't know how GoFundMe works, but I'm guessing so long as there are people who are willing to part ways with their money, the account just keeps on growing and growing.

Maybe the mother can end up walking away with six-figures, or maybe she'll even get to see the account grow to a million or more. That's what I call easy money.

Sure wish GoFundMe was alive and well when dear husband and I were first starting out.
 
Most people on GoFundMe get nothing, zero, zilch. It is the stories that attract people's sympathies that can rake it in. And since no one is forced to give, it's hard to complain. Not that you are, dearest Marg!
 
Pepper said:
No one can work the government, unless perhaps if one is already wealthy and powerful. Would it make you feel any better, @ProTruckDriver, if this family lived in a broken down slum with the paint peeling and the pipes exposed?

As for the fire starting in the garage that in no way proves or even indicates that the garage was being used for any purpose other than the intended one. Nor does it prove the garage was occupied at the time the fire started @Sunny.
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True, although if the garage was just being used for the "intended purpose," how did it burst into flames all by itself at 4 AM? Just thinking out loud, I always wonder about the causes of fires. This has nothing to do with having compassion for this woman and her family. They are Black; it could have been racism. (Especially these days!)

Speaking of which, some of the replies in this thread seem to be suggesting that this woman is an evil schemer, popping out baby after baby in an effort to "milk the system." From the sketchy details given in this article, it sounds like anything but. My guess is that she did make some bad choices, got herself trapped in an abusive relationship (or series of them), may have had a husband/boyfriend who refused to let her use birth control - and yes, I once worked with a guy who boasted about that - and didn't have the resources to escape from the nightmare she was living in. Sounds like she finally did escape, and found some help.

We don't know what rent she was paying, or who provided the home she was living in. Could have been made available by a social service agency or charitable organization. Or, as some have suggested, Section 8. Yes, some Section 8 homes are in very nice neighborhoods, they are not necessarily in slums. That's probably a disappointment to those who want Biblical retribution.

The whole scenario of people who are living high on the hog while pretending to be poor has a familiar foul odor. Looking at life through the prism of narrow morality prompts predictable holier-than-thou sermonizing. She has 12 children? Well, the reason HAS to be be that she's figured out how to milk the system.

I know nothing about this case, but my own gut level reaction is that she is a deeply disturbed woman who may have been abused her whole life, she followed poor role models, and until recently didn't have any support system to help her escape. Didn't have her tubes tied? Could have been her religion, her lack of education and information, or the fact that her guy (guys?) had her terrorized.

Seems to be an awful lot of holier-than-thou humphing and sniffing on this subject.
 
Sunny said:
We don't know what rent she was paying, or who provided the home she was living in. Could have been made available by a social service agency or charitable organization. Or, as some have suggested, Section 8. Yes, some Section 8 homes are in very nice neighborhoods, they are not necessarily in slums. That's probably a disappointment to those who want Biblical retribution
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https://www.fox26houston.com/news/a...-christmas-eve-after-fire-destroys-their-home

This fire may turn out to be a blessing in disguise for the family. An extremely generous donor's heart was touched and he/she is coming to their rescue.
 
Ronni said:
People who stay with abusers have had the self-esteem they started out with completely nullified by the systematic domination, control, minimizing, isolating, and demoralizing abuse dished out to them until they feel sub-human and unworthy
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For 22 years & no mention of a husband? Granted the woman may not be the brightest bulb in the pack but at some point continuing to have children when no mention of a job or income source even the most sympathetic person has to wonder how she supports that many.

I wonder by posting what I think. I think the more kids you have with not enough income or any income this mother of 11 used the system to live well above what others that work & struggle do.
 
Knight said:
For 22 years & no mention of a husband? Granted the woman may not be the brightest bulb in the pack but at some point continuing to have children when no mention of a job or income source even the most sympathetic person has to wonder how she supports that many.

I wonder by posting what I think. I think the more kids you have with not enough income or any income this mother of 11 used the system to live well above what others that work & struggle do.
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What makes you think she didn't work or have sufficient income to support her children? I'm not saying she did or didn't, merely that there's no information either way.

jBack in the early 2000s, my mother-in-law (may she rest in peace) mentioned at least half a dozen times that a local grocery chain's CEO and TV commercial star had only one arm. It seemed so curious to me, particularly because I hadn't heard it anywhere else. I finally asked her how she knew he only had one arm and her reply (so help me, these were here exact words) was: "Well, you only ever see the one."

Although true that during the commercials he would stand at an angle so you only ever saw one arm, it nevertheless seemed a pretty big leap to me. After some sleuthing I found news photos of the man, who did indeed have two fully functioning arms.

Maybe the family in this news story was barely making it, maybe they had some government help, maybe the mom worked, maybe she received support from an ex-husband or father of her children, maybe, maybe, maybe.

Just like that grocer's second arm, six paragraph news stories don't show the full person and family whose lives were turned upside-down by a late night fire.

In my family when not all facts are present but the speculating begins, another of us will often say, "Yeah, and I'm pretty sure he's only got the one arm..." Pretty much ends the speculation.
 
Knight said:
For 22 years & no mention of a husband? Granted the woman may not be the brightest bulb in the pack but at some point continuing to have children when no mention of a job or income source even the most sympathetic person has to wonder how she supports that many.

I wonder by posting what I think. I think the more kids you have with not enough income or any income this mother of 11 used the system to live well above what others that work & struggle do.
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She may be gaming the system @Knight, it happens all the time. My vehemence was never about that, I have no way to know. My vehemence on this thread began with post #19. And continued from there. Questioning how abusive her situation was given how many children she had is ridiculous, ignorant and entirely unfounded if the poster had the most basic knowledge of the dynamics of abuse.

BECAUSE the original article mentioned abuse, my first thought, because I've lived the scenario personally, is to wonder if those kids were more the result of the abuse she was living with than any conscious intention on her part to have a bunch of kids in order to use and abuse the system to her benefit. Others are focusing on the number of kids, the cost of the house, the car she drives, lack of insurance and the rest and speculating as to how that might be.

Because of my own abuse history, I am focusing more on that aspect. It galls me more than I can easily articulate when I see an abuse victim blamed for his/her situation, because of ignorance, lack of knowledge or compassion, or outright brutality.
 
Ronni said:
People who stay with abusers have had the self-esteem they started out with completely nullified by the systematic domination, control, minimizing, isolating, and demoralizing abuse dished out to them until they feel sub-human and unworthy
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People who stay with an abuser have had their self esteem nullified long before they met their future abuser. They choose poorly because that's what they're accustomed to beforehand. The source is often their parents.
 
Knight said:
I don't think it's fake. I'd like to know what they are leaving out about how she managed to accomplish living as she does.
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Houston Housing Authority, like most other cities, has a share of fairly new homes that they let the poor live in.. and theses houses are all over the city. ...was Section 8.
HHA gets their money from the government. I have no idea how it is all spread around to the agencies, and how they get their cuts for these programs.

Vouchers are given out to the people on these Aid programs who have little or nothing.
In turn, those people are required to pay for their housing with a percentage of those vouchers they receive.
 
StarSong said:
What makes you think she didn't work or have sufficient income to support her children? I'm not saying she did or didn't, merely that there's no information either way.

jBack in the early 2000s, my mother-in-law (may she rest in peace) mentioned at least half a dozen times that a local grocery chain's CEO and TV commercial star had only one arm. It seemed so curious to me, particularly because I hadn't heard it anywhere else. I finally asked her how she knew he only had one arm and her reply (so help me, these were here exact words) was: "Well, you only ever see the one."

Although true that during the commercials he would stand at an angle so you only ever saw one arm, it nevertheless seemed a pretty big leap to me. After some sleuthing I found news photos of the man, who did indeed have two fully functioning arms.

Maybe the family in this news story was barely making it, maybe they had some government help, maybe the mom worked, maybe she received support from an ex-husband or father of her children, maybe, maybe, maybe.

Just like that grocer's second arm, six paragraph news stories don't show the full person and family whose lives were turned upside-down by a late night fire.

In my family when not all facts are present but the speculating begins, another of us will often say, "Yeah, and I'm pretty sure he's only got the one arm..." Pretty much ends the speculation.
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I've pointed out that the article is lacking in info. So IMO that opens the door for speculation. Speculation generates a lot of input that is sometimes not understood by others. Like Ronni's input about abuse.
 

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