I Believe In Fairness

Bretrick

Bretrick

Well-known Member
Location
Perth Western Australia
Just a minor rant about how society treats it's citizens
I remember when I was at a group interview for a Multi Million dollar company.
They were looking to employ 8 people. There were 12 applicants including myself.
One guy came along with a folder full of his previous applications and I am not lying when I say it had to be at least 6 inches thick.
My first thought was that I felt sorry for him. All those rejections.
We went through the interview process all seated around a large table.
Each of us was to introduce ourselves and talk a little of our lives experiences, etc.
The fellow with the folder spoke well, seemed well adjusted and had plenty to offer.
Interview over, a week later I was notified that I had been successful in gaining employment.
The guy with the large folder had not been offered a position.
A month or two down the track, once I got to know the boss well enough, I asked why the "Folder Guy" was not successful.
His reply saddened me, "If he has been rejected by so many potential employers there must be something wrong with him"
I never said what was on my mind.
To me, no one gave him a chance. How could anyone make the assumption that there must be something wrong with him if he had never been employed?
I gained a real insight into not only how society treats it's fellow citizens but also how Companies make assumptions based on first appearances.
The guy must be so disheartened, rejection after rejection. I only hope that he stopped taking that file with him to interviews and that someone gave him a chance.
That is all one asks for, a chance to join society, to be a part of what everyone else is a part of. Not to be rejected on assumptions.
Yes, some of you may have the thought in your head that, if he had gotten the job, then I might not have. True. Which in itself would not have been such a big issue for me because I had many skills to gain employment.
 

One of the funniest rejections I received was placing 4th out of 4 applicants. 2 above me turned it down and 1 wouldn’t do a piss test. I was the last man standing. I must have a look that some don’t like because this has happened multiple times.
 

Bretrick said:
One guy came along with a folder full of his previous applications and I am not lying when I say it had to be at least 6 inches thick.
My first thought was that I felt sorry for him. All those rejections.
Click to expand...
Why do you think he would have shown up with a folder full of his rejected applications? Is that customary there? I'd want to put my best foot forward and not highlight how many people had turned me down. :unsure:
 
CallMeKate said:
Why do you think he would have shown up with a folder full of his rejected applications? Is that customary there? I'd want to put my best foot forward and not highlight how many people had turned me down. :unsure:
Click to expand...
Most certainly not customary here.
He obviously had no one advising him. Sad situation.
I wonder how he got on in life.
 
Bretrick said:
Most certainly not customary here.
He obviously had no one advising him. Sad situation.
I wonder how he got on in life.
Click to expand...
Oh well then that *is* extra sad. :cry: Sometimes empathy lets me know what people are thinking or feeling, and for this one I'm thinking he may have thought showing the employer "look how serious I am about getting a job... all these applications!" would be a good thing and help him. Poor guy.
 
Another thing, many of us suffer from social anxiety issues. I’d rather die than tell 4 or 5 strangers what my weaknesses are and where I see myself in 5 years. Maybe my expression tells them what I’m thinking, “I could run circles around any of you dopes sitting at this long table!” I’ve posted about the ridiculous interview process on forums before, it’s time for a serious change.
 
hollydolly said:
I've been on the receiving end of that '' no experience , no job'' situation... if you can't get your foot in the door , how on earth can you gain experience ?
Click to expand...
What you do is a bit of flattery and a little flannel. Flattery, you write to the company explaining that you lack the experience that they seek but they are a company with a good reputation and that means a lot. Now you have their interest you employ the flannel and list what you can do. What people forget is that some of life's experiences are not gained through employment.

You may be applying for a job where you are in charge, or at least responsible, for a small group of staff. Somebody who held the rank of NCO in the military is experienced enough to qualify. A parent who has raised children and can translate that eloquently into being able to understand human nature and know how to deal with it can qualify.

It's all about using your initiative, do that and it will mark you out when decisions about who to recruit are made. As for the fellow with a file full of rejections, if he doesn't realise what it is that's putting off would be employers, then he really is his own worst enemy.

For what it's worth, in the forty years that I spent in management the applicants that I took on were the ones who had researched our company, the company that they hoped to work for. Those who turned up clean, tidy and well presented and those who were punctual and allowed those few extra minutes they might need for the toilet. In short, be knowledgeable, be prepared and be punctual, it all makes an impression.
 
Sad to say but the world has never been and never will be fair. If it was fair we wouldn't have criminals sailing around the world in super yachts, we wouldn't have wars, we wouldn't have guys like that Elan Musk screwing everybody and we wouldn't have homeless sleeping out in the streets of our cities. I don't like it but that is how it is.
 
Once a person is hired, it's hard to get rid of them.

In my estimation, a guy who shows up highlighting an unsuccessful career does not show good judgement. So why, as an employer, would I want to hire someone who just doesn't get it?

It wasn't the last job on earth. The guy has unlimited opportunities to prove himself somewhere else. He blew this interview.
 
Packerjohn said:
Sad to say but the world has never been and never will be fair. If it was fair we wouldn't have criminals sailing around the world in super yachts, we wouldn't have wars, we wouldn't have guys like that Elan Musk screwing everybody and we wouldn't have homeless sleeping out in the streets of our cities. I don't like it but that is how it is.
Click to expand...
Uh, it’s Elon Musk, not Elan. He owns 10 companies, probably providing more than a quarter million jobs. Just Tesla accounts for more than 100,000 good paying jobs. So how is Elon Musk “screwing everybody”?

https://www.thomasnet.com/insights/elon-musk-companies/
 
Last edited:
horseless carriage said:
What you do is a bit of flattery and a little flannel. Flattery, you write to the company explaining that you lack the experience that they seek but they are a company with a good reputation and that means a lot. Now you have their interest you employ the flannel and list what you can do. What people forget is that some of life's experiences are not gained through employment.

You may be applying for a job where you are in charge, or at least responsible, for a small group of staff. Somebody who held the rank of NCO in the military is experienced enough to qualify. A parent who has raised children and can translate that eloquently into being able to understand human nature and know how to deal with it can qualify.

It's all about using your initiative, do that and it will mark you out when decisions about who to recruit are made. As for the fellow with a file full of rejections, if he doesn't realise what it is that's putting off would be employers, then he really is his own worst enemy.

For what it's worth, in the forty years that I spent in management the applicants that I took on were the ones who had researched our company, the company that they hoped to work for. Those who turned up clean, tidy and well presented and those who were punctual and allowed those few extra minutes they might need for the toilet. In short, be knowledgeable, be prepared and be punctual, it all makes an impression.
Click to expand...
I have no need for any of that now ..I'm retired...

I got my jobs, eventually.. ..and I was ultimately the head of department eventually ..but really I was talking about when I was young.. how do you get a job that requires experience if no-one will let you gain the experience in the first place... madness!
 
I have seen hundreds, maybe thousands of young men come through basic training. If I had a dime for every man I thought was going to ace the PFT exam, I would be broke. Many of the men I thought who were going to fly through the exam often disappointed me. I learned early on to never have expectations of grandeur. OTOH, some of the men that I thought we would have to help along did very good without any aid. I soon learn to give each man a chance to prove himself on his own.
 
My nephew applied for a position with a large cable company that said "No experience necessary; we will train you." When the guy that did the interviews called Neph up to tell him he didn't get the job, Neph respectfully said, "Sir, if you don't mind to help me with my job searching, would you mind telling me why I didn't get the job?" the guy says, "Sure, you were too enthusiastic, acted like you wanted the job too much; that's not what we're looking for here." Well, you know darn well that wasn't the real reason; somebody else's nephew, son-in-law, daughter's boyfriend or whomever applied. Some of these companies, though.
 
My worst interview was probably with a tech company. Before the interview they gave me one of the written psychology tests. I did it, but to this day I regret doing so. Talk about red flag. I should have told them that if they relied on such things, they clearly didn't have good judgement about people. If they didn't trust themselves, how good could they be? I'm still angry I took the test.

Then, as an INTERVIEWER. I was a harsh interviewer in IT tech. I was something of an expert at the time. I knew the tech inside and out. My tech interviews were, on reflection, brutal. 3 or 4 hours was normal. I had a big whiteboard, and I'd draw schematics, flow charts, and have the candidates go through them. Since I knew the tech inside and out, I could easily catch people out. I was mean.

One day, a guy came in. I interviewed him, and to put it bluntly, he was poor. In fact, he got most all the questions wrong. He tried - but he simply wasn't up to it. In fact, he was so bad, I ended the interview bluntly. I asked, "why did you apply for this job?" After all, it was clear he wasn't qualified. He told me his story. Ex-military, can't find a job, has a wife and kids and was struggling. I loved him honesty. "I'll tell you what," I said. "I'll give you a job for 12 weeks. In that time, I'll give you access to a lab. Once the 12 weeks is over, I need you to get certified (an industry certification). If he passes, he has a full time job. If he fails, he's gone. Long story short - the guy knocked it out of the park. It's my proudest moment. He's still with the company long after I left.

Without going into details - in another situation, I once hired a guy that I had to fire after THREE days. I hired him for all the wrong reasons. I made a mistake. It was bad on my part.

I could also mention the difficulty of interviewing a guy called Assid Butt. Childish humor, but I lost it. Along with that, the obese person who couldn't fit in the interview chair. He had one butt check on the left arm of the chair, and one butt cheek on the right arm. Which made it look like he was falling out of the chair. Again, crude humor. I get it. But.......
 
CallMeKate said:
You can't leave it there, @VaughanJB ... you didn't tell us if you hired Assid Butt! 🤭
Click to expand...

Jeez..... confession time...... I'm not proud of it. But anyway, I laughed. And I mean during the interview. I had to hold a folder in my hands and use it to cover my face. It was horrific. I don't remember much more about it, because it was a big NO.

Another instance I didn't mention. I interviewed a guy. I liked him, and I was willing to offer him the job. The team he was joining was 6 strong. In these cases, I'd interview and make my decision, but I took input from the team itself. *I* made the ultimate decision though. Anyway, I liked this guy, and I sat him in the team and said, "hang out for the remainder of the day if you want." That was about three hours.

He stayed the entire time, and left when we closed. I was all for hiring him. However, the next morning, I found I had emails from 5 of the team members begging me not to hire the guy. They simply didn't like his personality. Now, I wasn't hiring for personality, but at the same time, this was a coherent team. So I could not hire the guy I really wanted, because they, in effect, over rode me. Such is life.
 
Only my first job after five years in the Navy required a resume. After that a phone call was enough. The first company I worked for appeared to have been purchased by the Mafia. I received a phone call from an ex employee offering me a Job, and I was on my way. I was there for a couple of years when my boss called me in and confided that a woman and a man, both friends, were being transferred to better jobs in another dept. I wasn‘t to tell anyone. Next day I ran into a woman transferee and congratulated her. My reasoning being that she already knew, which she did. Couple of days later she was in a meeting with some big shots who asked if anyone knew— she said I did. A VP demanded to know how I knew. My boss was required to find out. He pretended to investigate and reported back to the VP that another transferee had called his mother to share the good news and I had been hiding behind a post eaves dropping on the conversation. I found this out because his secretary was a friend. I called another friend 10 floors above and was soon working there. BTW, my former boss was Gay and later left his wife and two sons and moved in with another man —later dying of AIDS. After several other memorable experiences I retired 25 years later.
 
Last edited:
Packerjohn said:
Sad to say but the world has never been and never will be fair. If it was fair we wouldn't have criminals sailing around the world in super yachts, we wouldn't have wars, we wouldn't have guys like that Elan Musk screwing everybody and we wouldn't have homeless sleeping out in the streets of our cities. I don't like it but that is how it is.
Click to expand...
+1 Well said @Packerjohn , you always seem to hit the nail on the head. ;)
 
I was looking for a secretary when I was about 21 years old. Tons of resumes came in, interviewed some of the applicants, could not find anyone suitable. Finally, I interviewed someone whose resume ended up at the bottom of the pile because she signed the cover letter with purple ink and her signature was slanted at a 45-degree angle.

Wouldn't you know it! She was fabulous in every way and the company was fortunate to employ her. I learned an obvious lesson from that experience.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top