Colorado Muslim Who Killed 10 in Supermarket Pleads Insanity

[TabbyAnn]

This from Jihad Watch:
Colorado: Muslim who murdered ten people in supermarket pleads not guilty by reason of insanity

Colorado: Muslim who murdered ten people in supermarket pleads not guilty by reason of insanity
Nov 15, 2023 8:00 am By Robert Spencer

The cops say they can’t find a motive. Here’s a possibility they likely haven’t even considered: Al Issa (which is how he himself spells his name, not “Alissa” as the establishment media persists in calling him, apparently so as to obscure his Arabic and Islamic identity) was an Islamic jihadi. Evidence? When he was apprehended, Al Issa was wearing only shorts. “Cantu said he took all of his clothes off aside from his underwear and dropped his weapons.” Why had he taken off his clothes after shooting people?

A clue may come from 9/11 hijacker Mohamed Atta, who packed a fancy suit in his luggage on that fateful day, in anticipation, according to a letter that was also in his luggage, of “marriage” to the “women of paradise,” whom he would encounter “dressed in their most beautiful clothing.” Islam envisions a physical paradise of eternal sex with heavenly virgins.

While Atta envisioned some initial formalities necessitating the suit, Al Issa may have had a more direct approach in mind: he was likely anticipating being killed by police and showing up in paradise undressed and ready for action. Once it was clear, however, that he wasn’t going to be killed, he may have begun to feign mental illness in order to avoid prison and be confined to a much more lax mental hospital. After all, “The Prophet said, ‘War is deceit.’” (Bukhari 4.52.269)

This is not idle speculation, as it was clear from his social media accounts, which were scrubbed shortly after his attack, that Al Issa was a deeply religious Muslim who was intensely worried about “Islamophobia.” None of this, however, has been discussed at all in any open forum in connection with his case,

 

[Paladin1950]

Botttom line is, he's the lowest scum on Earth. It doesn't matter his ethnic background, his religion, or the races or religion of his innocent victims. They should all be alive. He should be rotting in hell.

 

[jimintoronto]

This from Jihad Watch:
Colorado: Muslim who murdered ten people in supermarket pleads not guilty by reason of insanity

Colorado: Muslim who murdered ten people in supermarket pleads not guilty by reason of insanity
Nov 15, 2023 8:00 am By Robert Spencer

The cops say they can’t find a motive. Here’s a possibility they likely haven’t even considered: Al Issa (which is how he himself spells his name, not “Alissa” as the establishment media persists in calling him, apparently so as to obscure his Arabic and Islamic identity) was an Islamic jihadi. Evidence? When he was apprehended, Al Issa was wearing only shorts. “Cantu said he took all of his clothes off aside from his underwear and dropped his weapons.” Why had he taken off his clothes after shooting people?

A clue may come from 9/11 hijacker Mohamed Atta, who packed a fancy suit in his luggage on that fateful day, in anticipation, according to a letter that was also in his luggage, of “marriage” to the “women of paradise,” whom he would encounter “dressed in their most beautiful clothing.” Islam envisions a physical paradise of eternal sex with heavenly virgins.

While Atta envisioned some initial formalities necessitating the suit, Al Issa may have had a more direct approach in mind: he was likely anticipating being killed by police and showing up in paradise undressed and ready for action. Once it was clear, however, that he wasn’t going to be killed, he may have begun to feign mental illness in order to avoid prison and be confined to a much more lax mental hospital. After all, “The Prophet said, ‘War is deceit.’” (Bukhari 4.52.269)

This is not idle speculation, as it was clear from his social media accounts, which were scrubbed shortly after his attack, that Al Issa was a deeply religious Muslim who was intensely worried about “Islamophobia.” None of this, however, has been discussed at all in any open forum in connection with his case,

Well done. By bringing this to light here, you are once again pointing out the actual facts that so many refuse to see. Stand by for the usual nonsense responses by the shills for Hamas who hang out here on SF. JImB.

 

[VaughanJB]

This from Jihad Watch:
Colorado: Muslim who murdered ten people in supermarket pleads not guilty by reason of insanity

Colorado: Muslim who murdered ten people in supermarket pleads not guilty by reason of insanity
Nov 15, 2023 8:00 am By Robert Spencer

The cops say they can’t find a motive. Here’s a possibility they likely haven’t even considered: Al Issa (which is how he himself spells his name, not “Alissa” as the establishment media persists in calling him, apparently so as to obscure his Arabic and Islamic identity) was an Islamic jihadi. Evidence? When he was apprehended, Al Issa was wearing only shorts. “Cantu said he took all of his clothes off aside from his underwear and dropped his weapons.” Why had he taken off his clothes after shooting people?

A clue may come from 9/11 hijacker Mohamed Atta, who packed a fancy suit in his luggage on that fateful day, in anticipation, according to a letter that was also in his luggage, of “marriage” to the “women of paradise,” whom he would encounter “dressed in their most beautiful clothing.” Islam envisions a physical paradise of eternal sex with heavenly virgins.

While Atta envisioned some initial formalities necessitating the suit, Al Issa may have had a more direct approach in mind: he was likely anticipating being killed by police and showing up in paradise undressed and ready for action. Once it was clear, however, that he wasn’t going to be killed, he may have begun to feign mental illness in order to avoid prison and be confined to a much more lax mental hospital. After all, “The Prophet said, ‘War is deceit.’” (Bukhari 4.52.269)

This is not idle speculation, as it was clear from his social media accounts, which were scrubbed shortly after his attack, that Al Issa was a deeply religious Muslim who was intensely worried about “Islamophobia.” None of this, however, has been discussed at all in any open forum in connection with his case,

Yeah, I'm struggling with this article.

When you read "Here’s a possibility they likely haven’t even considered", along with spurious links to 9/11, and an insinuation of some agenda with the spelling of his name, you know you're into the usual conspiratorial morass when proven facts, or the gaps in a case, are filled with speculation laced with an agenda of its own.

When you writing "Al Issa may have had", you should remember you are in the realm of guessing, assuming, and asserting. That's simply not good enough, and comes across as someone simply wanting to fuel xenophobic distrust.

The guy was a Muslim, he lived in fear of Islamophobia, and he did a terrible terrible thing. I'm not sure it makes any difference what he pleads, other than if he simply admitted guilt. It will need to be fully investigated and shown in court.

I don't mean to offend anyone, but articles like that in the OP are the building blocks of agenda strewn hatred campaign. You can't write what is there and end with "this is not idle speculation", it makes no sense. The article presents zero facts, is using words such as "may" and "might". That is the very definition of speculation. It's a very manipulative article that feeds a certain segment of people these days.

Whatever the causes, his outcome is assured, imo.

 

[fuzzybuddy]

I agree with VaughanJB, there's very little information to base an opinion. For his plea of insanity, Al Issa has to prove he was insane at the time of the shootings. He's under observation in a state hospital till Jan, 2024.
If you're his lawyer and your client shot and killed 10 people, the insanity plea is probably the only defense left to you.

 

[TabbyAnn]

The article, written by Robert Spencer, isn’t a court document requiring only the barest facts relating to the case. It’s a news commentary that brings in interesting information outside the case such as the 9/11 killer, and it states when things are just possibilities rather than substantiated facts. When Spencer says near the end “This is not idle speculation….” he is likely referring to the rest of his sentence which talks about Al Issa being a deeply religious Muslim and his social media accounts.

The article is a commentary not a documentary but it has more news and information than an opinion that just says it’s conspiratorial, spurious, manipulative, and xenophobic, That sounds like a rehearsed litany that itself feeds a certain segment of people these days.

 

[VaughanJB]

The article, written by Robert Spencer, isn’t a court document requiring only the barest facts relating to the case. It’s a news commentary that brings in interesting information outside the case such as the 9/11 killer, and it states when things are just possibilities rather than substantiated facts. When Spencer says near the end “This is not idle speculation….” he is likely referring to the rest of his sentence which talks about Al Issa being a deeply religious Muslim and his social media accounts.

The article is a commentary not a documentary but it has more news and information than an opinion that just says it’s conspiratorial, spurious, manipulative, and xenophobic, That sounds like a rehearsed litany that itself feeds a certain segment of people these days.

The article is pure speculation. About the only thing it mentions that is fact is that the person perpetrated a crime, and he's Muslim. The rest is, frankly, a litany of trigger words and playing to its audience. The person writing it knows exactly what they're doing. They know exactly what audience they're aiming for, and they know the effect it will have. It's a classic case of apophenia, masquerading as commentary. I think the subject deserves much, much better.

What this stuff causes is a lack of ability for anyone to truly have a discussion of the real issues. Soon, the perception of the Social Media masses is that such commentary is facts, and irrefutable. It plays to the gullible.

I'll give you an example of what I mean. This story references Social Media, which is no longer available, and it's accepted. Whereas, in a thread on this board recently, I mentioned someone was "right wing" due to what *I* had read on the person's Social Media (which also was eventually deleted), and that post was removed by the Admin and I got put on blast by some members here. But of course, in my case I supposedly had an agenda. Now, I don't want to revisit that moment at all, I'm just making a point.

Now, I looked into Robert Spencer, and all he seems to do is criticize people that are Muslim. Like, there seems to be hundreds of "commentary" posts from him, including 27 books! He comes across as a hater. So no agenda there then........ Honestly, the guy is a lunatic, an extremist. I'd list the tag words associated with his articles, but I'd expect it to be removed from the board if I did. Sheesh.

 

[Rose65]

Hang him.

 

[Jules]

Crazy and dangerous goes both way. In Canada, a young white Christian man drove his truck into a Muslim family of 5, killing 4 of them.

 

[jimintoronto]

Crazy and dangerous goes both way. In Canada, a young white Christian man drove his truck into a Muslim family of 5, killing 4 of them.

Yes and he was just convicted yesterday of four counts of First Degree Murder, and one count of Attempted Murder. Twenty five years without any chance of parole. It is obvious to me that he was acting alone, not as a part of any organized group. He is a convicted murderer. Jimb.

 

[VaughanJB]

Crazy and dangerous goes both way. In Canada, a young white Christian man drove his truck into a Muslim family of 5, killing 4 of them.

It's weird how stats get used. It's like when crimes get reported - often you'd think white people never commit crimes. Or that an immigrant did something - steal, sexual assault, sell drugs - with no reference that white people or natives do the very same thing.

These cases are bad because it's murder. The motivation is important to understand, but is secondary. To dig into Muslims over this does, indeed, brush under the carpet the crimes committed by Christians every day. This is why hate generated from such stories is ill-informed and wrong. IMO.

 

[hollydolly]

Yes and he was just convicted yesterday of four counts of First Degree Murder, and one count of Attempted Murder. Twenty five years without any chance of parole. It is obvious to me that he was acting alone, not as a part of any organized group. He is a convicted murderer. Jimb.

just 25 years..?... travesty

 

[911]

Yes and he was just convicted yesterday of four counts of First Degree Murder, and one count of Attempted Murder. Twenty five years without any chance of parole. It is obvious to me that he was acting alone, not as a part of any organized group. He is a convicted murderer. Jimb.

This man kills 4 people and gets 25 years? Or is that 25 years for each murder he committed?

 

[hollydolly]

This man kills 4 people and gets 25 years? Or is that 25 years for each murder he committed?

yes, it sounds nuts to me.. altho' in the UK 25 years would be unusual because life in our prisons generally means just 15 years... just ridiculous... it may be the same in Canada...

However the USA is very different.. I've been following the Adelson-Markel case in Tallahassee ...and the hit-man got life with no parole.. the second hit man got 19 years because he co-operated with the police.. but the girlfriend of the hit-man who wasn't at the murder, didn't kill anyone .. but was instrumental in introducing the hit-man to the person who was paying for the murder to be carried out..has been imprisoned for life with no chance of Parole.. ..plus 2 x 30 years sentences...

Now I understand if she hadn't done this.. the dead man might be alive today ( doubtful because the people wanted him dead at any cost)>.. but this woman had no previous convictions.. I think life without parole is a little harsh...

 

[jimintoronto]

This man kills 4 people and gets 25 years? Or is that 25 years for each murder he committed?

In this case 25 years is the minimum that he will serve. Parole in a multi murder case is possible, but not very probable. The sentencing Justice can decide if the sentences will be served all at once or one after the other. Canada abolished capital punishment in 1972. A recent case in New Brunswick where 3 RCMP officers were shot and killed, drew a 75 year sentence for the shooter. In effect, life in prison, as the person convicted was about 30 years of age at the time of the incident. JimB.

 

[911]

yes souds nuts to me.. altho' in the UK 25 years would be unusual because life in our prisons generally means just 15 years... just ridiculous... it may be the same in Canada...

However the USA is very different.. I've been following the Adelson-Markel case in Tallahassee ...and the hit-man got life with no parole.. the second hit man got 19 years because he co-operated with the police.. but the girlfriend of the hit-man who wasn't at the murder, didn't kill anyone .. but was instrumental in introducing the hit-man to the person who was paying for the murder to be carried out..has been imprisoned for life with no chance of Parole.. ..plus 2 x 30 years sentences...

Now I understand if she hadn't done this.. the dead man might be alive today ( doubtful because the people wanted him dead at any cost)>.. but this woman had no previous convictions.. I think life without parole is a little harsh...

Have you ever heard or read about the Pam Smart Case? The prosecutor stated she wanted her husband killed. She was having a torrid love affair with a student, so she talked him into killing her husband. The student got 3 of his friends to help him. They ambushed the husband when he came home from work. I think the young man’s name was Billy Flynn. I forget the other two names.


Billy Flynn, who was 16 y/o at the time of the murder served 25 years for killing the husband, Greg Smart. Pam Smart, who was 21 y/o was charged as the ringleader and received a sentence of life w/o parole. There have been arguments on both sides that the shooter should have received the same sentence as Pamela.

I have seen this scenario play out several times during my career. The ringleader gets the harder time than the shooter (killer). Is this fair? I realize the young man was only 16 and as psychiatrists have stated, their brain has not yet developed properly. However, that boy hesitated before firing the gun because he knew it was wrong. His friends testified to that.

I have been following this case since it happened. She had applied for a commutation hearing with the Governor. That was back in February. Her request for a commutation hearing was denied by the council selected to determine if she should get a hearing. It took them just 2 minutes and 43 seconds for them to reject her request.

 

[911]

In this case 25 years is the minimum that he will serve. Parole in a multi murder case is possible, but not very probable. The sentencing Justice can decide if the sentences will be served all at once or one after the other. Canada abolished capital punishment in 1972. A recent case in New Brunswick where 3 RCMP officers were shot and killed, drew a 75 year sentence for the shooter. In effect, life in prison, as the person convicted was about 30 years of age at the time of the incident. JimB.

That’s a good sentence if it’s w/o the chance for parole and is a hard 75 years.

 

[jimintoronto]

That’s a good sentence if it’s w/o the chance for parole and is a hard 75 years.

I was a Crown witness in a 1980 Toronto homicide case. The accused was Ralph Power. He confessed to the crime to me while he and I were drinking. I went to a Sgt with Toronto Police's intelligence unit that I knew from a previous incident. The next night I went back wired and Power retold the entire case on to tape.

He had a list of potential female targets who all lived in 2 apartment buildings on a street in downtown Toronto. He beat a 19 year old model to death with a hammer, after she let him into her suite. He was dressed as a Bell Telephone repair man.

Power was arrested by TPS homicide d's, and once he heard the tape, he decided to plead guilty. He was sentenced to 25 no parole. He had previously done 8 years of a 10 year sentence for 2 counts of attempted murder and one of arson in 1971. He is still inside in 2023, as he has been denied parole every time he has applied for it, over the years, He has stopped applying for parole now, and he seems content to live in a medium Federal prison here in Ontario. He has now served over 40 years in 2 stints. JimB.

 

[hollydolly]

I was a Crown witness in a 1980 Toronto homicide case. The accused was Ralph Power. He confessed to the crime to me while he and I were drinking. I went to a Sgt with Toronto Police's intelligence unit that I knew from a previous incident. The next night I went back wired and Power retold the entire case on to tape.

He had a list of potential female targets who all lived in 2 apartment buildings on a street in downtown Toronto. He beat a 19 year old model to death with a hammer, after she let him into her suite. He was dressed as a Bell Telephone repair man.

Power was arrested by TPS homicide d's, and once he heard the tape, he decided to plead guilty. He was sentenced to 25 no parole. He had previously done 8 years of a 10 year sentence for 2 counts of attempted murder and one of arson in 1971. He is still inside in 2023, as he has been denied parole every time he has applied for it, over the years, He has stopped applying for parole now, and he seems content to live in a medium Federal prison here in Ontario. He has now served over 40 years in 2 stints. JimB.

criminals often become institutionalised after being in prison for a long time, and if they get released then they will very often be returned to prison within a short time, because they've either committed a simialr crime ..or they've committed a minor crime, because they can't cope with a world they don't know any longer.. those people withdraw any applications for Parole

 

[jimintoronto]

criminals often become institutionalised after being in prison for a long time, and if they get released then they will very often be returned to prison within a short time, because they've either committed a simialr crime ..or they've committed a minor crime, because they can't cope with a world they don't know any longer.. those people withdraw any applications for Parole

The 2 Toronto Police homicide detectives who worked the Ralph Power case in 1980 were eventually promoted ( at different times ) to the rank of Chief of Police in Toronto. That says something about their careers as cops. Today's Toronto Police Service homicide unit has a 80 percent solve rate in the past 3 years. Both of those homicide detectives promised the family of Ralph Power's victim that they would attend every parole board hearing for as long as long as it took to keep him in prison. Dedication. Jimb.

 

[TabbyAnn]

The article is pure speculation.

I’ve listed below the facts I didn’t know until I read this article. If you have proof these are only fiction and speculation I’m open to the proof.

1. I didn’t know a Colorado Muslim killed 10 people in a supermarket.
2. I didn’t know he removed his clothes at the killing.
3. I didn’t know he was arrested in nothing but his underpants.
4. I didn’t know the 9/11 killer Muhammed Atta left his suitcase at the airport.
5. I didn’t know he left a letter in it referring to his upcoming trip to Paradise.

Again, I’m very open to any proof this is all fiction or speculation.

 

[Blaze Duskdreamer]

I hope I don't get in trouble for saying this but I hate, hate, hate the insanity defense. I don't think it should matter. If you're so freaking insane, that you can't keep yourself from being a homicidal maniac, you should get the chair. Period. Point blank.

 

[TabbyAnn]

I was a Crown witness in a 1980 Toronto homicide case. The accused was Ralph Power. He confessed to the crime to me while he and I were drinking. I went to a Sgt with Toronto Police's intelligence unit that I knew from a previous incident. The next night I went back wired and Power retold the entire case on to tape.

He had a list of potential female targets who all lived in 2 apartment buildings on a street in downtown Toronto. He beat a 19 year old model to death with a hammer, after she let him into her suite. He was dressed as a Bell Telephone repair man.

I want to thank you for reporting this to the police and being a witness and saving lives.

 

[jimintoronto]

I want to thank you for reporting this to the police and being a witness and saving lives.

Thanks. It was a lot more complicated than what I originally wrote here. The case against Ralph Power was unique in a number of ways. He freely told me about what he had done to Miss Gardiner. She was a 19 year old model, recently arrived in Toronto.

I contacted a Toronto Police SGT that I knew the next morning. SGT Don Kidder and I knew each other from a previous criminal case in 1971. The next night I was wired up with a transmitter that was broadcasting to a nearby Police surveillance van parked in an alley behind Power's apartment building. Power and myself and 2 others ( who were not involved in the murder ) spent a number of hours talking and drinking together. The van had a big reel to reel tape recorder with a 4 hour long tape capability. After a number of hours, I left. The wire was removed and I went home to try to sleep.

Once Power was arrested, the 2 Homicide Detectives recorded his confession at 52 Division. That taped confession was allowed into evidence at trial. That was the very first time that a tape recorded confession had been used to obtain a murder conviction in Canada. The murder weapon was a hammer, and it was bent because Power had hit the victim so hard that it bent the shaft of the hammer. In Power's apartment Police found his Bell Telephone uniform, and tool belt. Those items are now on display in the Toronto Police Museum at TPS head quarters in downtown Toronto. Power had a target list of 15 other young women he was stalking at the time he murdered his first victim.

JimB.

 

[jimintoronto]

I hope I don't get in trouble for saying this but I hate, hate, hate the insanity defense. I don't think it should matter. If you're so freaking insane, that you can't keep yourself from being a homicidal maniac, you should get the chair. Period. Point blank.

The way to counter an "insanity defense " is to bring evidence about what the subject did BEFORE AND AFTER the act was committed. Did they hide, did they flee, did they have a "guilty mind " ? Did they plan ahead, did they plan to escape ? Did they know what they were doing was wrong ? All of that should be brought out by the prosecution at trial. Jimb.