San Francisco's free alcohol to homeless creating a controversy

https://www.sfchronicle.com/politics/article/sf-free-alcohol-homeless-19446850.php

"San Francisco public health officials found that the city saved $1.7 million over six months from the managed alcohol program in reduced calls to emergency services, including emergency room visits and other hospital stays. In the six months after clients entered the managed alcohol program, public health officials said visits to the city’s sobering center dropped 92%, emergency room visits dropped more than 70%, and EMS calls and hospital visits were both cut in half.

"Previously, the city reported that just five residents who struggled with alcohol use disorder had cost more than $4 million in ambulance transports over a five-year period, with as many as 2,000 ambulance transports over that time.

"The San Francisco Fire Department said in a statement that the managed alcohol program has “has proven to be an incredibly impactful intervention” at reducing emergency service use for a “small but highly vulnerable population.”'

"While such programs are rare in the United States, they are more common in other countries, including Canada, Portugal and the U.K. And experts say such programs provide stability and support to homeless people who cycle from the streets to emergency rooms and jail.

"In Canada, where managed alcohol programs have operated for more than a decade, more than 40 programs are currently in place, according to the University of Victoria’s Canadian Institute for Substance Use Research.

"A 2022 study of Canada’s managed alcohol programs found that participation reduced the risk of death and resulted in fewer hospital stays for individuals with unstable housing and severe alcohol addiction."
 

StarSong said:
https://www.sfchronicle.com/politics/article/sf-free-alcohol-homeless-19446850.php

"San Francisco public health officials found that the city saved $1.7 million over six months from the managed alcohol program in reduced calls to emergency services, including emergency room visits and other hospital stays. In the six months after clients entered the managed alcohol program, public health officials said visits to the city’s sobering center dropped 92%, emergency room visits dropped more than 70%, and EMS calls and hospital visits were both cut in half.

"Previously, the city reported that just five residents who struggled with alcohol use disorder had cost more than $4 million in ambulance transports over a five-year period, with as many as 2,000 ambulance transports over that time.

"The San Francisco Fire Department said in a statement that the managed alcohol program has “has proven to be an incredibly impactful intervention” at reducing emergency service use for a “small but highly vulnerable population.”'

"While such programs are rare in the United States, they are more common in other countries, including Canada, Portugal and the U.K. And experts say such programs provide stability and support to homeless people who cycle from the streets to emergency rooms and jail.

"In Canada, where managed alcohol programs have operated for more than a decade, more than 40 programs are currently in place, according to the University of Victoria’s Canadian Institute for Substance Use Research.

"A 2022 study of Canada’s managed alcohol programs found that participation reduced the risk of death and resulted in fewer hospital stays for individuals with unstable housing and severe alcohol addiction."
Click to expand...
Thank God sanity has prevailed and backed by some research - and brought to us by a Starsong - what a joyful sound - who's first to pick the bones out of that one - any well known Senior Forum researchers sharpening their knives??
 
StarSong said:
"Previously, the city reported that just five residents who struggled with alcohol use disorder had cost more than $4 million in ambulance transports over a five-year period, with as many as 2,000 ambulance transports over that time.
Click to expand...

I'm not a smoke worshiper but holy smoke !!! 5 people, 2K ambulance transports costing $4million over a 5yr period ... incredible !!!

Ya know, I think maybe those 5 people were working the system. For what I dunno. That many transports and they aren't even dead by now or anything ... they're working it for sure. Maybe MAYBE with free booze, they'll be too drunk to call a transport. Dunno
 

the program cited was not claiming to cure anyone this is what its aim was:

"San Francisco public health officials found that the city saved $1.7 million over six months from the managed alcohol program in reduced calls to emergency services, including emergency room visits and other hospital stays. In the six months after clients entered the managed alcohol program, public health officials said visits to the city’s sobering center dropped 92%, emergency room visits dropped more than 70%, and EMS calls and hospital visits were both cut in half.

it is very very difficult often impossible to cure chronic alcoholism I have worked in the arena professionally - probably still is - haven't heard of any miraculous cures recently? this was about dealing with a city problem and freeing up essential other health services.
 
WhatInThe said:
San Francisco is offering free alcohol in the form of beer and vodka shots in an experimental effort to keep homeless off the streets, out of jail etc. One of the complaints is the program doesn't attach a rehab component to the program. It just free alcohol. Supposedly it's been tried in Canada with mixed results.

MSN

Otherwise known as enabling.
Click to expand...
You said it. What are those people thinking? I used to like visiting SF, but today you have to pass through filth just to see the sites. Another once beautiful city turned to a sidewalk dumping ground.
 
TennVet said:
You said it. What are those people thinking? I used to like visiting SF, but today you have to pass through filth just to see the sites. Another once beautiful city turned to a sidewalk dumping ground.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't call street tramps and their belongs "filth" he ain't healthy but he's still my brother

Second Street and Broadway
Sittin' in a doorway
Head held in his hands
Looked to all the world
Like he was prayin'
Foot wrapped in old rag
Bottle in a brown bag
I saw him trying to stand
Then I heard the words that he was sayin'
He said
Come on, Carrie
Carry me a little farther
Come on, Carrie
Carry me one more mile
I don't know where it's leadin' to
But I know I can make it if I lean on you
So come on, Carrie
Carry me a little
I carried you, now carry me a little
Come on, Carrie, carry me a little while
 
VintageBetter said:
They could build at least five duplexes (10 units total) for $5 mil. in S.F. That's housing for 10 small families. i.e. 40 people.

But NO - can't build low-cost housing! That would inspire people to not work! Gotta keep those rents at $2,500+ to make sure people work!

Earthquake + tsunami. Wipe the place out and rebuild. I know - that's horrible, but this is where my frustration with the madness goes - off into earthquake movies. o_O. When you're mad at California, watch this movie.
Click to expand...
So punish everybody for the misdeeds and bad decisions of a few?!! Wow...am I glad you're not God! I do agree though, that the money could be put to better use if they built housing for homeless people. Just read the other day that there's a tiny home community for the homeless in Oregon that seems to be working out well. Some residents have gone on to buy permanent homes after getting on their feet again.
 
@ oneEyedDiva

I don't see it as punishment. I see it as "God's trying to tell you something, been trying to tell you something for years, and you horrid leaders are too arrogant and blind to see or hear, so maybe an earthquake will finally get your attention."

IMO, CA is a horrible place that has no moral absolutes at all. You'll find a lot of the opposites of the 10 Commandments here and certainly the opposite of everything Jesus taught - but it's OK because, you know, just LOOK at the weather! The weather is so great! And look at all the vegan restaurants!
 
fuzzybuddy said:
First, the headline intimates that San Fransico has turned into an open bar for the homeless. Yet, the reality is in 4 years they treat a total of 65 people.
After years of chronic alcoholism, a sudden withdrawal from alcohol can cause convulsions, cardiac arrest and total system failure, liver etc.. So, if shot & a beer can deter a ride in an ambulance, and expensive ER treatment, which the tax payers are paying for; maybe it's worth a try to see what works.
And again, 65 people, it not like it's a free San Fran. Octoberfest for homeless alcoholics.
Click to expand...
Then they should be inside, in rehab. Not outside.
 
Naturally said:
All they need is Jesus ... He turned water to wine

... and in 4yrs, 65 people drank $5million worth of booze. WHOA ... must have been the good stuff

WAIT ... that was $5million A YEAR !!! ... For 65 people ?!?!?!

WAIT SOME MORE AGAIN ...

SOoooo doing the math ... 4 X $5million = $20million ... for a total of 65 people ?!?!?!

Ambulance rides and ER treatment must be astronomical in SF !!! WHOA
Click to expand...
They have mega-tons of cash.

What they lack is common sense.
 
Naturally said:
Well that's one way to control the areas of San Francisco they occupy and congregate in.
Don't think they will be handing out free booze in Presidio Heights or Seacliff.
Free booze never cured alcoholism or homelessness ... you heard it here first folks.
Click to expand...
People/drunks who really really want to stop drinking cure alcoholism. Frequently with the help of hitting a bottom where they go splat that becomes motivation.
 
San Francisco’s greatest crime is damming Yosemite National Park for their water supply. They destroyed what could have been a second Yosemite Valley. To the best of knowledge no other city and no other state has ever dammed a National Park.. Then they fought an effort to remove the dam in the 1980’s. Still they don’t deserve another earthquake. But the flower children are certainly showing their hypocrisy when then brag about being so green and progressive.

Hetch Hetchy | Hetch Hetchy Dam & Reservoir History | Yosemite.com
 
Brookswood said:
San Francisco’s greatest crime is damming Yosemite National Park for their water supply. They destroyed what could have been a second Yosemite Valley. To the best of knowledge no other city and no other state has ever dammed a National Park.. Then they fought an effort to remove the dam in the 1980’s. Still they don’t deserve another earthquake. But the flower children are certainly showing their hypocrisy when then brag about being so green and progressive.

Hetch Hetchy | Hetch Hetchy Dam & Reservoir History | Yosemite.com
Click to expand...
If that's the city's greatest crime, it's forgivable. The city needed water after the 1906 EQ, and still needed the water in the 1980s. Human "progress" throughout the world has included myriad examples of bending nature to suit our purposes.

Not saying it was a wise or good move, merely that it doesn't seem a lot worse than many others our species has made.
 
VintageBetter said:
@ oneEyedDiva

I don't see it as punishment. I see it as "God's trying to tell you something, been trying to tell you something for years, and you horrid leaders are too arrogant and blind to see or hear, so maybe an earthquake will finally get your attention."

IMO, CA is a horrible place that has no moral absolutes at all. You'll find a lot of the opposites of the 10 Commandments here and certainly the opposite of everything Jesus taught - but it's OK because, you know, just LOOK at the weather! The weather is so great! And look at all the vegan restaurants!
Click to expand...
You spend a lot of time ragging on California but have yet to divulge the magical place you live. Clearly, it's where the ten commandments and teachings of Jesus are closely followed.

By the way, many of us really like the weather in CA. And the choice of going to vegan restaurants.
 
Last edited:
StarSong said:
If that's the city's greatest crime, it's forgivable. The city needed water after the 1906 EQ, and still needed the water in the 1980s. Human "progress" throughout the world has included myriad examples of bending nature to suit our purposes.

Not saying it was a wise or good move, merely that it doesn't seem a lot worse than many others our species has made.
Click to expand...
They were offered an alternative water supply in the 1980’s. They refused it.
 
StarSong said:
I didn't know that. Do you know why?
Click to expand...
The offer to remove the O’shaunnesy dam and replace the water came from the Regan administration. I suspect politics was involved.

San Franciscans to Consider Draining Reservoir to Reveal Second Yosemite Valley | OutdoorHub

Visitors to the picturesque Yosemite National Park could soon have another thing to place on their must-see list if a controversial proposal to drain a Californian reservoir gains support from San Franciscans. Voters will decide this fall whether to formulate a plan to drain the 117-billion-gallon Hetch Hetchy Reservoir, revealing a glacially carved, granite-ring valley of waterfalls, or to leave it be. Opponents of the proposed draining highlight the reservoir’s position as the main source of drinking water for San Francisco and the attendant O’Shaughnessy Dam’s power generating capabilities.

The submerged Hetch Hetchy gorge, described as Yosemite Valley’s twin, sits only 17 miles north of the valley and is similar in geology. The O’Shaughnessy Dam was built 89 years ago in 1923 at the cost of $100 million and 68 lives, according to a timeline on HetchHetchy.org.

Environmentalists and Republican lawmakers want the dam removed and the valley restored, including Ronald Reagan’s former interior secretary Donald Hodel, who first proposed restoring the valley in 1987. Democratic San Franciscans led by Sen. Dianne Feinstein and Rep. Nancy Pelosi want to dam to remain in place to “hold onto the city’s famously pure drinking water in a drought-prone state,” as quoted by the Associated Press.

San Francisco Mayor Edwin Lee said “this is a ridiculous idea. It’s a Trojan Horse for those that wish to have our public tricked into believing we have an adequate substitute for the Hetch Hetchy Reservoir. We do not. There isn’t any.”
Click to expand...
 
dilettante said:
Keeping a problematic population docile.
Click to expand...
Hey! What a great idea. What’s next? Piles of money for
would-be bank robbers? For those vacationers thinking of a wonderful trip to that great tourist destination, as one who lived and worked in San Francisco, I would suggest thinking twice, unless your car has unbreakable windows.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top