Is it wrong for religious organizations to indoctrinate young children.

[bobcat]

I know this is a delicate subject, but it seems an important one to discuss.
Indoctrination could be generally interpreted as teaching of doctrine (The beliefs of the religious organization).
Some even have their own private schools so as to tightly control what those children learn.

I think most religious establishments feel that it is their duty, and even commanded of them to teach the children what to believe.
However, to a young formative mind, this can get so woven into thinking that there isn't much room for independent thought.
Some may view it as brainwashing, but then again, just growing up with your parents could be seen that way as well.

For some, it can take many years to come to grips with what they were taught as youth. However, for others, they may even be thankful for it.
As older adults, we can now look back on our experiences, and see them as helpful or harmful. It most likely won't change whether the practice is still allowed for children, but we can still have an opinion. Please remember, it is just your view on the subject.

 

[dilettante]

Isn't "indoctrination" in the eye of the beholder? Aren't there plenty of glass houses?

 

[Aunt Bea]

I would think that in most cases it’s the parents that initiate the religious indoctrination.

 

[fuzzybuddy]

I went to a Catholic school, taught by priests and nuns, do you really think they are not going to mention Catholicism?

 

[dilettante]

People tend to think that the cult they're in is superior to others. It's called tribalism.

 

[bobcat]

Isn't "indoctrination" in the eye of the beholder? Aren't there plenty of glass houses?

Well, I gave what I thought was the interpretation as the teaching or instruction of a doctrine.
Perhaps that can be viewed differently, but it was just my understanding of the word.

 

[bobcat]

I went to a Catholic school, taught by priests and nuns, do you really think they are not going to mention Catholicism?

I don't know who they are, but I am interested to get your feelings about it at this stage in life. Do you feel it was beneficial, detrimental, or really made no difference?
Btw, there are many religious organizations with their own schools, and even colleges. However, I suppose Catholics are the more well known because they are one of the largest.

 

[bobcat]

People tend to think that the cult they're in is superior to others. It's called tribalism.

Not sure what that has to do with this thread, perhaps I missed the point, please explain.

 

[Pepper]

In my family we were early indoctrinated against racism and it stuck.

 

[dilettante]

Not sure what that has to do with this thread, perhaps I missed the point, please explain.

Well you weren't very specific, and seemed to use a broad brush to tar people.

My point is that many religious people fear the indoctrination of children in secularism. I'm sure we could list any number of other -isms that some people oppose and consider less than wholesome.

So it is hard to see how this thread can really be addressed without calling out that which we fear and loathe.

 

[Pepper]

Think your point valid @dilettante

 

[OldFeller]

Two things you never discuss are religion and politics because both are hot topics that incite heated debate. That has always been the golden rule.

 

[Lara]

Is it wrong for religious organizations to indoctrinate young children.

Synonyms for the word "indoctrinate" are Brainwash, Propagandize, and Proselytize.
So of course that's wrong for children and adults as well.

Option 1:
But if you mean Sunday Schools for an hour a week that share with children through songs and stories laced with love like, "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you", "Love one another", peace, joy, patience, kindness, self control, gratitude, gentleness, goodness, hope, reaching out to help others (Galatians 5:22)....then I see nothing wrong with that. The children leave with joy, love, goodness in their hearts...

Option 2:
Versus a child (not all but dare I say many) sitting at home at the same time staring at the boob-tube or playing violent video games using "guns", or watching inappropriate movies, or fighting on social media, or other "stuff" on the internet, and leave with wanting to bully and harbor hatred, disrespect their parents and other authority, and hurt others.

 

[Pepper]

Too simplistic @Lara, it's not a black or white either or. Your examples are extreme.

 

[horseless carriage]

People tend to think that the cult they're in is superior to others. It's called tribalism.

"Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people."
So says Karl Marx, he who was born of Jewish parents but received a Christian baptism at the age of six. While Marx had no Jewish education and embraced atheism, he continues to be identified as a Jew, and his Jewish ancestry influenced his thinking. Marx’s writings about Jews and Judaism, which identify Judaism with capitalism, are nearly all hostile.

Marx's aim was the elimination of currency and private property, public control of means of production and, ideally, a classless, stateless society, in other words, communism. How is this different from, so to speak, a large-scale application of tribalism?

 

[Nathan]

Children need guidance and a framework with which to grow their mind and social sense. Religion is designed to help mold children and integrate them into the world that they will be a part of. All societies throughout recorded history have used religion or some kind of belief system to shape and guide their young, it's what naked apes do.

Whether it is "right or wrong" to indoctrinate children religiously....I have to ask, what would be an alternative?

 

[bobcat]

Well you weren't very specific, and seemed to use a broad brush to tar people.

My point is that many religious people fear the indoctrination of children in secularism. I'm sure we could list any number of other -isms that some people oppose and consider less than wholesome.

So it is hard to see how this thread can really be addressed without calling out that which we fear and loathe.

Well, to clarify, I did not at all intend to tar anyone or label them as a cult.
I can see both sides of this issue, and I think I understand their perspective, and your point.
I guess I was just wondering what other people's feelings were about the issue. Does it hinder intellectual development in any way, or is it pretty benign.

 

[dilettante]

Marx's aim was the elimination of currency and private property, public control of means of production and, ideally, a classless, stateless society, in other words, communism. How is this different from, so to speak, a large-scale application of tribalism?

I'm not aware of any significant examples of Marxism succeeding through indoctrination. In all of the cases I can think of it was dictated to the people through authoritarianism and the majority of the people chafed under its austerity and bleakness and tried escaping it.

 

[fuzzybuddy]

I don't know who they are, but I am interested to get your feelings about it at this stage in life. Do you feel it was beneficial, detrimental, or really made no difference?
Btw, there are many religious organizations with their own schools, and even colleges. However, I suppose Catholics are the more well known because they are one of the largest.

For most of us religion is an option. As an Atheist, no amount of Catholic "indoctrination" had an effect on me. Religion is a personal issue, so how one reacts to "indoctrination" can be both detrimental or beneficial.

 

[Alizerine]

I know this is a delicate subject, but it seems an important one to discuss.
Indoctrination could be generally interpreted as teaching of doctrine (The beliefs of the religious organization).
Some even have their own private schools so as to tightly control what those children learn.

I think most religious establishments feel that it is their duty, and even commanded of them to teach the children what to believe.
However, to a young formative mind, this can get so woven into thinking that there isn't much room for independent thought.
Some may view it as brainwashing, but then again, just growing up with your parents could be seen that way as well.

For some, it can take many years to come to grips with what they were taught as youth. However, for others, they may even be thankful for it.
As older adults, we can now look back on our experiences, and see them as helpful or harmful. It most likely won't change whether the practice is still allowed for children, but we can still have an opinion. Please remember, it is just your view on the subject.

I think the "love thy neighbor" and "do unto others" aspect of Sunday school was beneficial. Fortunately we had none of the scary stuff. Mostly we colored pictures of biblical scenes.

 

[bobcat]

Children need guidance and a framework with which to grow their mind and social sense. Religion is designed to help mold children and integrate them into the world that they will be a part of. All societies throughout recorded history have used religion or some kind of belief system to shape and guide their young, it's what naked apes do.

Whether it is "right or wrong" to indoctrinate children religiously....I have to ask, what would be an alternative?

Thanks Nathan. I guess possibly providing the basic education of standard subjects, and then when they begin to show curiosity about such things, and develop their own critical thinking skills, then introduce them to religious beliefs. Just a thought.

 

[Nathan]

Thanks Nathan. I guess possibly providing the basic education of standard subjects, and then when they begin to show curiosity about such things, and develop their own critical thinking skills, then introduce them to religious beliefs. Just a thought.

That would be an ideal approach, most definitely. Looking at the past societies tend to indoctrinate their children with a mix of their cultural norms and religious beliefs, which are mostly integrated as one set of teachings.

 

[Pepper]

Whether it is "right or wrong" to indoctrinate children religiously....I have to ask, what would be an alternative?

An alternative would be how we raised our son. No religion, be a good human. "Human Being, Planet Earth" is what we told him was his "designation." I did teach him about the Bible, explaining to him that he needed to know this common reference or be ignorant of it. Being ignorant is not an alternative, ever.

 

[Murrmurr]

Synonyms for the word "indoctrinate" are Brainwash, Propagandize, and Proselytize.
So of course that's wrong for children and adults as well.

Option 1:
But if you mean Sunday Schools for an hour a week that share with children through songs and stories laced with love like, "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you", "Love one another", peace, joy, patience, kindness, self control, gratitude, gentleness, goodness, hope, reaching out to help others (Galatians 5:22)....then I see nothing wrong with that. The children leave with joy, love, goodness in their hearts...

Option 2:
Versus a child (not all but dare I say most) sitting at home at the same time staring at the boob-tube or playing violent video games using "guns", or watching inappropriate movies, or fighting on social media, or other "stuff" on the internet, and leave with wanting to bully and harbor hatred, disrespect their parents and other authority, and hurt others.

Option 3:

A child is taken to a church that teaches them there's God and Jesus, Satan and demons, and a heaven and a hell, and that God is everywhere and so is Satan, and they're watching the child's every move, especially Satan, because while God only wants the child's heart, Satan wants to drag the child's soul to hell where s/he will live in a fire and be tortured forever, and the only thing that will save his/her soul is praying to God every day, singing hymns on Sunday, minding his/her parents, and achieving the un-achievable: perfect piety and the complete absence of flaws.

That is nightmare fuel. Believe me, I've been there. I was afraid I'd burn in hell if I sneezed wrong until I was like 10.

 

[Murrmurr]

An alternative would be how we raised our son. No religion, be a good human. "Human Being, Planet Earth" is what we told him was his "designation." I did teach him about the Bible, explaining to him that he needed to know this common reference or be ignorant of it. Being ignorant is not an alternative, ever.

Same here. We were a non-secular family, but I read the Bible to my kids, and explained that there were various religions, and some people believed and some didn't. And I left it up to them.

My oldest son actually got baptized into the Mormon church and stuck with it for 4 or 5 years. All 3 are atheists and they're very good people. Law-abiding, kind to others, and loving partners and parents.