At least 13 dead, and many missing in TX flooding

seadoug said:
The weather service's San Angelo office, which is responsible for some of the areas hit hardest by Friday's flooding, was missing a senior hydrologist, staff forecaster and meteorologist in charge, according to Tom Fahy, the legislative director for the National Weather Service Employees Organization.
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Is that credible and verifiable information?
 
Rakaia said:
Is that credible and verifiable information?
Click to expand...
AI Overview

The claim that the National Weather Service's San Angelo office was missing key personnel during the recent Texas flooding, including a senior hydrologist, a staff forecaster, and the meteorologist in charge, is factually accurate. Tom Fahy, the legislative director for the National Weather Service Employees Organization, confirmed these staffing shortages. The San Angelo office is responsible for some of the areas hardest hit by the flooding.

Here's a more detailed breakdown:
  • Missing Personnel:
    The San Angelo office was indeed missing a senior hydrologist, a staff forecaster, and the meteorologist in charge.

  • Tom Fahy's Statement:
    Fahy, who represents the NWS employees, stated that these key positions were vacant, according to NBC News and Newsweek.

  • Impact of Staffing Shortages:
    The lack of a senior hydrologist is particularly concerning, as hydrologists play a critical role in flood forecasting and response.

  • Warnings Issued:
    While the San Angelo office did issue warnings about the flooding, the staffing shortages raise concerns about the capacity of the office to handle future events and the potential impact of such situations on public safety.

 
Rakaia said:
Is that credible and verifiable information?
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There is a name, a position in a relevant organization w the means to have knowledge of the staffing and the NYT and others have published the info. I would place it in the fact category myself, (eff AI.)

NWS says staffing was adequate to the job of producing and publicizing many warnings, and they did do that. Most would probably never guess that many public servants go above and well beyond there duties to get the job done, particularly when life is on the line.

However there was a community services coordinator position unfilled (last person took a retirement package) in the area from the NWS that MAY have affected the outcome. Warnings were issued, but apparently few took notice and even less took prompt action. Why?

Based on nothing I would say full staffing or not the NWS did their job well enough that it gave those responsible on the ground as much warning as possible. At some point public safety officials and those private parties (summer camps, etc) are responsible to ensure the safety of people in the area.

Like all accidents and disasters it takes a multitude of circumstances to come together to produce a tragedy of this magnitude. I would not count on quick, truthful analysis from TX based on their pathetic inquiry into Uvalde where they authorities gave themselves years to cover their ass.

For those looking to place blame or deflect blame from NWS, I'd say give it a month or 2 before coming to a conclusion.
 
Ask yourselves, "What good does it do to post info that has a political inference, even if it is partially true?" You may post one fact, but do you know all the facts.? No, no you don't so please show some respect by keeping this thread about the families that lost love ones and the extreme damage done to those communities.

Whether the San Angelo office had a senior hydrologist on staff or not is irrelevant. A correct forecast was made as early as possible by that office and having a dozen senior forecasters on staff would have made no difference. NONE!

The info, pointing fingers, was politically motivated. All the facts were not presented. It was never mentioned that the senior weather personnel that was cut, was by the persons choice. One I know for sure was over 70 and had several months a year off due to many years of service. He took the generous buy out earlier this year and that took a load off a strained budget, leaving more funds for state of the art equipment. In weather forecasting, state of the art equipment is more important than multiple personnel.

Discussing such a tragedy, seeking blame, for the sole purpose of pushing your political agenda off as fact, is disgusting to me. The inference that those girls wouldn't have died if the current folks in charge of government hadn't cut positions, is just sickening. Why not praise the ones that made an accurate and timely forecast? How many hundreds of lives they saved. Yes, the water came faster and quicker than anyone or technology could predict. That is not the fault of the San Angelo office that did an exemplary job. Those folks deserve praise, not criticism.
 
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There certainly is a lot of finger pointing at the "finger pointers," going on here.

I find it perfectly natural to look for reasons after a tragedy like this -- that's how we try to prevent the same thing from happening again.

Neither do I see anything political in the information posted here. Manpower shortages have been a problem for several years now, in every area from fast-food service to hospital staff. We aren't looking to blame but to understand why.

My heart is aching for the parents of those lost children, it's horrible enough to lose your child, but to know they suffered and died and you weren't there with them is just crushing.
 
This is an interesting YouTube video of the water arriving beyond Kerr County (if I read the description correctly). I think the missing person part of the title is misleading but I'm glad it was there because I probably wouldn't have watched it otherwise.

I felt a little anxious about how many people were still driving across the bridge until forced not to at the end.

 
All who were tragicially killed

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A view inside of a cabin at Camp Mystic, the site of where at least 20 girls went missing after flash flooding




Many of the girls in the cabins were unable to flee as the water rose 20 feet in just 90 minutes when the catastrophic floods hit on Friday morning.


Heartbreaking photo shows entire cabin of girls who were washed away
 
From Holly's link, "The co-owner of the Christian girls camp, Dick Eastland, reportedly died while trying to save the girls in the Twins and Bubble Inn cabins." He was found inside his SUV with three of the girls.

Awww. He was a true hero and it looks like he almost managed to save three girls.

An 18 year-old girl counselor died with ten of those littlest (8-10 years old) girls. What a nightmare for her to have been the "adult" in charge during something so horrible.

May they all rest in perfect peace.
 
Hopefully there will be a collective will to understand the no doubt many factors that influenced how this played out. We cannot ever be hundred percent safe…but we can figure out ways to improve our odds. Years ago there was a flash flood in Antelope Canyon, a slot canyon much photographed and visited. Without googling it I no longer remember how many died. This was a horrific accident and terrible for everybody. Now they have a mandatory warning system in place when it is raining within the watershed. The rain that killed all those people came from many miles away. Now there is a layer of additional safety that did not exist before.
 
HoneyNut said:
This is an interesting YouTube video of the water arriving beyond Kerr County (if I read the description correctly). I think the missing person part of the title is misleading but I'm glad it was there because I probably wouldn't have watched it otherwise.

I felt a little anxious about how many people were still driving across the bridge until forced not to at the end.

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This was amazing, I watched the whole 37 minutes with my heart pounding. I didn't know water could move that fast.
 
I saw on the news today that residents of the Hill Country have "flood warning fatigue". Also, that none of the campers were allowed cell phones, which may have issued warning alerts. :(

There will be many lessons learned from this. It is just tragic that so many people had to die for them to be learned.
 
Deya said:
Ask yourselves, "What good does it do to post info that has a political inference, even if it is partially true?" You may post one fact, but do you know all the facts.? No, no you don't so please show some respect by keeping this thread about the families that lost love ones and the extreme damage done to those communities.

Whether the San Angelo office had a senior hydrologist on staff or not is irrelevant. A correct forecast was made as early as possible by that office and having a dozen senior forecasters on staff would have made no difference. NONE!

The info, pointing fingers, was politically motivated. All the facts were not presented. It was never mentioned that the senior weather personnel that was cut, was by the persons choice. One I know for sure was over 70 and had several months a year off due to many years of service. He took the generous buy out earlier this year and that took a load off a strained budget, leaving more funds for state of the art equipment. In weather forecasting, state of the art equipment is more important than multiple personnel.

Discussing such a tragedy, seeking blame, for the sole purpose of pushing your political agenda off as fact, is disgusting to me. The inference that those girls wouldn't have died if the current folks in charge of government hadn't cut positions, is just sickening. Why not praise the ones that made an accurate and timely forecast? How many hundreds of lives they saved. Yes, the water came faster and quicker than anyone or technology could predict. That is not the fault of the San Angelo office that did an exemplary job. Those folks deserve praise, not criticism.
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Yet here you are dragging it into this thread.
 
The news about this flooding and the number of lives lost seems like it changes everyday and not for the better.

I really feel bad for the people who have lost loved ones, whether they are missing or known to be deceased.
 
My relatives in Hill Country that have been helping, report they and most helping are fatigued both physically and emotionally. I am watching the Texas Lieutenant governor talk. He was at the camp with members of the families of still missing girls, yesterday. He gives a detailed account of what happened. It is beyond what I could have imagined.

An interesting point, made by one of the camp leaders that survived, was no one is talking about the 500 girls that were saved. He talks about how it was almost a miracle that they saved anyone from that camp. Lifelong residents of that area, say the force and suddenness of the storm was beyond what anyone could imagine.

Death toll is at 104 this morning and on foot searches still continue. The amount of debris to be moved, in hopes of finding more bodies, is just unreal. Girls camp death toll at 27. Heartbreaking.
 

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