Dear God, another school shooting?

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A question. Have any of the US school tragedies happened in private schools? Have any of the shooters come from private schools?

If NO to both those questions it brings up a concern about our education system as being part of the problem.

Yes, I do agree with many of Travelers comments. More folks should be asking questions about our life styles and ways of teaching moderation and concern about their and others safety and well being.
 

Next question. So What? What difference does it make.?

Why am I bothering to respond to you is the better question. For heaven's sake, you ASKED how we knew he used a shotgun and I answered. Lesson learned; I won't bother with you again.
 

Why am I bothering to respond to you is the better question. For heaven's sake, you ASKED how we knew he used a shotgun and I answered. Lesson learned; I won't bother with you again.

That would be nice. Someone else or you asked if it was legal. You didn't answer. What difference does it make you don't answer either. You just go on a rant.
 
Bob. It's the gun culture.

East access to guns.

Other countries don't have that easy access.

You our always want to leave the gun out of the equation and blame everything but.

It is not the guns, as some keep insisting. We will never find any realistic solution till folks are willing to open their minds to reality. The US is not the only country to have weapons at hand. And the Swiss are much more with open and available weapons than any other place.

Here is a link to a web site about the Swiss modern ways of being prepared.

http://www.migflug.com/jetflights/hidden-swiss-air-force.html

Enjoy and hopefully learn a few things. I do believe the US has a lot to learn from the Swiss. But first we have to park our high and might US attitudes and take a look at other nations and see what they might be doing differently.
 
Also let's not forget Israel. It is difficult to imagine a nation with more guns/capita than Israel. Yet we do not see Jewish teens killing other Jewish teens.

I've said this before and perhaps I need to say it again. To use the analogy of gun powder: charcoal +sulfur + potassium + a spark = an explosion. Many ingredients necessary. The same applies to teens who go postal. Many factors. Not just one.

Men have been killing each other ever since the 1st ape-man grabbed rock and bashed his neighbors head in. Rocks, clubs, spears, swords, if a man wants to kill he is going to kill. Guns are not necessary.

It is only a matter of time before a teen discovers that he can kill many, many more fellow students with a car. All he has to do is wait until school is let out and he can kill dozens more than with a gun. I don't know why that is so hard for some people to understand.
 
I'm not sure if actual trials of cyber bullies would ever be needed. It is quite possible that the humiliation of arrest and the discomfort of spending a few days in Juvenile Hall might be enough. Also, we would confiscate their cell phones. Doing the latter, would be easy because the cell is "evidence" of the crime.

The idea here is to get the cyber bully back in school ASAP where he/she could spread the word of arrest, Juvie, and lost cell phone.
My reading of the juvenile mind, is that to lose a cell phone would be just horrible.

Moreover, the hassle and embarrassment for the parents might be sufficient to get them seriously involved.

If none of the above worked we could up the ante, and add community service as punishment, say, for example, working to help the homeless.

Y'know, I can't argue with this line of thinking...sort of a two prong attack (not forgetting who along with why)
 
It just makes my heart ache to hear this so much anymore. Someone has got to come up with an answer.

I don't know..even metal detectors at the doors.

Why don't we take some of the money spent on other countries and spend it here. Protect our own.
 
This is the 229th school shooting since the Columbine Massacre. A reminder of how little our leaders have done to solve the problem.

I hope 'leaders' includes parents who fail to teach committing criminal act is not the answer or end to the their child's problems. Or "the system" that lets a student wear a fashion statement completely opposite the weather and quite easy of concealing anything from weapons, bombs and/or drugs. All they had to do was make the kid open his coat. I remember during the crack dealer wars of the 1980s winter attire in warm climates was not uncommon mostly to hide an uzi style weapon.

Or even better the leader called an individual's brain tells them that are not to commit murderous criminal acts. If people keep on looking for "the" answer on a whole host of issues not much will get done because while those still waiting or relying on a third party to fix their problems stuff will still happen.
 
Amen to "what-in-the" for his rational thinking.

We must be cautious when looking at the numbers of school shootings. For in that long list, much is included that should not be on that list. When a man walks into a school, and shoots his ex-lover (adult vs. adult) and then walks away, that is included on the list. When a gang member shoots a rival gang member that is on the list. And, when a firearm is accidentally discharged, by a guard, that, also is on the list.

Columbine happened 20 years ago, If we multiply 20 times 52 weeks we have a total of 1040 weeks. When we divide that number by 229 schools shootings. we end up with an average of 4.541 shootings /week. All of us know full well, or we should be aware, that is a grossly inflated number.

I, in no way, suggest that school massacres are not a very serious matter. Nor do I suggest that our leaders should not be more active in stopping them, but the responsibility falls mainly upon the rank and file of citizenry. Above all, the responsibility falls upon the parents, who, too often, turn a blind eye to the activities of their own children.

It is oft said, among a certain faction of our society, that "You can have it all". Wrong ! No one can have "it all". Not man, not woman.
The best the we can hope for is a small piece of many things. In days of old , the man went to work, and left the raising of the family to the woman. That seemed to work fine. BUT, the working man missed out on the day-to-day lives of his children. He did not "have it all".

One definition of "multi-tasking" is to foul up many things at the same time. Raising a family is a full-time job. Our mothers, with rare exception, devoted their lives to her family. When that changed, society changed, and school shootings are part of the consequences.
 
I hope 'leaders' includes parents who fail to teach committing criminal act is not the answer or end to the their child's problems. Or "the system" that lets a student wear a fashion statement completely opposite the weather and quite easy of concealing anything from weapons, bombs and/or drugs. All they had to do was make the kid open his coat. I remember during the crack dealer wars of the 1980s winter attire in warm climates was not uncommon mostly to hide an uzi style weapon.

Or even better the leader called an individual's brain tells them that are not to commit murderous criminal acts. If people keep on looking for "the" answer on a whole host of issues not much will get done because while those still waiting or relying on a third party to fix their problems stuff will still happen.

Turning school authorities into the Fashion Police is both highly impractical and legally a non-starter. Parents would be up in arms (as well they should be) if teachers started asking various students to open their coats, remove their sweatshirts, etc., under the guise of a weapons inspection. Can you even picture the uproar and potential lawsuits?

Public schools in most states have extreme legal difficulty enforcing nominal modesty guidelines, never mind "I think this is inappropriate for today's weather" dress codes. I know whereof I speak on this matter.

This kid happened to choose a warm day to start shooting - but it could just as easily have been the last day before winter break when a long coat wouldn't have aroused suspicion. Or he could have started shooting while still in the parking lot.

Until we figure out how to turn around kids whose brains are not telling them how to behave, many of us believe it is a good idea to stop arming them to the teeth.
 
Also let's not forget Israel. It is difficult to imagine a nation with more guns/capita than Israel. Yet we do not see Jewish teens killing other Jewish teens.

Sorry, Traveler, but Israelis have very few guns per capita. The US has between 79 -101 guns per 100 private parties. Israel has 3.5- 7.3, depending on what statistics you believe. Either using the most conservative US and most liberal Israeli stats, the US has more than 10X the number of guns in private hands than does Israel.

https://www.cnn.com/2017/10/03/americas/us-gun-statistics/index.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

[FONT=&quot]Israeli security experts also say that gun violence is rare in Israel because privately held guns are so rare. According to data from Israel’s Ministry of Internal Security, which registers all gun owners, about 260,000 Israelis, or about 3.5 percent of the population, have permits to carry firearms. Half of the permit holders are private citizens, and the others work for security firms.
[/FONT]
https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/02/22/why-school-shootings-are-rare-in-israel-where-guns-are-common/
 
No one will ever convince me that guns are the problem. Most of us were raised in homes where guns were commonplace and yet managed to not massacre anyone. The core of the problem is societal and the disintegration of family. People are so angry... just look at all the road rage now. It's terrifying to drive anywhere.

I don't know how we will fix this mess.
 
"Columbine happened 20 years ago, If we multiply 20 times 52 weeks we have a total of 1040 weeks. When we divide that number by 229 schools shootings. we end up with an average of 4.541 shootings /week. All of us know full well, or we should be aware, that is a grossly inflated number. I, in no way, suggest that school massacres are not a very serious matter."

The Columbine Massacre happened 19 years ago. With 40 weeks in a school year times 19 years, the total is 760 weeks. 229 school shootings divided by 760 weeks is not 4.541 shootings/per week. Can you see the error?

There were some school shootings that didn't have any victims. Just as there were other potential school shootings that law enforcement, parents, and others thwarted. The problem has been going on for too long. There will be another 229 school shootings during some of our lifetimes unless some people act.

I sub in three schools. I read about one killer who went into their high school to kill a teacher. When he found out that his teacher wasn't in school, he murdered the sub! Another sub was killed in Texas just last week. Every one of you live in a state that has had a recent school shooting. Today's kids, if they are not looking down at their cellphones, are looking over their shoulders to see who is behind them. As one teenager from Santa Fe, TX put it:

"I always felt that eventually it was going to happen here too."
 
"Columbine happened 20 years ago, If we multiply 20 times 52 weeks we have a total of 1040 weeks. When we divide that number by 229 schools shootings. we end up with an average of 4.541 shootings /week. All of us know full well, or we should be aware, that is a grossly inflated number. I, in no way, suggest that school massacres are not a very serious matter."

The Columbine Massacre happened 19 years ago. With 40 weeks in a school year times 19 years, the total is 760 weeks. 229 school shootings divided by 760 weeks is not 4.541 shootings/per week. Can you see the error?


I see your point, but the list, on the www, includes colleges, which are naturally open year round. So, I also included colleges (52 weeks).

However, I should have been more specific.
 
Sorry, Traveler, but Israelis have very few guns per capita. The US has between 79 -101 guns per 100 private parties. Israel has 3.5- 7.3, depending on what statistics you believe. Either using the most conservative US and most liberal Israeli stats, the US has more than 10X the number of guns in private hands than does Israel.

https://www.cnn.com/2017/10/03/americas/us-gun-statistics/index.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

Israeli security experts also say that gun violence is rare in Israel because privately held guns are so rare. According to data from Israel’s Ministry of Internal Security, which registers all gun owners, about 260,000 Israelis, or about 3.5 percent of the population, have permits to carry firearms. Half of the permit holders are private citizens, and the others work for security firms.
https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/02/22/why-school-shootings-are-rare-in-israel-where-guns-are-common/

Of course the Israeli's have quite a few guns /capita. THAT WAS MY POINT. ! Also, you did not include all of the guns in the hands of the military personnel, who take their guns home with them, where kids could steal them and kill. If that was in their minds. Which it is not.

No one will ever convince me that guns are the problem. Most of us were raised in homes where guns were commonplace and yet managed to not massacre anyone. The core of the problem is societal and the disintegration of family. People are so angry... just look at all the road rage now. It's terrifying to drive anywhere.

I don't know how we will fix this mess.

I totally agree. The problem is our society is sliding down the slippery slope. Expect it to continue.

"No great civilization is ever destroyed from without, until it has destroyed its self from within"
Will Durant, the 20th century's pre-eminent historian
 
229 shootings divided by 760 weeks equals .301 shootings per week. Or about one every three weeks, and not four or five per week. That was what I was getting at.
 
229 shootings divided by 760 weeks equals .301 shootings per week. Or about one every three weeks, and not four or five per week. That was what I was getting at.


Tony, you're correct. I must be getting senile. I can't even do basic math anymore. hahaha :confused:
 

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