Bringing back cursive writing

Sunkist said:
It stinks. Not learning fast enough has nothing to do with 'discipline.'

And if you're referring to military boot camp, there's a difference- the individuals are adults.
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That's fine, it is no more. Today you are the boss. And we have high-school grads who can't even figure 10%. We'll soon be speaking Chinese though.
 

Cursive writing was never among my better attributes. My handwriting permanently morphed to a print/cursive hybrid when I hit high school, and I wasn't alone in that. Why high school? Because upper grade teacher cared more about legibility and less about whether all the letters were connected.

Truth be told though, I type 99% of the time these days and can type much faster than I handwrite. Plus instant editing.

DH's handwriting is far better than mine - always has been. His is also a print/cursive hybrid. Our children, born in the 1980s, can all write in cursive but they either print or hybrid.
 
Sunkist said:
It didn't occur to me til recently that when I send cards to my grandkids I'm not entirely sure if they can read what I wrote!
My oldest grandkid was already doing email before his 6th birthday! 😮
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Yeah, it was cool.. I received a thank-you note (email), for the birthday gift I'd sent to him. 😁💕
 

My mother had the most beautiful handwriting, as did my grandmother who had only a fourth-grade education but, as she described it, it was quite comprehensive.
For proper cursive we need to clear our desks. Both elbows need to rest on the desk, and we need to completely relax our writing arm.
As an exercise, draw large loops of lowercase E's and O's etc gradually making them smaller and smaller, remembering to keep your arm relaxed and moving along smoothly as needed. Practice makes perfect.
 
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Imogene said:
FINALLY, someone has some sense in their head. IMHO. It was on the Today show this morning that a serious attempt is being made at bringing back cursive writing.

“Cursive writing is making a significant comeback in U.S. schools, with over 20 states now mandating its teaching, driven by benefits like improved cognitive skills (memory, reading, fine motor), a connection to historical documents, and the practical need for signing legal papers. Proponents argue it enhances brain development, while critics note already crowded curricula, but recent laws in states like New Jersey and California emphasize its role as a foundational skill for literacy and essential life tasks, even amidst the digital age. “
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IMO, the most important thing mentioned is "historical documents." If you can't read the original US Constitution or Bill of Rights, for example, then you're forced to accept a translation from anyone or any thing.
 
gruntlabor said:
That's fine, it is no more. Today you are the boss. And we have high-school grads who can't even figure 10%. We'll soon be speaking Chinese though.
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There have always been HS graduates who couldn't figure percentages, even easy ones. Everyone has strengths and weaknesses. This isn't a "kids today" or "education today" issue.

I'm good at math, spelling and grammar, but hopeless at spatial relations, can't imagine what something will look like from a different angle, have zero sense of direction, have difficulty staying focused on a task, and struggle daily with disorganization. That's just for starters.

Fortunately, I worked in a field where most of my shortcomings didn't matter. I married someone whose strengths are my weaknesses and whose weaknesses are my strengths. We shore each other up.

Corporal punishment teaches children to fear and hate adults and to resolve conflicts with physical force. Bullies are created, not born — most evolved from having been bullied themselves.
 
StarSong said:
There have always been HS graduates who couldn't figure percentages, even easy ones. Everyone has strengths and weaknesses. This isn't a "kids today" or "education today" issue.

I'm good at math, spelling and grammar, but hopeless at spatial relations, can't imagine what something will look like from a different angle, have zero sense of direction, have difficulty staying focused on a task, and struggle daily with disorganization. That's just for starters.

Fortunately, I worked in a field where most of my shortcomings didn't matter. I married someone whose strengths are my weaknesses and whose weaknesses are my strengths. We shore each other up.

Corporal punishment teaches children to fear and hate adults and to resolve conflicts with physical force. Bullies are created, not born — most evolved from having been bullied themselves.
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Yes, but allowing a disruptive student to waste the time of the entire class doesn't work either. Telling his parents won't help, because he rules over them as well as the class.
If we're not a little smarter than the children, then we deserve what we get.
 
gruntlabor said:
Yes, but allowing a disruptive student to waste the time of the entire class doesn't work either. Telling his parents won't help, because he rules over them as well as the class.
If we're not a little smarter than the children, then we deserve what we get.
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Agreed. That said, there are other ways to manage chronically disruptive students, including determining the root causes and addressing those.

For instance, ADD and ADHD are extremely challenging for the people with it (hand raised) their parents (hand up again) and even their grandparents (one more time).

It has to be very challenging for teachers, but humiliating or smacking students with neurological issue does nothing to change their behavior or address the underlying problem.

Medication was a life-changing godsend for my sons and now my GD (DD's child).
 
StarSong said:
Agreed. That said, there are other ways to manage chronically disruptive students, including determining the root causes and addressing those.

For instance, ADD and ADHD are extremely challenging for the people with it (hand raised) their parents (hand up again) and even their grandparents (one more time).

It has to be very challenging for teachers, but humiliating or smacking students with neurological issue does nothing to change their behavior or address the underlying problem.

Medication was a life-changing godsend for my sons and now my GD (DD's child).
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I do not believe in mind-altering medications for children to make the parent's /teacher's job easier.
I don't know why we're discussing this, it's irrelevant. You guys have had it all your own way for so many years now, no-one even remembers anything else. No point in beating a dead horse.
 
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gruntlabor said:
I do not believe in mind-altering medications for children to make the parent's /teacher's job easier.
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You think that's the reason? I'm sorry you believe that. Trust me, medication is LAST option parents and teachers explore. The very, very, very last. We try everything else, including scolding, grounding, isolating, removing privileges, counseling, you-name-it.

The clock is always ticking though - parents know they need to either figure this out for their kids or damn them and yourselves to a very difficult life.

Here's a small window into my experience:

In my first consultation with the psychiatrist, I expressed my fears that my (then 11 year old) sons would become drug addicts if I agreed to medication. He told me the opposite was true - statistics prove children with ADD/ADHD who are medicated are far less likely to become substance abusers than those who aren't. In simple terms, those whose issues are managed with medications don't search out drugs to"self-medicate" for their issues.

After less than a week on the meds, my son's 5th grade teacher (who I kept apprised throughout) called me over and said, "Wow. Just Wow. What a difference!" My son had previously been so distractible and disruptive that she'd butted his desk to hers in an effort to keep control over him and the classroom. By the end of that first week she permitted him to move his desk near those of his friends.

Our sons have thanked us numerous times for getting them diagnosed and medicated. They saw friends struggle with ADHD that their parents tried to punish or pray away, with poor short and long term results.

As that psychiatrist predicted, both boys took themselves off the meds during college years and have remained off it (they're now 40). ADD/ADHD meds aren't pleasant - they can cause headaches, nausea and other side effects. At one point one of my sons was dealing with a daily headache, so I suggested we stop the meds. He BEGGED me to leave him on the medication because his life was so much better on it than off it. The psychiatrist tried a different drug and that turned out to have fewer side effects.

Both boys learned coping skills while on the meds and continue to use those skills to this day. Both are university graduates, one with an advanced degree.

They each earn well over $150K+ per year, are in stable marriages and have wide circles of friends. Neither smokes, uses illicit drugs or abuses alcohol.

We didn't drug our kids any more than people who give insulin to their diabetic children do. We gave them survival medication. My only regret is not exploring that option sooner.
 
gruntlabor said:
I do not believe in mind-altering medications for children to make the parent's /teacher's job easier.
I don't know why we're discussing this, it's irrelevant. You guys have had it all your own way for so many years now, no-one even remembers anything else. No point in beating a dead horse.
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First, I (and clearly others here, too) DO remember 'the way it was'.. and in some states, STILL IS.

While I believe medications can SOMETIMES be a good solution, it's certainly a h*ll of a lot better than beating children with boards over behaviors/actions/etc. that in many instances they have no control over.
 
Sunkist said:
First, I (and clearly others here, too) DO remember 'the way it was'.. and in some states, STILL IS.

While I believe medications can SOMETIMES be a good solution, it's certainly a h*ll of a lot better than beating children with boards over behaviors/actions/etc. that in many instances they have no control over.
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I would rather have the board than the dementia that may result from these horrific drugs

EDIT: 'Beating children with boards' is exaggeration sent into orbit
 
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StarSong said:
You think that's the reason? I'm sorry you believe that. Trust me, medication is LAST option parents and teachers explore. The very, very, very last. We try everything else, including scolding, grounding, isolating, removing privileges, counseling, you-name-it.

The clock is always ticking though - parents know they need to either figure this out for their kids or damn them and yourselves to a very difficult life.

Here's a small window into my experience:

In my first consultation with the psychiatrist, I expressed my fears that my (then 11 year old) sons would become drug addicts if I agreed to medication. He told me the opposite was true - statistics prove children with ADD/ADHD who are medicated are far less likely to become substance abusers than those who aren't. In simple terms, those whose issues are managed with medications don't search out drugs to"self-medicate" for their issues.

After less than a week on the meds, my son's 5th grade teacher (who I kept apprised throughout) called me over and said, "Wow. Just Wow. What a difference!" My son had previously been so distractible and disruptive that she'd butted his desk to hers in an effort to keep control over him and the classroom. By the end of that first week she permitted him to move his desk near those of his friends.

Our sons have thanked us numerous times for getting them diagnosed and medicated. They saw friends struggle with ADHD that their parents tried to punish or pray away, with poor short and long term results.

As that psychiatrist predicted, both boys took themselves off the meds during college years and have remained off it (they're now 40). ADD/ADHD meds aren't pleasant - they can cause headaches, nausea and other side effects. At one point one of my sons was dealing with a daily headache, so I suggested we stop the meds. He BEGGED me to leave him on the medication because his life was so much better on it than off it. The psychiatrist tried a different drug and that turned out to have fewer side effects.

Both boys learned coping skills while on the meds and continue to use those skills to this day. Both are university graduates, one with an advanced degree.

They each earn well over $150K+ per year, are in stable marriages and have wide circles of friends. Neither smokes, uses illicit drugs or abuses alcohol.

We didn't drug our kids any more than people who give insulin to their diabetic children do. We gave them survival medication. My only regret is not exploring that option sooner.
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I am glad your sons are well.
 
Sunkist said:
First, I (and clearly others here, too) DO remember 'the way it was'.. and in some states, STILL IS.

While I believe medications can SOMETIMES be a good solution, it's certainly a h*ll of a lot better than beating children with boards over behaviors/actions/etc. that in many instances they have no control over.
Click to expand...
And it occurred to me something I read long ago which, unfortunately, still seems accurate- adults are permitted to make mistakes.. but children cannot!! 😠
 
gruntlabor said:
I would rather have the board than the dementia that may result from these horrific drugs

EDIT: 'Beating children with boards' is exaggeration sent into orbit
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Ritalin has been prescribed for over 100 years. There's no evidence that it or other ADD/ADHD drugs cause or increase dementia risk. If you know of any, please provide a link.

At my elementary school in New York, misbehaving children were swatted with a wooden paddle. In front of the class. Physically painful and emotionally humiliating.
 
StarSong said:
Ritalin has been prescribed for over 100 years. There's no evidence that it or other ADD/ADHD drugs cause or increase dementia risk. If you know of any, please provide a link.

At my elementary school in New York, misbehaving children were swatted with a wooden paddle. In front of the class. Physically painful and emotionally humiliating.
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Ritalin (methylphenidate) side effects range from common issues like insomnia, loss of appetite, headaches, stomach pain, dry mouth, and irritability to more serious ones, including increased blood pressure/heart rate, anxiety, vision changes, circulation problems (numb/cold fingers/toes), slowed growth in kids, and rare but severe issues like seizures or prolonged erections, requiring immediate medical attention. --Gemini
 
gruntlabor said:
Ritalin (methylphenidate) side effects range from common issues like insomnia, loss of appetite, headaches, stomach pain, dry mouth, and irritability to more serious ones, including increased blood pressure/heart rate, anxiety, vision changes, circulation problems (numb/cold fingers/toes), slowed growth in kids, and rare but severe issues like seizures or prolonged erections, requiring immediate medical attention. --Gemini
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I mean, other than AI. This says nothing about dementia, BTW.

My children were monitored closely. Other than headaches neither had serious issues, and that was resolved by a change in meds. They're both average height and neither wears glasses. No seizures.
 

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