Charges Against Alex Baldwin Being Dropped
- Thread starter Ruthanne
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Bella
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And I'm sure you were also instructed to never point a gun, loaded or not, at anyone.
The Four Rules Of Firearms Safety > https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/the-four-rules-of-gun-safety-for-beginners-and-everyone-else/
Excerpts from the article -
"Col. Jeff Cooper furthered the cause of general gun safety by distilling and popularizing the four rules of safe gun handling. The purpose was to minimize accidents, otherwise known as negligent discharges (every accidental discharge is a negligent discharge).
There are other variations on the theme, but Cooper’s four rules of gun safety are easy to remember and communicate. You have to break at least two of them for something really bad to happen. Learn and follow the four rules and you’ll eliminate the possibility of creating a dangerous, perhaps even deadly negligent discharge."
"1. Every gun is always loaded.
Safety demands that you treat all firearms as loaded — at least until you personally and accurately verify that a gun is unloaded. Always safety check a firearm before and after handling. Even then, you should continue to treat it as a loaded gun.2. Never point a gun at anything you aren’t willing to destroy.
If you let your muzzle cover anything like an innocent person or an inoffensive inedible animal, bad things can happen. If you keep your gun pointed in a safe direction — away from innocent life — it can’t (which is why some think this should be the first rule).
Even if you somehow have a negligent discharge — which will only occur if you violate other safety rules — at least it won’t harm man or beast. What’s a safe direction? Anyplace a bullet can’t harm an innocent life should you fire the gun.
3. Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on your target.
No matter how many media reports to the contrary, guns don’t “go off.”
Yes, there are older guns that aren’t “drop-safe” or guns that are mechanically defective (an extremely rare occurrence), but in virtually every instance in modern times, someone or something has to pull the trigger for a gun to fire.
If you keep your finger (and other things) off of the trigger, you won’t create a negligent discharge.
4. Be sure of your target and what’s beyond it.
Again, bullets can penetrate barriers and travel great distances before they lose lethal force. You can aim at one thing and hit another, with disastrous results. You are responsible for every bullet that leaves your barrel.Always make sure there’s no one down range, or someone about to go downrange. How far down range should you consider? As far as the eye can see — and then some."
So much for "prop" guns.
Jon-Erik Hexum (November 5, 1957 – October 18, 1984) American actor. During a delay in filming on the set of "Cover Up", he began playing with a gun and died as a result of an accidental self-inflicted blank cartridge gunshot to the head.
Bella
Alligatorob
SF VIP
Looks like the armorer, Hannah Gutierrez-Reed, will be facing more charges, she's already charged with manslaughter.
From what I know it appears justified.
Still believe Baldwin needs to be held legally responsible for his reckless gun handling and violation of industry safety guidelines. Maybe not as bad as Gutierrez-Reed, but still far from innocent. Her guilt does nothing to justify his behavior...
Rust shooting: Prosecutors charge armourer with evidence tampering
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-65993965
From what I know it appears justified.
Still believe Baldwin needs to be held legally responsible for his reckless gun handling and violation of industry safety guidelines. Maybe not as bad as Gutierrez-Reed, but still far from innocent. Her guilt does nothing to justify his behavior...
Rust shooting: Prosecutors charge armourer with evidence tampering
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-65993965
JustDave
Well-known Member
Yeah, that's a dicey one. I know one of the first things you do when you pick up a gun is to check if it's loaded, and even if it's empty, don't point it at anyone. But in this situation, there is supposed to be an expert professional that does that for you. I think Baldwin still bears some responsibility, but the details suggest he was placing his trust in someone that was payed to make sure the gun was safe to handle. He may have been busy playing his lines through in his head before the scene. Yes, he made a mistake, but under the circumstances....?
I know other's will disagree with a certainty that I don't have. And even some will claim to know the exact term of what his prison sentence should have been. I'm happy that it's not my responsibility to pass final judgement on him.
I was also surprised when I first heard about the incident that Hollywood would use a real gun instead of a harmless prop.
Alligatorob
SF VIP
Movie industry guidelines are clear, and he violated them when he pointed the gun at her. The armorer could not relieve him of that responsibility. Two key parts of the Screen Actors Guild guidelines:
Treat all weapons as though they are loaded and/or ready to use. Do not play
with weapons and never point one at anyone, including yourself.
and
AS AN ACTOR, YOU ARE ULTIMATELY RESPONSIBLE FOR YOUR OWN SAFETY AND THE SAFETY Of YOUR FELLOW CAST MEMBERS.
https://www.sagaftra.org/files/safety_bulletins_amptp_part_1_9_3_0.pdf
Had Baldwin followed those guidelines the tragedy would never have happened. In addition to being published guidelines they are just basic gun safety... and common sense.
JustDave
Well-known Member
All that is true, and he deserves a censure from the Screen Actors Guild, which I'm guessing he got, maybe not written and filed in his permanent records. If he hasn't heard by now that he shouldn't have done that, I wouldn't believe it.
But industry guidelines, basic gun safety, and common sense are not legal statute. In a court of law, people are charged with crimes, and accidents, even stupid accidents are seldom treated as crimes. Gun accidents happen every year. People are expected to know better, and they should, but accidents still happen, and most are not treated as crimes. Dick Cheney shot his hunting partner, who survived of course, but there was no trial, because there isn't a specific law that says a Vice President should not shoot anyone. It's not like he got away with something that average citizen would not. Movie actors should not be treated differently either.
Sometimes people are tried for manslaughter, as the unintentional outcome of accidents, but we don't hear about cases like that very often. I think it must be rare.
Alligatorob
SF VIP
No, but they can be used when interpreting and applying laws.
New Mexico has a law against negligent use of a deadly weapon, one part of which defines it as "endangering the safety of another by handling or using a firearm or other deadly weapon in a negligent manner". https://law.justia.com/codes/new-mexico/2018/chapter-30/article-7/section-30-7-4/
New Mexico also has a law against involuntary manslaughter, a killing that was unintentional, resulting from either recklessness or criminal negligence. https://www.findlaw.com/state/new-m...untary manslaughter are,up to $5,000 in fines.
Seems to me he could be charged under either or both of these laws.
You make a good point, and maybe we should more often charge people in these cases, if reckless or negligent behavior was involved. I don't know much about the specifics of the Cheney shooting, but maybe he should have been charged, in fact I think probably he should have been.
JustDave
Well-known Member
If I had control over Baldwin's Civil Trial, the family of the woman Baldwin shot would would receive compensation. I would encourage them to settle out of court first. If either party was not satisfied, I would award a settlement.
Alligatorob
SF VIP
I think that is what happened. Alec Baldwin reaches settlement with Halyna Hutchins’ family https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/05/entertainment/alec-baldwin-rust-settlement/index.html
There are no criminal charges at this point.
Alligatorob
SF VIP
No trial, it was settled out of court. I am sure Baldwin paid handsomely to keep it as quiet as possible.
JustDave
Well-known Member
Well, most of the "quiet" got out of the bag, I think.
OneEyedDiva
SF VIP
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- New Jersey
I don't think he should have been charged in the first place. And I am not a Baldwin fan. Here are questions I still have about this case:
~How did live ammo get into the gun? Why was it even on set? Who brought in the ammo in the first place?
~Why would those responsible for making sure the gun was safe tell him it was when it wasn't?
~Aren't those the people who should bear responsibility?
~Did someone intend to kill Hutchins (or the other person who was shot) then frame Baldwin?
And
~Do other actors second guess their armorers when they are told the guns are safe to shoot? Should they have to? They are paid to act, the armorers and producers are paid to make sure things go smoothly on set and are safe.
I stopped following the case but from what I saw on the last reports I watched, at first they discounted his story that he didn't pull the trigger, then later it was found the gun malfunctioned, so it's possible he was telling the truth.
~How did live ammo get into the gun? Why was it even on set? Who brought in the ammo in the first place?
~Why would those responsible for making sure the gun was safe tell him it was when it wasn't?
~Aren't those the people who should bear responsibility?
~Did someone intend to kill Hutchins (or the other person who was shot) then frame Baldwin?
And
~Do other actors second guess their armorers when they are told the guns are safe to shoot? Should they have to? They are paid to act, the armorers and producers are paid to make sure things go smoothly on set and are safe.
I stopped following the case but from what I saw on the last reports I watched, at first they discounted his story that he didn't pull the trigger, then later it was found the gun malfunctioned, so it's possible he was telling the truth.
Alligatorob
SF VIP
Don't know what other actors do, but they should. Basic gun safety, movie industry guidelines, and I believe New Mexico law requires it... No one should ever assume a gun is not loaded, and no one should ever point a gun at someone else. Others may be guilty of worse crimes in this thing, but that should not release Baldwin from his responsibilities.
I hope the investigation answers your questions, they are important.
StarSong
Awkward is my Superpower
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- Los Angeles Suburbs
There's evidence proving he might not have actually pulled the trigger and the gun could indeed have fired without him squeezing the trigger. I read about it a short time ago.
https://news.yahoo.com/gun-fatal-set-rust-shooting-175948622.html
The special prosecutors' decision to drop the charges against Alec Baldwin over the fatal on-set "Rust" shooting was made, at least in part, because investigators found the gun that fired to be mechanically improper, a source familiar with the matter told ABC News.
Baldwin, 65, had been charged with two counts of involuntary manslaughter after fatally shooting cinematographer Halyna Hutchins, 42, on the New Mexico set of the Western in October 2021. The actor was practicing a cross-draw when the gun fired, striking the cinematographer.
Investigators effectively conducted an autopsy of the Colt .45 revolver and found that there were worn joints and that the trigger control was not functioning properly, according to the source.
It became evident to prosecutors the gun could fire without pressure on the trigger, according to the source.
Alligatorob
SF VIP
Thanks, and while I think that could make some difference in what he should be charged with it doesn't let him off all together.
He should never have pointed that gun at another person. It's just basic gun safety and it's what the movie industry guidelines tell you.