Church, Religion and Control

SeniorBen said:
Nope, a simple search reveals that Protestants are the largest Christian denomination in the U.S. In fact, there are about twice as many Protestants as Catholics.
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JimBob is right, it's in how you define "denomination." If you break down denomination to mean "type of Christian" with everything from Baptist, Methodist, Church of God, Catholic and so on, Catholics will be the largest group.

However, I don't agree that Evangelicals are the only ones who actually believe, go to church, etc. I'm an Episcopalian and the people in my congregation, actually believe, go to church and act on their beliefs. They are also mainly liberal. We have women bishops, welcome gays, and are probably pro-choice, but I don't know for sure because it's never come up in church. For that I am truly grateful.

Abortion is just one issue among hundreds. I don't understand why it gets quite so much violent reaction on both sides or why it would be assumed that all Christians were pro-life or all non-religious were pro-choice.
 

Della said:
...I don't understand why it gets quite so much violent reaction on both sides or why it would be assumed that all Christians were pro-life or all non-religious were pro-choice.
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Because those against whatever may use narrow arguments valid within narrow situations, overly generalized across their broad opposition. In other words, they decline describing whatever in even unbiased ways, leaving out info. Within their small minded thinking, they are afraid by being more honest their position won't be as effective without realizing how we more savvy readily pick up on such biases. Very common in this era with manipulative news media. With Christian atheist issues, that most often arises when atheists act, think, and believe all Christians are like young earth Creationists especially acting politically as they do.
 
Della said:
I don't understand why it gets quite so much violent reaction on both sides or why it would be assumed that all Christians were pro-life or all non-religious were pro-choice.
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Where has there been violence? Passion, heated maybe but no violence except if you mean the murders of abortion clinic people, including doctors.
 

That's what I mean, as well as the emotional definition of violent as harsh, brutal, etc. There's hatred on both sides of this issue.
 
Pepper said:
Where has there been violence? Passion, heated maybe but no violence except if you mean the murders of abortion clinic people, including doctors.
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There was one about a week ago in Wisconsin...

The headquarters of Wisconsin Family Action in Madison was attacked in the early hours of Sunday, with a molotov cocktail thrown through a window, starting a small fire, and graffiti spray-painted on an exterior wall. Nobody was hurt.

In a statement reported on Tuesday by the Lincoln Journal Star, which said it was unable to verify the group’s authenticity, Jane’s Revenge said it launched the attack because of the organization’s anti-abortion stance, and demanded that similar institutions across the US disband or face “increasingly extreme tactics”.

“Wisconsin is the first flashpoint, but we are all over the US, and we will issue no further warnings,” the statement said, citing the violence of anti-choice groups who “bomb [abortion] clinics and assassinate doctors with impunity” as justification.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...son-attack-wisconsin-pro-choice-janes-revenge
 
Della said:
JimBob is right, it's in how you define "denomination." If you break down denomination to mean "type of Christian" with everything from Baptist, Methodist, Church of God, Catholic and so on, Catholics will be the largest group.

However, I don't agree that Evangelicals are the only ones who actually believe, go to church, etc. I'm an Episcopalian and the people in my congregation, actually believe, go to church and act on their beliefs. They are also mainly liberal. We have women bishops, welcome gays, and are probably pro-choice, but I don't know for sure because it's never come up in church. For that I am truly grateful.

Abortion is just one issue among hundreds. I don't understand why it gets quite so much violent reaction on both sides or why it would be assumed that all Christians were pro-life or all non-religious were pro-choice.
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I was just quoting a Gallop poll.

Protestants continue to make up the largest religious group in America, totaling 49% of U.S. adults interviewed as part of Gallup's Daily tracking in 2017. Catholics are the next-largest group, at 23% of the population, with Mormons accounting for about 2%.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/224642/2017-update-americans-religion.aspx

But Wikipedia (from two sources) claims that "The Catholic Church, also known as the Roman Catholic Church, is the largest Christian church, with 1.3 billion baptised Catholics worldwide as of 2019."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church

So it's the difference between a religious group and a church?

One day, I'll research it a little more.
 
"The headquarters of Wisconsin Family Action in Madison was attacked in the early hours of Sunday, with "a molotov cocktail thrown through a window, starting a small fire, and graffiti spray-painted on an exterior wall. Nobody was hurt.

In a statement reported on Tuesday by the Lincoln Journal Star, which said it was unable to verify the group’s authenticity, Jane’s Revenge said it launched the attack because of the organization’s anti-abortion stance, and demanded that similar institutions across the US disband or face “increasingly extreme tactics”.

“Wisconsin is the first flashpoint, but we are all over the US, and we will issue no further warnings,” the statement said, citing the violence of anti-choice groups who “bomb [abortion] clinics and assassinate doctors with impunity” as justification.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...son-attack-wisconsin-pro-choice-janes-revenge"


While I don't approve of their tactics, it's understandable. It is in response to the (sometimes lethal) attacks on Health Care Providers and abortion clinics and their staff. They finally got just plain fed up with the violence against them
 
This is from Wisconsin Family Action... the group that was torched about a week ago. It's from their website.

“This is fundamentally because we hold a Christian worldview and actually live it out when I work with legislators or when we talk in churches or when we take our message to the media. That is the core issue."

So there it is again. They're trying to legislate their religious views, which is a blatant violation of the 1st Amendment.
 
SeniorBen said:
This is from Wisconsin Family Action... the group that was torched about a week ago. It's from their website.

“This is fundamentally because we hold a Christian worldview and actually live it out when I work with legislators or when we talk in churches or when we take our message to the media. That is the core issue."

So there it is again. They're trying to legislate their religious views, which is a blatant violation of the 1st Amendment.
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"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The First Amendment prohibits government from interfering with religion. Conversely, it does not prohibit any group from trying to influence the government; in fact, just the opposite. Those are the people's guaranteed First Amendment rights, not a blatant violation.
 
Mr. Ed said:
Were there adults in your life who used religion to control or persuade you to behave? Religions have a set rules and regulations to live by, unfortunately the church and religious followers create their own list of sins but not listed in the Bible.

I was naïve as kid trusting parental guidance without questioning authority. Did someone lead you down a path to learn the path was not as you expected? Personally, I don't understand the massive effect how religion was so readily accepted and put into practice? There are so many loose ends regarding religion that people accept without question. Religion intimidates people but provides the chosen ones the designated communications of God. The Priests, Clergy, Preachers etc are prestigious in standing which the common people turn to for guidance. People listen and obey religious leaders as if they have supernatural powers, the truth is they are ordinary people they are not special.

I attended Bible College and studied to become a Prison Chaplain. My former classmates were ordinary kids, no great wisdom or special powers, Society makes us into something we crave to be but that is only show biz and you know how much we like to make believe?
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I had a solid Catholic upbringing. Catholic schools from grade 1 thru 12, taught by nuns, went to confession on Saturday so I could receive Holy Communion on Sunday morning. I found great comfort, community and stability in all of it because my home life was chaotic.

As a kid, yes, I was intimidated by the nuns who taught me and by the priests who heard my confession, who gave me Communion and who performed my marriage ceremony. But ultimately my relationship with God is direct, not through any human. I decided that a long time ago.

My faith is very private. I truly believe in God, Jesus Christ, the Holy Spirit, the Blessed Mother and the angels and saints. I freely believe in these things without intimidation from anyone.

And I respect all faiths. I am fascinated by them and I have a good circle of friends who are Jewish, Muslim, Baptist, Evangelical, agnostic and former Catholics. We never impart our beliefs on one another.
 
spectratg said:
That is certainly a novel idea. I don't believe that I have ever heard that before.
The universe is 13.7 years old, started with the Big Bang. So in your interpretation, does that mean that God started at the same time as the Big Bang? Are God and the universe synonymous? Most religions that I am familiar with believe that God had no beginning and created the universe and time because?
I'm curious about your thoughts on this.
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Obviously all of these discussion types are speculation but if you consider all things, including God by design has purpose, meaning, and identifiable by whatever purpose that might intel. It is hard for me to grasp the notion God has no beginning or end only because my mind cannot fathom something or object without beginning or ending. God is bigger than my limited knowledge of God can comprehend.

I stand by the notion all things, including God has purpose. To exist there must purpose and/or reason otherwise it cannot exist. Perhaps God exists on the basis of human need, prayer, worship, comfort, hope, morality and discourse. Sometimes humans need someone or something to blame for hardships in life, making God an easy target and inaccessible by conventional means of communication. The perfect scapegoat.

People don't realize the authority they possess though prayer. Prayer works for everyone Christian believers and nonbelievers alike. It doesn't matter if you pray to God, Mother Earth or the Great Gig in the Sky if you are sincere and believe in the power of your prayers God, the world, Mother Earth and the Great Gig in the Sky will respond in ways you cannot imagine.
 
I grew up with mixed views on religions in general. It was Catholic based to begin with but later on in life I've found things I didn't like. So, I've changed my opinions.

Yesterday, I found a nun at my local mall. We gave money to her charity. Saying thank you but then she took my hand in hers and added, "tell me dear whats upsetting you so much today?"

I did and instantly felt better, she promised prayers. I know things will work out. Currently, I'm following Church of Scotland and Wicca.
 

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