Ever have tipping remorse?

StarSong said:
My grandmother used to tell us, "If you can't be a sport when you go out, stay home." Those are words I've lived by.
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Being a "sport" IMO has absolutely zero to do with how people manage their finances and/or how they open up their wallets and for whom.

Receiving a tip is a privilege, not a right.
 

Aunt Marg said:
As always, many great points, Tony.

Tipping IMO should be based upon that of each patron. The end.

To be perfectly honest, I don't understand the whole tipping thing, I mean, table servers are paid an hourly wage, so... where does the tip come into effect, and why does it come into effect?

If the food is good, then it should be the chef or cook in the back getting the tip, no?

If I'm a nurse in a hospital, should I get tips from each bed-ridden patient I tend to, because I'm good at taking care of them?

If I were a janitor in a school, should students bring monies to school with them each day to tip me, because I keep the floors swept and the garbage cans emptied?

What is it with all of the tipping these days?
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Waiters and waitresses have always been paid a pauper's wage so that the customer would tip well due to feeling sorry for them. My cousin waited tables all through college to make spending money and it is a thankless job. They take a lot of guff when most often problems that arise are not any fault of theirs. Not a job I'd ever care to do. Yet, I've been compared to wait staff being a nurse. Listen, I tell people, it's my job to save lives not deliver their meals to them and therein lies the difference. Plus, we ethically and legally cannot accept tips or gifts of any kind.
 

Lewkat said:
Waiters and waitresses have always been paid a pauper's wage so that the customer would tip well due to feeling sorry for them. My cousin waited tables all through college to make spending money and it is a thankless job. They take a lot of guff when most often problems that arise are not any fault of theirs. Not a job I'd ever care to do. Yet, I've been compared to wait staff being a nurse. Listen, I tell people, it's my job to save lives not deliver their meals to them and therein lies the difference. Plus, we ethically and legally cannot accept tips or gifts of any kind.
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I could never do the job either, Lew.

One thing I have noticed about servers today, they don't hold a candle to the waiters and waitresses of yesteryear.

Until recent, dear husband and I would go out to a restaurant, once, maybe twice a year, and we sure noticed when a table server was good at his or her job, they really stand out, because table servers (the real good ones) are few and far between.

The fake niceties and cheesy smiles that so many display as a way of helping to secure a tip, I can do without. I don't miss going to restaurants whatsoever, not that we ever did.
 
StarSong said:
My grandmother used to tell us, "If you can't be a sport when you go out, stay home." Those are words I've lived by.
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I agree.

For me, tipping is a part of eating out or traveling and if you are not willing to include it in your budget you should stay home or hit the drive-in window at McDonald's.

Having said that I would prefer that waitstaff and service workers be paid a living wage with the additional cost included in the price of the goods and services as a normal part of overhead.
 
Aunt Bea said:
I agree.

For me, tipping is a part of eating out or traveling and if you are not willing to include it in your budget you should stay home or hit the drive-in window at McDonald's.

Having said that I would prefer that waitstaff and service workers be paid a living wage with the additional cost included in the price of the goods and services as a normal part of overhead.
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I disagree.

How people spend their money, and to what degree people are willing to open up their pocketbooks is strictly up to them, it's the consumer who wields the power when it comes to money, and so regardless of whether or not a restaurant-goer is willing to tip or not, has no bearing on where they should choose to eat.

It's a free world.

Post #77 says it all.
 
Aunt Marg said:
I disagree.

How people spend their money, and to what degree people are willing to open up their pocketbooks is strictly up to them, it's the consumer who wields the power when it comes to money, and so regardless of whether or not a restaurant-goer is willing to tip or not, has no bearing on where they should choose to eat.

It's a free world.

Post #77 says it all.
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No need to quote me or cite your previous post.

I'm aware of your opinions and you are entitled to them in the same way that I should be entitled to mine.
 
Anybody can slop hash. I believe a server however earns their gratuity by providing good service. For me 'good service' is: salad first, then wait for the salad to be finished before serving the main meal then wait before serving the after dinner drink and dessert. Seems that may be how the term waitress and waiter originated. 🙂
 
Hapiguy said:
Anybody can slop hash. I believe a server however earns their gratuity by providing good service. For me 'good service' is: salad first, then wait for the salad to be finished before serving the main meal then wait before serving the after dinner drink and dessert. Seems that may be how the term waitress and waiter originated. 🙂
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Yes, with the gratuity based upon the comfort level of each visiting patron.

I quite like Merriam-Webster's definition of gratuity, "something given voluntarily or beyond obligation".
 
I love tip jars at the checkout register. Is it service to take your money in the amount of the charge? No it is not.
As for tipping for lousy and or no service I leave them nothing. Sometimes I wonder if a better message would be to leave a nickle that way they know I was not happy versus thinking their service was good but I just forgot to tip. Bad service is one thing but when it is rude service then I let them know.
 
fmdog44 said:
I love tip jars at the checkout register. Is it service to take your money in the amount of the charge? No it is not.
As for tipping for lousy and or no service I leave them nothing. Sometimes I wonder if a better message would be to leave a nickle that way they know I was not happy versus thinking their service was good but I just forgot to tip. Bad service is one thing but when it is rude service then I let them know.
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Good on you, FM.

Exactly what they'd get from us, too, for lousy service, and on a couple of occasions that is exactly what we left after a meal, nothing, and we never went back for seconds.
 
fmdog44 said:
The tip rule follows inflation.
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Not an answer to the questions I asked. Your answer would be for the question: How is the tipping amount generally set? That is not what I asked.

Again:

Where did it originate?

A valid answer might contain information such as when and where tipping got started.

How did it spread?

A valid answer might contain information such as how did other places of service find out about the first tip?

I can come up with some plausible guesses to the second question and maybe google might yield an answer to the first question. However, maybe somebody here in the forums might have definitive answers.

A quick google search provided a number of sites with information regarding where tipping originated, and at least some of these seem to be in agreement on this. There are many sites than these, but at least they provide some idea of what my question entailed.

https://www.tripsavvy.com/a-brief-history-of-tipping-1329249

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/tip-sheet/


Tony
 
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tbeltrans said:
Not an answer to the questions I asked. Your answer would be for the question: How is the tipping amount generally set? That is not what I asked.

Again:

Where did it originate?

A valid answer might contain information such as when and where tipping got started.

How did it spread?

A valid answer might contain information such as how did other places of service find out about the first tip?

I can come up with some plausible guesses to the second question and maybe google might yield an answer to the first question. However, maybe somebody here in the forums might have definitive answers.

A quick google search provided a number of sites with information regarding where tipping originated, and at least some of these seem to be in agreement on this. There are many sites than these, but at least they provide some idea of what my question entailed.

https://www.tripsavvy.com/a-brief-history-of-tipping-1329249

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/tip-sheet/


Tony
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Here is my take on tipping.

Tipping originated way back in the day as a thank you to those providing services to others. It was a nice way to reward and express additional thanks to those who were hired to perform a job, a duty, or a task, yet the worker performing the required work took things to the next level and outdid themselves in seeing to the work or job they were hired to do. A job (and effort) that exceeded the expectations of the ones who did the hiring.

Somehow over the past (who knows how many years), tipping began to be take on a more given form, one of a granted one in certain industries, the food industry being one of them, where it was learned and taught to be expected, and then just like the stranger that knocks on ones door, and upon opening the door to answer, the stranger sticks his or her boot between the door and the jamb, and before long the stranger is inside. You know what I'm talking about, give an inch, take a mile.

Tipping evolved to become much the same. Instead of tipping being a nice gesture (every now and then) as a way to extend an additional appreciation for services, providing the person doing the tipping can afford the extra means and feels comfortable offering such additional monies, somewhere along the line someone got the idea that tipping should be mandatory, expected, a given, the norm... one where for some employees, equates to them counting imaginary change in their pockets before they even leave their homes, just because they work in the food industry. Reeks of entitlement to me.

Well I'm old-school, so I'll be the one that so chooses to tip if and when I feel a tip is due, and just as FM, mentioned, in the event I'm not satisfied with the services that were extended to me, you can bet your bottom dollar that they'll be no tip, and I find nothing more insulting than to be handed a pay terminal that's pre-programmed to reflect 15%, 20%, and 25% tip amount.

As for handing out money being a sport, that's a new one on me, because having been born and raised in a poor home, I learned at an early age that handing out money was anything but a sport, but if somewhere along the way handing out money today has become some sort of sport, that's one sport I'm not interested in, but to everyone else who enjoys it, my advice to them is, be my guest and knock yourselves out, but don't expect the masses to follow.
 
Aunt Marg said:
Here is my take on tipping.

Tipping originated way back in the day as a thank you to those providing services to others. It was a nice way to reward and express additional thanks to those who were hired to perform a job, a duty, or a task, yet the worker performing the required work took things to the next level and outdid themselves in seeing to the work or job they were hired to do. A job (and effort) that exceeded the expectations of the ones who did the hiring.

Somehow over the past (who knows how many years), tipping began to be take on a more given form, one of a granted one in certain industries, the food industry being one of them, where it was learned and taught to be expected, and then just like the stranger that knocks on ones door, and upon opening the door to answer, the stranger sticks his or her boot between the door and the jamb, and before long the stranger is inside. You know what I'm talking about, give an inch, take a mile.

Tipping evolved to become much the same. Instead of tipping being a nice gesture (every now and then) as a way to extend an additional appreciation for services, providing the person doing the tipping can afford the extra means and feels comfortable offering such additional monies, somewhere along the line someone got the idea that tipping should be mandatory, expected, a given, the norm... one where for some employees, equates to them counting imaginary change in their pockets before they even leave their homes, just because they work in the food industry. Reeks of entitlement to me.

Well I'm old-school, so I'll be the one that so chooses to tip if and when I feel a tip is due, and just as FM, mentioned, in the event I'm not satisfied with the services that were extended to me, you can bet your bottom dollar that they'll be no tip, and I find nothing more insulting than to be handed a pay terminal that's pre-programmed to reflect 15%, 20%, and 25% tip amount.

As for handing out money being a sport, that's a new one on me, because having been born and raised in a poor home, I learned at an early age that handing out money was anything but a sport, but if somewhere along the way handing out money today has become some sort of sport, that's one sport I'm not interested in, but to everyone else who enjoys it, my advice to them is, be my guest and knock yourselves out, but don't expect the masses to follow.
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Thanks Aunt Marg! An intelligent and well thought out reply. A number of the google hits were to sites that reflected much of what you say - for tipping in the US instead of going all the way back to the Middle Ages.

One issue I see with tipping, which actually goes along with what you have described is that employers feel that they can pay those being tipped LESS because the tips are expected to make up for it. So the "where it was learned and taught to be expected, and then just like the stranger that knocks on ones door, and upon opening the door to answer, the stranger sticks his or her boot between the door and the jamb, and before long the stranger is inside" on the part of the person expecting tips is actually expecting that part of his or her basic wage. I am not justifying the practice, but instead passing on what folks in this position are dealing with. It is not a good system, and the only people who benefit from it really are the owners of the establishment because they don't have to pay as much for the help.

I think I explained my response to fmdog44 well enough in my response to his post to not have to go into it again. Clearly, you understood what I had originally asked for, as your response reflects.

Tony
 
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Wow...After reading all of this pro, con and percent consideration about tipping, I'm going to change my restaurant MO.

From now on, after I narrate my order, I'll say...by the way, if you are at all concerned about the amount of your gratuity...Please say after me...appetizer first, then salad, then dinner, then coffee and dessert, and if it is to be served hot, warm, chilled or cold it must be served that way [I hate to watch my food being ignored in the order out line]. If I still get lousy service at least it's not my fault...I tried. 🙂

Provided of course that they don't immediately point me in the direction of the exit door. 😎
 
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Aunt Marg said:
As for handing out money being a sport, that's a new one on me, because having been born and raised in a poor home, I learned at an early age that handing out money was anything but a sport, but if somewhere along the way handing out money today has become some sort of sport, that's one sport I'm not interested in, but to everyone else who enjoys it, my advice to them is, be my guest and knock yourselves out, but don't expect the masses to follow.
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The expression of "being a sport" has nothing to do with athletic sports. My grandmother's meaning by "If you can't be a sport when you go out, stay home" was that if you're going out, don't be a tightwad. And that included tipping.

According to Dictionary.com, one definition of sport: a person who behaves in a sportsmanlike, fair, or admirable manner; an accommodating person.

As for growing up poor, in my experience poverty and wealth are rarely related to generosity.

On that note, I'm going to bow out of this thread.
 
StarSong said:
The expression of "being a sport" has nothing to do with athletic sports. My grandmother's meaning by "If you can't be a sport when you go out, stay home" was that if you're going out, don't be a tightwad. And that included tipping.

According to Dictionary.com, one definition of sport: a person who behaves in a sportsmanlike, fair, or admirable manner; an accommodating person.

As for growing up poor, in my experience poverty and wealth are rarely related to generosity.

On that note, I'm going to bow out of this thread.
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Yes, I had that figured out when you posted it the first time on page 3, post #74, but thank you for the walk-through anyway.
 
If your not going to tip for a food service (In house or delivery). I would suggest not returning to or ordering from the same establishment again. If you made a person work for minimum wage or for free. They tend to have a long memory and will be making your food again.
 
Dudewho said:
If your not going to tip for a food service (In house or delivery). I would suggest not returning to or ordering from the same establishment again. If you made a person work for minimum wage or for free. They tend to have a long memory and will be making your food again.
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Ahhh... you are employed in the food industry are you? LOL!
 

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