Fertility rates, and their decline over time

[fuzzybuddy]

Ah, you poor thing. They had to pay all the bills to keep you housed, clothed and fed, and they did all the work, but of course you should have gotten the money.

I was about 8 or 9,; and on TV, the evening news was all about the government giving $600 off your income taxes ,if you had a kid. To me, $600 was a massive amount of money. So I couldn't figure out why I wasn't getting any more toys. It was apparent that my parents were hoarding money meant for me, and given to me by the US government. Ya know I was a kid, what did I know?
Now, today, I'm waiting for the government to give me $600.................................................

 

[grahamg]

For couples who decide not to have children the questioning was relentless. I used the past tense was because during the first twenty or so years of our marriage we were asked "when" constantly. It was with well meaning by most but all the same, it felt relentless. We found the way to deflect it was to smile, ignore the question and turn the subject away. Only once can I remember my wife getting cross when someone we know, but not in friendship, asked why we didn't have any children, in a blunt way. Before I could say anything my wife cut him down. "The workings of my uterus is not open for public discussion," she chided, and that shut him up.

In the last thirty years or so, it seems as though there's a growing acceptance for couples to have a choice, or maybe it's because our fertility years are behind us that we don't get asked anymore. There is one exception to that though. When a celebrity reaches middle age it's open season for journalists to speculate why that person is still unmarried or without children. I remember one female journalist berating someone famous and telling them that they will regret it. Years later I learned about the termination that journalist had whilst still at university. Hypocrisy rules.

There is one thing for certain, (if it isn't too obvious thing to say), those choosing not to have children, rather than being unable to have children, are of some significance in an evolutionary sense.

Again, if it isnt too obvious a thing to say, we're all the result of a very long line of human beings, or pre-humans, (hominids are they called?), who did choose to have children, "or slipped up", facing goodness knows what challenges in the past, and yet coming through.

 

[Phoenix]

Just putting overpopulation of the world to one side, and how on earth anyone might wish to force their will on mothers/women across this world to stop anyone who wished having a baby, we've both grown up over fifty years ago, so during the "Cold war" era.
Annihilation of the planet was talked about a great deal back then, and not all die in a flash, some will linger, many might be left to starve during the "nuclear winter" to follow. When I went to school our teachers taught us "mankind will destroy itself by 2050"!
However, others took a different view, including a very wise old boss of mine, who told me mankind's desire to survive, meant he did not think nuclear Armageddon was going to happen.
Finally, our planet will perhaps always be threatened by asteroids capable of destroying life on earth, and yet somehow we're still here, and knowing this event might happen, or indeed one day our sun will peter out or explode, has not stopped billions of people believing in human life, and seeking to extend it for another generation.

If you watch documentaries on these issues your answers are there. Please enjoy your grandchildren. They are here now. They need you. But to deny that we are polluting everything and will survive whatever comes, is teaching them things that have no so basis in scientific fact. Be well. Take care.

For couples who decide not to have children the questioning was relentless. I used the past tense was because during the first twenty or so years of our marriage we were asked "when" constantly. It was with well meaning by most but all the same, it felt relentless. We found the way to deflect it was to smile, ignore the question and turn the subject away. Only once can I remember my wife getting cross when someone we know, but not in friendship, asked why we didn't have any children, in a blunt way. Before I could say anything my wife cut him down. "The workings of my uterus is not open for public discussion," she chided, and that shut him up.

In the last thirty years or so, it seems as though there's a growing acceptance for couples to have a choice, or maybe it's because our fertility years are behind us that we don't get asked anymore. There is one exception to that though. When a celebrity reaches middle age it's open season for journalists to speculate why that person is still unmarried or without children. I remember one female journalist berating someone famous and telling them that they will regret it. Years later I learned about the termination that journalist had whilst still at university. Hypocrisy rules.

I was asked the same thing, especially by family members. My sister wanted me to have kids so I would lose my figure. The neighbor across the street told me I was selfish for not having kids. I didn't respond.

I am departing this thread. To pursue it will accomplish nothing positive.

 

[Aunt Marg]

I haven't done any research into true fertility rates, but I believe most Western democracies are getting lower. Experts say it is because of economic and changing social reasons. I guess it comes down to kids cost a lot. And I think it's how you view kids. We think of kids as a drain on our finances. So we try to minimize their negative effect by not having so many. In other nations, usually 3rd World types. kids are seen as providing additional income, as they grow up. So they tend to have more kids.
BTW, as a kid, I heard that my parents got $600 off their taxes for having me.. I figured it was rightfully mine, so I kept asking for it. You're not going to believe this, but they kept it!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ROFLMAO!

 

[grahamg]

To Phoenix above, I accept we've worn our arguments out, and I'm not sure we're disagreeing anymore, and where in fact we are misunderstanding one another(?).

 

[grahamg]

You may be right. But let's say we tested this theory - put a swaddled baby in the arms of a group of women, do the same with group2, an equal number of men. I think a majority of the women would take the baby home. A majority of the men, on the other hand, would probably look around for its mother.
(tbh, I think I lost the point of this thread (...I just woke up/haven't finished my tea ))

I've had a day or two to think about your post now, and managed to come up with some limited ideas, though mostly I agree with you, you'll be flabbergasted to read, but with a few caveats, and of course admit I can't really guess how the mothers/women might feel in the scenario you've posed.
I will give you this boast however, that my daughter was so lovely, as a baby yes, but beyond as a toddler, and growing up into a teenager, and she was a friend and delight even when she was being difficult at times, (it wouldn't take her long to get over it), that in my view almost any mother, or woman with anything but the stoniest heart, would have loved enjoying her company!
My guess is many parents on this forum would have the same view of their child/children, even though we must admit to being biased. !

Finally I do think there are differences of the kind you describe, and I'd have acted as you suggested, and I have a feeling I'd not have made a good stepdad.

 

[gennie]

Fertility rates and their decline?

Interesting note: The decline began around the time that BPA infused plastic products invaded the consumer market - 1970s.

Bisphenol A is an artificial estrogen/endocrine disrupter, soluble in water and was a major component in baby bottles, food storage containers, thermal paper, sports equipment, CDs, DVRs, water bottles and more.

Coincidence? Maybe and maybe not.

 

[grahamg]

How many would wish to see some pictures of a very beautiful young girl, as my daughter certainly was, in order to help them make their minds up whether they'd fit the categories put forward above, about women/mothers wishing to step in, whilst men/fathers might not?
When I can I'll post one or two in order to attract some oows, and aaarrhs, at the very least, (can't do so on this tablet, and am having trouble again with my internet connection on my laptop).

 

[grahamg]

Fertility rates and their decline?
Interesting note: The decline began around the time that BPA infused plastic products invaded the consumer market - 1970s.
Bisphenol A is an artificial estrogen/endocrine disrupter, soluble in water and was a major component in baby bottles, food storage containers, thermal paper, sports equipment, CDs, DVRs, water bottles and more.
Coincidence? Maybe and maybe not.

You've got me there, I've no idea unfortunately.