First "modern" human's into Europe

senior chef

senior chef

Senior Member
Though dates vary, the generally accepted time frame of when the first "modern" human's ( Cro-magnon) entered Europe is 48,000 years ago. For all intents and purposes, they did not differ much from us. Based on fossil reconstructions, if we could dress one of them up in 21st century clothing, it is unlikely that he/she would look any different from us.

It is from these people that we get the majority of our DNA. (speaking of European heritage only). While it is certainly true that Cro-Magnon inter-bred with Neanderthals, that inter-breeding was not common. People of European heritage get aprox 1.5 to 2.4 % of our DNA from Neanderthals. Every descendent of European heritage has some Neanderthal DNA.

We like to think of ourselves as fully modern, however, our bodies, and our brains were finally shaped during those Cro-magnon times. And that accounts for the body difference between males and females of today.
Speaking in GENERAL TERMS ONLY, the male of today is larger, stronger, has a thicker, stronger bone structure than the female of today. He is bred for close combat with large, immensely strong wild animals. Note also that he is much less verbal than the female. Why ? As any hunter can tell you, the hunter needs to keep his mouth shut, so as to not scare off any game. He wants/needs to get in close with the wild animal.

The modern female has evolved for an entirely different purpose in mind. She was designed by nature to bear children. Much of her body is designed for child bearing AND raising of those children. Even her bone structure is different. Her pelvis, unlike that of the male, stretches to assist in child birth. Her breasts were designed for one purpose only, to make milk to feed the infant.
Her verbal skills are often greater than that of the male. Why ? As the male was out and about being the hunter, she was the "gatherer" . With infant in tow, she collected fruits, berries, nuts, tubers, fungi, and all manner of vegetables. Again, as any naturalist can tell you, if you talk as you wander thru the wilds, animals will leave the scene. Talking actually protected females from the wild breasts. We can imagine a scene from those pre-historic times. Groups of females banded together in search of vegetable matter, and as they searched they chatted back and forth among themselves. Wild animals, generally speaking, vanished.

IMPORTANT NOTE HERE: I do not suggest that one gender is any better or more superior than the other. I only mean that they are DIFFERENT.
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Cro-magnon is not used, it is an extinct term.

First “modern” humans are known as Homo sapiens, first appeared 300,000 years ago in Africa, with brains as large or larger than ours.

They're followed by anatomically modern Homo sapiens at least 200,000 years ago, and brain shape became essentially modern by at least 100,000 years ago.
 
senior chef said:
People of European heritage get aprox 1.5 to 2.4 % of our DNA from Neanderthals. Every descendent of European heritage has some Neanderthal DNA.
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I've seen 2 - 4% as the range. I'm 2% according to 23&me and supposedly have Neanderthal genome variants that make me not afraid of heights ...which I'm not at all afraid of. Am strongly drawn to high ocean headlands though no recent ancestor has lived near them.
 

AnnieA said:
I've seen 2 - 4% as the range. I'm 2% according to 23&me and supposedly have Neanderthal genome variants that make me not afraid of heights ...which I'm not at all afraid of. Am strongly drawn to high ocean headlands though no recent ancestor has lived near them.
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I'm sure you are correct. I have no special training in the subject. I go just from memory.
Interesting that you got your DNA checked. Fascinating . Someday I'd like to do the same if the opportunity presents itself. All I know is that my ancestors came from Northern Europe.
 
AnnieA said:
I've seen 2 - 4% as the range. I'm 2% according to 23&me and supposedly have Neanderthal genome variants that make me not afraid of heights ...which I'm not at all afraid of. Am strongly drawn to high ocean headlands though no recent ancestor has lived near them.
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If you read The Clan of the Cave Bear, or seen the movie, it is about the struggles of a young Cro-magnon woman to co-exist with a group of Neanderthals. Interesting if too much of a "Hollywood fantasy".
 
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Au contraire to what le chef said in the Original Post that “Man is bred for close combat with large, immensely strong wild animals and women only for child bearing.” Wrong!

Women were not just gathers, they were hunters!!

 
When the fossil bones of early human's are closely examined, it has shown that many of the males had numerous , but healed, fractures. This puzzled anthropologists until they also looked at the modern day equivalent … rodeo riders. Rodeo riders have exactly the same type of fractures.
This evidence tells us two things.
1.) Other people in the tribe had to have taken care of them, feed them etc, until they recovered.
2.) Only close physical contact with large, dangerous, wild animals, create those types of fractures.
 
I agree with conclusion #1 but only agree with #2 is you delete the word 'only' at the beginning of the sentence. Fractures are caused by some kind of force, however that force happens to be delivered. Large, dangerous wild animals are not the only means of delivery of bone breaking forces. Rodeo riders fall and hit the ground hard. You don't need to ride a horse to break your bones. A fall from a tree would have the same effect.

Are there no female skeletons with healed bone structures?
 
Warrigal said:
I agree with conclusion #1 but only agree with #2 is you delete the word 'only' at the beginning of the sentence. Fractures are caused by some kind of force, however that force happens to be delivered. Large, dangerous wild animals are not the only means of delivery of bone breaking forces. Rodeo riders fall and hit the ground hard. You don't need to ride a horse to break your bones. A fall from a tree would have the same effect.

Are there no female skeletons with healed bone structures?
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Agreed, Bones can be broken for any number of reasons. It has been quite awhile since I studied this , but I do recall the anthropologists said that something about "spiral fractures" . Could be that I have forgotten but I think they said that "spiral fractures" differ from a simple fall. Just imagine what damage can be caused by a large , ultra strong, bison can do to the human body.

Before the invention of bow and arrow or "throwing sticks" man had to get in very close to kill that enraged animal.

I'm sure that there must be some female skeletons with healed bones. BUT, in overwhelming numbers, males had the most broken bones.
 
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A TV presenter in the UK, name of Alan Titchmarsh, was given a Neanderthal make over and sent out on to the street.

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Despite Alan's celebrity status, here in the UK, not only was he not recognised, but there was no reaction from the general public. He was just another face.
 
senior chef said:
Agreed, Bones can be broken for any number of reasons. It has been quite awhile since I studied this , but I do recall the anthropologists said that something about "spiral fractures" . Could be that I have forgotten but I think they said that "spiral fractures" differ from a simple fall. Just imagine what damage can be caused by a large , ultra strong, bison can do to the human body.
I looked up spiral fractures. See below.
Before the invention of bow and arrow or "throwing sticks" man had to get in very close to kill that enraged animal.

I'm sure that there must be some female skeletons with healed bones. BUT, in overwhelming numbers, males had the most broken bones.
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A spiral fracture happens when a long bone is torn in half by a twisting force or impact.
The injury can also involve the long bones of the arms, including the humerus, ulna, and radius. Spiral fractures are usually serious injuries and carry the risk of complications.

When long bones are broken on an angle, they often separate into two parts that do not align and have rough, uneven edges. This fracture can make it difficult to put the bone back together.

I've taken part of the text from What is a spiral fracture? Causes and treatment (medicalnewstoday.com) and added a few comments of my own in bold purple

Causes​

Anything that puts a lot of twisting stress or force on a long bone can cause a spiral fracture. But a few specific motions, activities, and circumstances tend to be associated with the injury.

Causes of spiral fractures include:

  • Skiing or snowboarding injuries, when the leg is twisted by being stuck in a ski or snowboarding boot while the rest of the leg continues to move.
  • Soccer injuries, especially when two players run into one another and become entangled or twisted.
  • American football injuries, especially when one player runs into another, one player is held or restrained by another, or a player twists to get free.
  • Wrestling injuries to the legs or arms caused by twists.
I'm guessing that even Neanderthals played games and wrestled each other when they weren't actually hunting.
  • Motor vehicle and motorcycle accidents.
  • Bicycle accidents, typically those involving a motor vehicle as well.
  • Falling after trying to compensate for a loss in balance by putting out an arm or quickly repositioning the leg.
Accidents such as falls would have been commonplace. It only take one fall from a tree or getting a foot stuck in a crevice to cause a twisting stress.
  • Child abuse, if a child’s arm or leg has been jerked aggressively.
  • Falling down the stairs or a slope with fixed obstacles, such as rocks or trees that can twist an arm or leg away from the rest of the body. See above
  • Physical violence, when a person’s arm or leg has been twisted forcibly.
Alpha male exerting dominance over younger males?
  • Machinery injuries that involve someone’s limbs.
Levering rocks into position?
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There are all sorts of scenarios for assuming that the males hunted large animals but the evidence of the broken bones is not conclusive. For me the evidence of cave art is more compelling. I cannot be sure but I don't think many of the depict women hunting large animals but I have seen footage of Australian aborigine women and children gleefully chasing and catching large lizards that they subdued with hefty sticks before throwing whole onto a cooking fire. They may have mostly been gatherers but they didn't shy away from a bit of opportunistic hunting as well.
 
Men have been bred specifically for combat. Whether that is close combat with wild, immensely powerful wild animals or combat with other men who try to conquer his tribe.

Now, to be sure, in this day of high tech, women can play some role in defense of the group, but that is completely because of high tech. Remove the high tech and women, (in combat) are as useful as children.
 

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