France makes abortion a constitutional right as the first country worldwide

gruntlabor said:
I have the impression from your posts that you are an avid supporter of government-provided abortion. I don't agree with that.
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gruntlabor said:
You make a huge jump here, from the sentiment, "Her body, her choice" to demanding "support at the ballot box". One is about choice, the other is about force.
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gruntlabor said:
:) I am sure she is a lovely person when she is not making demands.
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I have the impression you engage in strawman arguments and have now devolved the thread into a food fight.

"A straw man argument is a logical fallacy that involves distorting an opposing position into an extreme version of itself and then arguing against that extreme version. "
 

Obviously we draw conclusions about people we write to on a daily basis. That doesn't make it factual, and the clinging and insisting on this person's part is antagonizing, IMO.
 
Pepper said:
Please don't engage with her on this. Her nonsense and how she is playing you is wearing on my nerves.
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You're right, I'm done with her. It's a waste of my time and annoying to all. She's just passive aggressively trolling with her lie. Life is too short for her nonsense.
 
ProTruckDriver said:
Oh, it's such a beautiful morning and great to be alive! Everyone have a Blessed Day! :)
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CNN- "Jailyn’s cries echoed through the quiet streets of Cleveland in the dead of the night. The toddler whimpered and howled, but no one came to her rescue.

Her mother, Kristel Candelario, was away on a 10-day summer vacation and had left Jailyn alone in a playpen with a few bottles of milk, prosecutors said. A neighbor’s doorbell camera captured the 16-month old’s frequent screams, including one around 1 a.m. two days after her mother left.

But Candelario was hundreds of miles away in Puerto Rico with a male friend, authorities said. After a few days at the beach and another stop in Detroit, she returned home on June 16 last year to find her daughter dead. She’d been gone for about 10 days."

"At her sentencing Monday, forensic pathologist Elizabeth Mooney told a Cleveland courtroom that children experience the most extreme separation anxiety between nine and 18 months. She recounted Jailyn’s excruciating final days.

“The pain and suffering she endured lasted not only hours, not days, but possibly even a week,” Mooney said, fighting back tears.

“This feeling of abandonment for days on end, coupled with the pain of starvation and extreme thirst is a type of suffering I don’t think any of us could ever fully fathom.”"


Great life this poor child had.
 
againstthegrain said:
CNN- "Jailyn’s cries echoed through the quiet streets of Cleveland in the dead of the night. The toddler whimpered and howled, but no one came to her rescue.

Her mother, Kristel Candelario, was away on a 10-day summer vacation and had left Jailyn alone in a playpen with a few bottles of milk, prosecutors said. A neighbor’s doorbell camera captured the 16-month old’s frequent screams, including one around 1 a.m. two days after her mother left.

But Candelario was hundreds of miles away in Puerto Rico with a male friend, authorities said. After a few days at the beach and another stop in Detroit, she returned home on June 16 last year to find her daughter dead. She’d been gone for about 10 days."

"At her sentencing Monday, forensic pathologist Elizabeth Mooney told a Cleveland courtroom that children experience the most extreme separation anxiety between nine and 18 months. She recounted Jailyn’s excruciating final days.

“The pain and suffering she endured lasted not only hours, not days, but possibly even a week,” Mooney said, fighting back tears.

“This feeling of abandonment for days on end, coupled with the pain of starvation and extreme thirst is a type of suffering I don’t think any of us could ever fully fathom.”"


Great life this poor child had.
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and no one close by could assist and help - no good samaritans on the streets for those 10 days?? gasp!!
 
againstthegrain said:
CNN- "Jailyn’s cries echoed through the quiet streets of Cleveland in the dead of the night. The toddler whimpered and howled, but no one came to her rescue.

Her mother, Kristel Candelario, was away on a 10-day summer vacation and had left Jailyn alone in a playpen with a few bottles of milk, prosecutors said. A neighbor’s doorbell camera captured the 16-month old’s frequent screams, including one around 1 a.m. two days after her mother left.

But Candelario was hundreds of miles away in Puerto Rico with a male friend, authorities said. After a few days at the beach and another stop in Detroit, she returned home on June 16 last year to find her daughter dead. She’d been gone for about 10 days."

"At her sentencing Monday, forensic pathologist Elizabeth Mooney told a Cleveland courtroom that children experience the most extreme separation anxiety between nine and 18 months. She recounted Jailyn’s excruciating final days.

“The pain and suffering she endured lasted not only hours, not days, but possibly even a week,” Mooney said, fighting back tears.

“This feeling of abandonment for days on end, coupled with the pain of starvation and extreme thirst is a type of suffering I don’t think any of us could ever fully fathom.”"


Great life this poor child had.
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Poor baby had to suffer until death like that by the hands of her own mother. Rest peacefully little one, sorry you were brought into this world just to suffer such pain and die alone. :(
 
againstthegrain said:
CNN- "Jailyn’s cries echoed through the quiet streets of Cleveland in the dead of the night. The toddler whimpered and howled, but no one came to her rescue.

Her mother, Kristel Candelario, was away on a 10-day summer vacation and had left Jailyn alone in a playpen with a few bottles of milk, prosecutors said. A neighbor’s doorbell camera captured the 16-month old’s frequent screams, including one around 1 a.m. two days after her mother left.

But Candelario was hundreds of miles away in Puerto Rico with a male friend, authorities said. After a few days at the beach and another stop in Detroit, she returned home on June 16 last year to find her daughter dead. She’d been gone for about 10 days."

"At her sentencing Monday, forensic pathologist Elizabeth Mooney told a Cleveland courtroom that children experience the most extreme separation anxiety between nine and 18 months. She recounted Jailyn’s excruciating final days.

“The pain and suffering she endured lasted not only hours, not days, but possibly even a week,” Mooney said, fighting back tears.

“This feeling of abandonment for days on end, coupled with the pain of starvation and extreme thirst is a type of suffering I don’t think any of us could ever fully fathom.”"


Great life this poor child had.
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This is horrific. 😭😭😭
 
I have no experience of abortion myself but I do remember a male friend who told me he was devastated when his girlfriend had an abortion without even discussing it with him. She had a career and other plans. They split up and he grieved for a long time.
It's a very individual matter, difficult no doubt for all concerned.
 
Rose65 said:
I have no experience of abortion myself but I do remember a male friend who told me he was devastated when his girlfriend had an abortion without even discussing it with him. She had a career and other plans. They split up and he grieved for a long time.
It's a very individual matter, difficult no doubt for all concerned.
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Exactly, and I still grieve to this day about it. :(
 
againstthegrain said:
You had the chance to avoid a lifetime of grieving, by using birth control, but you didn't. But then to insist all women must give birth once impregnated is a ridiculous conclusion.
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Ridiculous conclusion? Did you see what you posted ^^
I would have taken care of the child. You already come to the conclusion that I wouldn't have taken care of the child. Plus we were in love with each other.
By reading this whole thread about 90% of it is have fun with sex and the hell with the child, we can throw the child in the garbage if we don't want it and the man has NO SAY in it. Now talk about a ridiculous conclusion. :rolleyes:
 
^^^Yeah you were so in love that she didn't even tell you she was pregnant. And I've made no conclusion about what you would have done only about what you didn't do and that's prevent an unwanted pregnancy which resulted in an abortion because the WOMAN didn't want the child.

The reality is your point of view and experience is your own, is valid, has merit, and has undoubtedly affected you, however that point of view or any other does not give any person dominion over any other person, even pregnant women.

PTD - "By reading this whole thread about 90% of it is have fun with sex and the hell with the child, we can throw the child in the garbage if we don't want it and the man has NO SAY in it. Now talk about a ridiculous conclusion. "

And that's a strawman that you've written and your right it was a ridiculous conclusion by you.
 
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legal question perhaps? - in the case of a pregnant woman - married or NOT married

Who legally 'owns' the unborn and subsequent born child the woman only or both mother and father of the child? or the father alone?
 
davey said:
legal question perhaps? - in the case of a pregnant woman - married or NOT married

Who legally 'owns' the unborn and subsequent born child the woman only or both mother and father of the child? or the father alone?
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In order to research the unborn portion of your question one would perhaps gain some knowledge from divorce settlements where the couple had fertilized eggs/unfertilized eggs/sperm in cold storage. I would guess those eggs would be considered property, except in Alabama. ;) Thankfully the Idaho legislature did not pass a bill describing an embryo or fetus as a "preborn child" as was proposed in January, 2024.

A child is not property and therefore not owned. Both parents have a right to parent and a duty to support the child proportional to each's income.
 
Men and legislators of either gender need to stay out of women's Va-Jay-Jays! Especially when a woman's doctor has deemed giving birth a life threatening event. Politicians should not be allowed to override the medical opinions and treatments prescribed by a woman's doctor. France got it right.
 

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