I am exasperated with my Country

Lavinia said:
There does seem to be something in the mind-set of white people which makes our countries more prosperous.
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At the risk of sounding racist I think it is true that countries with a majority Caucasian population are often more prosperous. I think that is likely a result of history and location of the world's Caucasian populations than "mind-set".

Jared Diamond takes on this issue in his book Guns, Germs, and Steel, he makes a pretty good case that our relative affluence has more to do with how Europe is located geographically and the domesticable animals and plants our ancestors had access to than other parts of the world. It is an interesting question worthy of research.

There are of course exceptions, Japan is non-white with a very different mindset than we have, and quite prosperous. Bermuda is majority black and quite prosperous. There are others. So prosperity is not something we have a monopoly on.
 

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I am from Canada and our country has very recently been flooded with immigrants. Everywhere you go there are security guards from India. I think our government pays there salary so you even have security guards in thrift shops which we never had 4 months ago. Here are my comments:

1. There are just too many people on this planet.
2. Due to climate change, many countries close to the equator will become very, very hot in the near future.
3. Our government is flooding my country with immigrants but we are falling behind with cheap housing, doctors, nurses and schools.
4. I'm 76 so maybe I shouldn't care, but I predicate a lot of racial conflict in the future. We have a minister of "Diversity and Inclusion" who is really pushing this. I just wish we had some minister to push for more doctors, more nurses, more schools and more police, etc.
5. Yes, here in Canada we too have homeless and people begging on the streets that we never saw before.

To me, it's a "Brave New World" and I think the "brown stuff" is pretty soon gotta "hit the fan." Like I said, I'm 76 so not too concerned but it is gonna be a BIG issue for those fur faces with the tatoos, bald heads and those funny long key ropes hanging from their pants.
 
Packerjohn said:
I am from Canada and our country has very recently been flooded with immigrants. Everywhere you go there are security guards from India. I think our government pays there salary so you even have security guards in thrift shops which we never had 4 months ago. Here are my comments:

1. There are just too many people on this planet.
2. Due to climate change, many countries close to the equator will become very, very hot in the near future.
3. Our government is flooding my country with immigrants but we are falling behind with cheap housing, doctors, nurses and schools.
4. I'm 76 so maybe I shouldn't care, but I predicate a lot of racial conflict in the future. We have a minister of "Diversity and Inclusion" who is really pushing this. I just wish we had some minister to push for more doctors, more nurses, more schools and more police, etc.
5. Yes, here in Canada we too have homeless and people begging on the streets that we never saw before.

To me, it's a "Brave New World" and I think the "brown stuff" is pretty soon gotta "hit the fan." Like I said, I'm 76 so not too concerned but it is gonna be a BIG issue for those fur faces with the tatoos, bald heads and those funny long key ropes hanging from their pants.
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We have precisely the same problem here... Why the governments can't just call a halt to immigrants is beyond me.. Our infrastructure is on it's knees, we have barely any doctors, waiting lists as long as years for operations... no NHS dentists taking new patients.. school overcrowded to the max, and what's worse is Teachers reporting that they have classes of up to 40 children and in some cases only the minority speak English.. they can have anything up to 15 different languages being spoken in one class.. that's deplorable..

Our already overcrowded roads are jam packed .. there's now no longer a quiet period on the roads as there used to be at certain times of the day.. rush hour is every hour...

There are no available , and no affordable homes being built ..yet the social housing which is available is given to the immigrants who arrive with children.. and not the Indigenous people who were born and raised here
2 days ago I was in a clothing store in the next medium sized town.. the only English I heard was at the checkout... there was Polish, Romanian, Russian, Israeli.. and French being spoken that I overheard.. just on that one day.. in one relatively small department store..
 

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Alligatorob said:
At the risk of sounding racist I think it is true that counties with a majority Caucasian population are often more prosperous. I think that is likely a result of history and location of the world's Caucasian populations than "mind-set".

Jared Diamond takes on this issue in his book Guns, Germs, and Steel, he makes a pretty good case that our relative affluence has more to do with how Europe is located geographically and the domesticable animals and plants our ancestors had access to than other parts of the world. It is an interesting question worthy of research.

There are of course exceptions, Japan is non-white with a very different mindset than we have, and quite prosperous. Bermuda is majority black and quite prosperous. There are others. So prosperity is not something we have a monopoly on.
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Going off-topic, but the Japanese and the Chinese don't have a history of exploration. They seem perfectly content to stay in their own country. The Vikings (as they are known), on the other hand were great explorers and they seem to have sailed to all corners of the globe.
Call me racist if you wish, but there are definitely differences between the races.
 
Lavinia said:
Going off-topic, but the Japanese and the Chinese don't have a history of exploration. They seem perfectly content to stay in their own country. The Vikings (as they are known), on the other hand were great explorers and they seem to have sailed to all corners of the globe.
Call me racist if you wish, but there are definitely differences between the races.
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The color of one's skin does not affect the content of one's character.
 
Thinking outside the square, on the subject of skills shortages, it seems that Australia is going to need several thousand new welders quite soon. A suggestion has been made to train prison inmates as welders. Two problems solved in one go. I really like this idea.

Could the same thinking be applied to the influx of asylum seekers and other irregular immigrants? Could they not be embraced, given training and bonded to the government to work for a set period (say 5 years) in that role, after which they would qualify for citizenship?

People who already have qualifications could be accelerated through the training, which should include English language classes.
 
Warrigal said:
Thinking outside the square, on the subject of skills shortages, it seems that Australia is going to need several thousand new welders quite soon. A suggestion has been made to train prison inmates as welders. Two problems solved in one go. I really like this idea.

Could the same thinking be applied to the influx of asylum seekers and other irregular immigrants? Could they not be embraced, given training and bonded to the government to work for a set period (say 5 years) in that role, after which they would qualify for citizenship?

People who already have qualifications could be accelerated through the training, which should include English language classes.
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I wonder why..rather than going to the lengths of training criminals who will end up working in people's homes, that Australia doesn't encourage Eastern Europeans , et al, who are now in the UK.. with no work..
 
hollydolly said:
Why the governments can't just call a halt to immigrants is beyond me..
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They could of course, or mostly anyway. In democracies like you and I live in its lack of demand by voters, if a politicians knew they would win supporting elimination of immigration, and lose by not things would change. It is a bit more complicated than that, but in the end I think its most of the reason.

I support greatly reducing immigration into the US, not because of race, language or any of that, I just think we have enough people. I'd be happier if our population stabilized. We need reasonable immigration laws that are well enforced. I know most immigrants are good honest hard working folks, and I like diversity, but enough people is enough!
 
Alligatorob said:
They could of course, or mostly anyway. In democracies like you and I live in its lack of demand by voters, if a politicians knew they would win supporting elimination of immigration, and lose by not things would change. It is a bit more complicated than that, but in the end I think its most of the reason.

I support greatly reducing immigration into the US, not because of race, language or any of that, I just think we have enough people. I'd be happier if our population stabilized. We need reasonable immigration laws that are well enforced. I know most immigrants are good honest hard working folks, and I like diversity, but enough people is enough!
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Agreed. It is the apathy of the people. They complain continually but re-elect those very same politicians who want increased immigration.
 
You know it seems we (USA) need to do something that would cause the folks coming here to prefer to stay home. Per stories I have read recently most of them do want to remain in their country but there is no work which results in no income to buy food or pay for decent housing and the cartels and gangs terrorize families constantly so they feel that the only way to survive is to leave. I’ve also read that Central American countries are also dealing with the collapse of their agricultural industry because they have had more hurricanes than normal in the last years that have deposited large amounts of salt water leaving the soil unfit for growing crops. This plus the wide spread government corruption results in people choosing to flee.

Seems there needs to be some out of the box thinking done to address these problems. Throwing out millions to build a wall is not the answer. Bussing immigrants to NYC is not the answer. Maybe we should negotiate to temporarily annex the northern part of Mexico and use our military to help the federales to clean out the cartels and other riffraff to establish order. Perhaps American companies could be incentivized to build manufacturing plants in Mexico so there will be job opportunities. Send the experts in agriculture to Central America to study what can be done about the agricultural problems there - perhaps they need to consider growing hydroponically vs. in the dirt. But, me and my fellow Texans just sit here and do nothing but complain.
 
Alligatorob said:
They could of course, or mostly anyway. In democracies like you and I live in its lack of demand by voters, if a politicians knew they would win supporting elimination of immigration, and lose by not things would change. It is a bit more complicated than that, but in the end I think its most of the reason.

I support greatly reducing immigration into the US, not because of race, language or any of that, I just think we have enough people. I'd be happier if our population stabilized. We need reasonable immigration laws that are well enforced. I know most immigrants are good honest hard working folks, and I like diversity, but enough people is enough!
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We already have laws regarding immigration. And they're enforced. That's why there are so many in detention facilities and how Texas is shipping them up to Washington. They're being apprehended.

I guess one problem is that they're being released into the general population until their cases for asylum are processed and some of them just don't show up for their hearings. Another problem is that cable news pundits and politicians are claiming that we have "open" borders when we don't, but the poor in Central America hear that and form caravans expecting to be let in when they get to our border. It costs millions if not billions of our tax dollars to deal with them.
 
J-Kat said:
You know it seems we (USA) need to do something that would cause the folks coming here to prefer to stay home. Per stories I have read recently most of them do want to remain in their country but there is no work which results in no income to buy food or pay for decent housing and the cartels and gangs terrorize families constantly so they feel that the only way to survive is to leave. I’ve also read that Central American countries are also dealing with the collapse of their agricultural industry because they have had more hurricanes than normal in the last years that have deposited large amounts of salt water leaving the soil unfit for growing crops. This plus the wide spread government corruption results in people choosing to flee.

Seems there needs to be some out of the box thinking done to address these problems. Throwing out millions to build a wall is not the answer. Bussing immigrants to NYC is not the answer. Maybe we should negotiate to temporarily annex the northern part of Mexico and use our military to help the federales to clean out the cartels and other riffraff to establish order. Perhaps American companies could be incentivized to build manufacturing plants in Mexico so there will be job opportunities. Send the experts in agriculture to Central America to study what can be done about the agricultural problems there - perhaps they need to consider growing hydroponically vs. in the dirt. But, me and my fellow Texans just sit here and do nothing but complain.
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Good points.
The cartels could be gotten rid of if there was the will to do it. A lot of cooperation between countries is all that would be required.
Of course, the corrupted politicians would need to be removed as well. A 10 year plan would enable this to occur.
 
SeniorBen said:
asylum
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This one is a real conundrum... I think it comes from our WWII experience when Jews didn't get asylum and many died as a result. I can understand that.

However I do not believe we can accommodate millions of asylum seekers, particularly not on a permanent basis. In the US the Immigration and Nationality Act defines it as follows:

“Any person who is outside any country of such person’s nationality or, in the case of a person having no nationality, is outside any country in which such person habitually resided, and who is unable or unwilling to avail himself or herself of the protection of that country because of persecution or a well-founded fear of persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion.”

I believe this is too broad and allows too many to qualify. More than we have room for, and often to the detriment of their home countries.

For example pretty much anyone in Russia who differs with Putin could legitimately make the case they faced persecution for their political opinion. To open our borders to all of Putin's political opponents would not only flood our country but would help Putin stay in power.

A case could be made that had we not allowed so many anti-communist Cubans, or moderate Iranians to come here those countries would have more moderate governments today. In many cases the refugees are the best and brightest, a good thing for us, but a bad one for their home counties.

I don't know the answer, but I do not think we can continue doing what we are doing...
 
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hollydolly said:
I wonder why..rather than going to the lengths of training criminals who will end up working in people's homes, that Australia doesn't encourage Eastern Europeans , et al, who are now in the UK.. with no work..
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@hollydolly We do have an immigration program that takes in immigrants from all continents and have done so since the end of WW II. It is the asylum seekers who arrive by boat who get locked up in immigration detention, all because some politician back in time decided there were votes to be had by declaring them illegals and vowing that they would never be allowed to settle in Australia. This policy is harsh and illogical, given that most have been assessed as genuine refugees by the UN.

New Zealand has offered to take them but Australia has refused the offer because some day, in the future, they may become NZ citizens and then they would be able to come to Australia visa free like all other Kiwis. So instead, we keep them locked up and pay their gaolers squillions keep them there.

Why any of them would want to settle here after the way they have been treated defies all logic.

I see no problem with offering VET training to prisoners in gaol. All of them except for the very worst will one day be released into society and better that they come out as productive members of society than homeless jobless vagrants. Some prisoners are able to earn university degrees by distance education while serving a sentence. Why not facilitate a trade qualification for others?
 

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