I get so sick of old men who send our young to unnecessary wars

AZ Jim

AZ Jim

R.I.P. With Us In Spirit Only
Location
SURPRISE, ARIZONA
Young American boys who spend the rest of their long lives with one arm, no arms, no legs, blind or brain dead because old or "safe" men(AKA politicians and 'connected') and others decide a war is like a damn Olympic game. There has to be better answers. It may be mankinds greatest challenge, finding a way to live in peace.
 

AZ Jim said:
Young American boys who spend the rest of their long lives with one arm, no arms, no legs, blind or brain dead because old or "safe" men(AKA politicians and 'connected') and others decide a war is like a damn Olympic game. There has to be better answers. It may be mankinds greatest challenge, finding a way to live in peace.
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:eek:ld: "Be all that you can be". :xbone:
 
More than half of the GOP Presidential candidates would send out troops back to the Mid-East... for what? Most of the GOP congressmen would rather start a war with Iran than to give in to the President and see how the negotiated agreement will work. No American serviceman should have to lose their life on behalf of foreign civil/sectarian conflicts that have been going on for centuries. That said...

Our son just re-enlisted, this week, for his last time. He's somewhere past 12 years in and now the re-enlistment is "unlimited" in that he's there until retirement time. He's a good soldier. He's a good leader, caring that his unit is in shape and ready for whatever comes their way. He understands the benefits for his family that could be difficult to find on the outside. And, he likes his job.

His first tour in Iraq was when there were casualty reports each and every day. He was assigned to one of the elite fighting forces in the World, the 82nd Airborne. I probably took the deployment harder than his Mother. Every day I would pull up the casualty reports looking for his unit. One day, it hit me. He was well trained. He loved what his "job" was and was very good at it. How many people do you know who hate their job... hate getting up and going to work... do poor work?? Any one of those could be killed in a traffic accident on their way to a job they despise. I thought, "If his time is up while he is doing something he loves....." The weight was lifted and, ever since, I've had a completely different outlook. Certainly, we worry about him when he is deployed. Shoot! We worry about our kids and grandkids as they go about their daily lives in what has become a violent society.

Sorry! Got carried away.......
 
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These recent years wars are entirely of volunteers. No drafts since Korea and Indochina stuff. I think we should all respect the volunteers of our military and coast guard and border patrols. They know they are doing dangerous work and do it well. Our local and state police also come under the willingness to take on dangerous work every day.

Those wars in Iraq and nearby, and also in Afghanistan, were all done by our volunteer military along with other nations also helping. My son and daughter were both volunteers in our military in Iraq. They both had other events that were also threatening in other parts of the world. To me, this voluntary military of all branches is the best way we should go to discourage the wild and unruly ones that want to threaten the US now or in the future.
 
I agree that so many young men and women have no business being where they are sent..."volunteers" or not. It also makes you question the ethics of medicine in such situations. Just because these poor soldiers can be saved, should they all be saved? I remember awhile back reading one of those danged stories, meant to be inspirational but just so pathetic.

Apparently the son of this senior couple had been a pilot and he was shot down over somewhere. He lived but with physical injuries and massive brain damage. He was sent back home with his folks after rehab that just got him out of the danger zone. Imagine having a child come home, able to walk with assistance but not to feed or dress himself, he might always need assistance with bathing and the toilet.

Twenty six years old...what about when his parents are unable to care for him? He'll be a burden to next of kin. Perhaps he has the capacity to understand how messed up he is. Wouldn't that be a horrible situation to be trapped in. The government isn't paying those people enough for what they're all going through.
 
AZ Jim said:
Young American boys who spend the rest of their long lives with one arm, no arms, no legs, blind or brain dead because old or "safe" men(AKA politicians and 'connected') and others decide a war is like a damn Olympic game.
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I get sick of it too Jim, it's just a game with our troops for many politicians.

Grumpy Ol' Man said:
More than half of the GOP Presidential candidates would send out troops back to the Mid-East... for what? Most of the GOP congressmen would rather start a war with Iran than to give in to the President and see how the negotiated agreement will work. No American serviceman should have to lose their life on behalf of foreign civil/sectarian conflicts that have been going on for centuries.

Our son just re-enlisted, this week, for his last time. He's somewhere past 12 years in and now the re-enlistment is "unlimited" in that he's there until retirement time. He's a good soldier. He's a good leader, caring that his unit is in shape and ready for whatever comes their way. He understands the benefits for his family that could be difficult to find on the outside. And, he likes his job.
....
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You hit the nail on the head that most of the GOP congressmen would rather start a war in Iran to spite our President, regardless of the negative outcome for our troops and our country. I thank your son for his service, I can't begin to imagine how you worry when he's fighting in places like Iraq.

BobF said:
These recent years wars are entirely of volunteers. No drafts since Korea and Indochina stuff. I think we should all respect the volunteers of our military and coast guard and border patrols. They know they are doing dangerous work and do it well.
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I do respect each and every volunteer of our military, but I have no respect for those in government who send them off to senseless wars like Iraq, to be killed or injured for life. When they sign up with Uncle Sam, they shouldn't be used as chess pieces in a game of political control.
 
SeaBreeze said:
I get sick of it too Jim, it's just a game with our troops for many politicians.



You hit the nail on the head that most of the GOP congressmen would rather start a war in Iran to spite our President, regardless of the negative outcome for our troops and our country. I thank your son for his service, I can't begin to imagine how you worry when he's fighting in places like Iraq.



I do respect each and every volunteer of our military, but I have no respect for those in government who send them off to senseless wars like Iraq, to be killed or injured for life. When they sign up with Uncle Sam, they shouldn't be used as chess pieces in a game of political control.
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In the first place the US has not been starting all these wars. Often the UN has asked the nations of the world to send forces and mostly the US and many others join in these war zones. I believed there were over 60 nations in the Iraq war and it's continuations. Some were small and did isolated assignments. Not all these assignments are of the Republican politicians either. Our Congress is made of mixed political parties including independents. Been some pretty nasty wars done under the Democrat leadership as well. In life it is a function of our government, not just Republicans or Democrats.

This current 'blame it all on the Republicans' is pure BS. It should be stopped and get down to some real reasons why the US does involve itself in corrective actions. Often times it is because of the UN. Other times it can be part of the cross over military stuff that we do with European nations asking for help. My son went to Yugoslavia on one of those types of missions. Just blaming the Republicans for all these so called hateful things is just wrong. We have military leaders that also have political preferences of one or the other. It does not matter as they know the job they are supposed to do.

Think back maybe 20 or 30 years and this political nonsense was not at all as divisive as it has been in recent years. We had election time speeches on radio or in the parks. We had our election times and ballot day. Then after the counting time we had a few days of celebrating or being disappointed. But I never saw the type of personal hate and nasty discourse as I have seen in my older years. Remember the trains also that would circle the country so the politicians could hang off the back car and make speeches here and there. Elections were more fun those older years. Now we just have way too many speeches over too long a time and hatred just gets promoted rather than listening and voting in a final year or less. After it was over we went back to work and got on with our lives. Wish we could to that now, rather than this two years of anger and hate being tossed about.
 
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BobF said:
In the first place the US has not been starting all these wars. Often the UN has asked the nations of the world to send forces and mostly the US and many others join in these war zones. I believer there were over 60 nations in the Iraq war and it's continuations. Some were small and did isolated assignments. Not all these assignments are of the Republican politicians either. Our Congress is made of mixed political parties including independents. Been some pretty nasty wars done under the Democrat leadership as well. In life it is a function of our government, not just Republicans or Democrats.

This current 'blame it all on the Republicans' is pure BS. It should be stopped and get down to some real reasons why the US does involve itself in corrective actions. Often times it is because of the UN. Other times it can be part of the cross over military stuff that we do with European nations asking for help. My son went to Yugoslavia on one of those types of missions. Just blaming the Republicans for all these so called hateful things is just wrong. We have military leaders that also have political preferences of one or the other. It does not matter as they know the job they are supposed to do.

Think back maybe 20 or 30 years and this political nonsense was not at all as divisive as it has been in recent years. We had election time speeches on radio or in the parks. We had our election times and ballot day. Then after the counting time we had a few days of celebrating or being disappointed. But I never saw the type of personal hate and nasty discourse as I have seen in my older years. Remember the trains also that would circle the country so the politicians could hang off the back car and make speeches here and there. Elections were more fun those older years. Now we just have way too many speeches over too long a time and hatred just gets promoted rather than listening and voting in a final year or less. After it was over we went back to work and got on with our lives. Wish we could to that now, rather than this two years of anger and hate being tossed about.
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Respectfully, sir, I must disagree with a couple of your statements.

1.) The U.S. did start the current conflicts in both Afghanistan and Iraq. As you say, there were a large number of nations that joined the "coalition" to assist us in our efforts on both fronts. The former POTUS went in to Afghanistan in retaliation for 9/11. He invaded Iraq using information that proved false.
2.) More than one Republican Congressman has suggested negotiations with Iran will not work and the ONLY alternative is to go to war with them. I haven't heard one Democratic Congressman suggest such action.
3.) You are certainly correct with the comments re hatred and divisiveness. Probably the first we really saw of this was the Swiftboating of a Presidential candidate. That sort of opened the door to negative attacks on candidates running for elected office. Then, we saw the Presidential election of 2008. Between the November election and the time the President was inaugurated, the Republicans were stating that they would do everything in their power to see this President fail. There has been zero attempt to find middle ground and move the Country forward. Every... EVERY single action/suggestion/solution/idea put forth by this President has been diced to pieces by the right wing media and the GOP elected leaders. Today, we wonder why there is so much hate displayed in a certain segment of society that openly calls for the murder of police officers. My word! When the far right is suggesting seceding from the Union... when Governors are suggesting our own military is going to take over states during a Special Ops exercise... when elected officials send letters to foreign nations telling them any negotiation made by our President isn't worth the paper on which it is written... THERE is the divisiveness!!! There is the lack of patriotism. There is the root of our society hating each other, led by the example of our elected officials.
 
BobF said:
Those wars in Iraq and nearby, and also in Afghanistan, were all done by our volunteer military along with other nations also helping. My son and daughter were both volunteers in our military in Iraq. They both had other events that were also threatening in other parts of the world.
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Bob, I want to thank your son and your daughter for their service in the military, I hope both of them remain safe while performing their duties for our government.
 
Grumpy Ol' Man said:
Respectfully, sir, I must disagree with a couple of your statements.

1.) The U.S. did start the current conflicts in both Afghanistan and Iraq. As you say, there were a large number of nations that joined the "coalition" to assist us in our efforts on both fronts. The former POTUS went in to Afghanistan in retaliation for 9/11. He invaded Iraq using information that proved false.

Sorry, but the UN did start the action against Iraq under Senior Bush. He then went after Iraqs forces with a bunch of other nations as I said. Then again, while wanting to end Saddams career, we went with the English General that decided that the UN commissions had never ended after 11 years so younger Bush and a entire bunch of nations agreed and they all went after Saddam.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1561891/Gen-Sir-Mike-Jackson-attacks-US-over-Iraq.html
Sir Mike says he satisfied himself on the legality of invading Iraq by careful study of the relevant UN Security Council resolutions and concluded that action was "legitimate under international law without a 'second' resolution.

2.) More than one Republican Congressman has suggested negotiations with Iran will not work and the ONLY alternative is to go to war with them. I haven't heard one Democratic Congressman suggest such action.

I would agree the only alternative would be to go to war with them. That is likely a true statement but not a declaration. Iran has done nothing of cooperation during these long term meetings, so likely if wanting all the items requested that were tossed, likely war would be the persuasion. Or we could have just left them sitting without the US support.

3.) You are certainly correct with the comments re hatred and divisiveness. Probably the first we really saw of this was the Swiftboating of a Presidential candidate. That sort of opened the door to negative attacks on candidates running for elected office. Then, we saw the Presidential election of 2008. Between the November election and the time the President was inaugurated, the Republicans were stating that they would do everything in their power to see this President fail. There has been zero attempt to find middle ground and move the Country forward. Every... EVERY single action/suggestion/solution/idea put forth by this President has been diced to pieces by the right wing media and the GOP elected leaders. Today, we wonder why there is so much hate displayed in a certain segment of society that openly calls for the murder of police officers. My word! When the far right is suggesting seceding from the Union... when Governors are suggesting our own military is going to take over states during a Special Ops exercise... when elected officials send letters to foreign nations telling them any negotiation made by our President isn't worth the paper on which it is written... THERE is the divisiveness!!! There is the lack of patriotism. There is the root of our society hating each other, led by the example of our elected officials.
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Well, you sure picked a bunch of favorites from your pile, but only one sided in problems. Many request made of the Democrats the President refused to even consider let alone do. Our national debt has grown from 7.7 trillion under Republicans with Bush, went to 10 trillion under Democrats under Bush. Now with Democrats for most of the decisions over 6 years the debt has grown to now 18 trillion and getting bigger each day. It is our government, no matter how looked at, and it is out of control with our spending. Both sides have got to stop the hateful actions and get to work making this a solid and well financed government once again. It was happening from WWII till late 1960 to 1970 days and has been steadily been getting further and further out of control since. It needs to be corrected soon or we become like Greece.
 
Dear Gawd this is starting to sound like AARP. Just one of the facts was that they invaded Afghanistan after 9/11. Because they were harboring terrorists? Even though the majority of the hijackers were Saudi or Egyptian...but no way would Dubya touch the Saudi's if he was sleeping with them. So that never made any sense to me. And the US is STILL in Afghanistan. Okay we took out Saddam. At what cost? Those people were probably doing better under his reign. Now the country has fallen apart and who will rebuild it? It's idiotic.
 
fureverywhere said:
Dear Gawd this is starting to sound like AARP. Just one of the facts was that they invaded Afghanistan after 9/11. Because they were harboring terrorists? Even though the majority of the hijackers were Saudi or Egyptian...but no way would Dubya touch the Saudi's if he was sleeping with them. So that never made any sense to me. And the US is STILL in Afghanistan. Okay we took out Saddam. At what cost? Those people were probably doing better under his reign. Now the country has fallen apart and who will rebuild it? It's idiotic.
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And again that was handled through permission of the UN and we stood then in place of England and others in Afghanistan. It was not invaded as some claim. We did eventually find one of our enemies and he was taken care of by the current government of the US. Most of the US has been leaving Afghanistan till recent times. Now I think they have held some back to help Afghanistan train others to do the jobs the US was busy doing.
 
Korea, Vietnam I was totally against these so call wars and the soldiers that didn't come back in one piece. What I cant understand is the young people of today also see the effect of these wars but continue to volunteer to serve their country. These youngsters REALLY need to look at the BIG picture before signing up today, is it worth an arm or a leg or both?
 
I have always felt that we should Not have a volunteer military....rather every young healthy person should be obligated to serve the nation in some capacity, for at least a year....and Every young person should be subject to be drafted into the military...That Includes even the children of the rich and the politicians. If our politicians, and 1%'ers had to face the possibility that their kids might be placed in harms way, they would be far more interested in finding lasting peaceful solutions to the world's problems.
 
re:rather every young healthy person should be obligated to serve the nation in some capacity, for at least a year.

I could go along with that.
 
Don M. said:
I have always felt that we should Not have a volunteer military....rather every young healthy person should be obligated to serve the nation in some capacity, for at least a year....and Every young person should be subject to be drafted into the military...That Includes even the children of the rich and the politicians. If our politicians, and 1%'ers had to face the possibility that their kids might be placed in harms way, they would be far more interested in finding lasting peaceful solutions to the world's problems.
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I agree with that, too, Don.
 
Don M. said:
I have always felt that we should Not have a volunteer military....rather every young healthy person should be obligated to serve the nation in some capacity, for at least a year....and Every young person should be subject to be drafted into the military...That Includes even the children of the rich and the politicians. If our politicians, and 1%'ers had to face the possibility that their kids might be placed in harms way, they would be far more interested in finding lasting peaceful solutions to the world's problems.
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I also agree.. and that there should be very little ways to get deferments. As you said.. those so eager to get OUR kids killed might think harder about it if their kids could be part of the fodder.
 
Many of those volunteers, like my son and daughter, had already finished college and been working. Just something they decided to do for themselves and for the country too, I guess.

Many of our volunteers choose the military as an open door to citizenship in the US. Not many years of political nonsense to get accepted. Do your service and have a pretty direct way to citizenship.

Even during our draft days many would sign up in a military of their choice before being drafted.
 
QuickSilver said:
I also agree.. and that there should be very little ways to get deferments. As you said.. those so eager to get OUR kids killed might think harder about it if their kids could be part of the fodder.
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Not sure the politicians do bother for their kids. VP has military child of one at least. Likely others children as well as other politicians have children in the military already.
 
Too many kids of the uber rich will get deferments for ingrown toenails... Look how Romney spent the Vietnam war... somewhere on a beach in the South of France.

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