I guess I have to leave bible knowledge to the holier than thous....

hangover

hangover

Member
That's what I was told by a holier than thou, because I mixed up bible characters. Not that I don't know about Abraham and Lot in Sodom and Gomorrah, my old pharts disease inadvertently put in Noah instead of in the flood story.

So I leave the bible to him and Pat Robertson. It's like the Scribes and Pharisees driving the masses away from the truth so they can have the prestigious places. I'm glad to take the back seat where Jesus sits.

But it saddens me that I was made the fool, so that he could defend someone that commits sexual assault on women, and demonizes decent people, and defends white supremacists, and commits conspiracy with Russians, and tells lie after lie. I'm demonized as being negative for suggesting that it may be Karma that is the reason for the disasters that keep coming on this country. But that's why the religious leaders demonized Jesus and sought to have him crucified, because he exposed the them as "sons of vipers".

I started this thread so as to not go off topic in another thread. So I leave the bible to the holier than thous. You know who you are.

So preach to us about Matthew 7: 18-23
 

hangover said:
That's what I was told by a holier than thou, because I mixed up bible characters. Not that I don't know about Abraham and Lot in Sodom and Gomorrah, my old pharts disease inadvertently put in Noah instead of in the flood story.

So I leave the bible to him and Pat Robertson. It's like the Scribes and Pharisees driving the masses away from the truth so they can have the prestigious places. I'm glad to take the back seat where Jesus sits.

But it saddens me that I was made the fool, so that he could defend someone that commits sexual assault on women, and demonizes decent people, and defends white supremacists, and commits conspiracy with Russians, and tells lie after lie. I'm demonized as being negative for suggesting that it may be Karma that is the reason for the disasters that keep coming on this country. But that's why the religious leaders demonized Jesus and sought to have him crucified, because he exposed the them as "sons of vipers".

I started this thread so as to not go off topic in another thread. So I leave the bible to the holier than thous. You know who you are.

So preach to us about Matthew 7: 18-23
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I thought the same thing as you did regarding the natural disasters of this year. Even though I don't believe in karma it's just really strange how all that happened after he was elected. If there was such a thing as karma, it would've washed him away instead or harming so many innocent people.
 

chic said:
I thought the same thing as you did regarding the natural disasters of this year. Even though I don't believe in karma it's just really strange how all that happened after he was elected. If there was such a thing as karma, it would've washed him away instead or harming so many innocent people.
Click to expand...

The Trumpets fail to realize that Trump is the head anti-climate changer. And all those that have made laws that allow corporations to pollute the air and water that warms the planet, have made those hurricanes. And Trump cutting funding to the Forest Service that fights those fires, causes more and worse wild fires. Colorado, Montana, Idaho, Washington, Oregon and California are having the worst fire season in their history this year.

There are consequences to every action....that's Karma.
 
The Bible may well be the "inspired Word of God". I will not claim it is or it isn't, since I'm not smart enough to read the minds of people who have been dead for centuries.

What I do know is that those who do believe in the Word, there seems to be a plethora of ways to interpret it. If all were to interpret what they read similarly we wouldn't have Catholics, Lutherans, Methodists, Baptists, etc. The scholars of the past couple of centuries cannot even agree on exactly what it says.

Then, you have the "cherry picking" of verses and the "taking out of context" opinions. It amazes me why someone who believes the Bible tells us homosexuality is wrong will be thrice married (committing adultery) will go to a barber and get their hair cut (definitely against Old Testament teachings) will work diligently to keep from assisting the poor and homeless (even though the Bible tells us to), etc., etc., etc. The most recent evidence of how differently people interpret the Bible was the benevolence... or lack thereof... of a billionaire preacher refusing to open his mega-church as a shelter for those driven from their homes. It took the media latching down on the issue and him knowing the checks may slow down supporting his lavish lifestyle if he failed to adhere to the very teachings he has made a fortune proclaiming.
 
hangover said:
That's what I was told by a holier than thou, because I mixed up bible characters. Not that I don't know about Abraham and Lot in Sodom and Gomorrah, my old pharts disease inadvertently put in Noah instead of in the flood story.

So I leave the bible to him and Pat Robertson. It's like the Scribes and Pharisees driving the masses away from the truth so they can have the prestigious places. I'm glad to take the back seat where Jesus sits.

But it saddens me that I was made the fool, so that he could defend someone that commits sexual assault on women, and demonizes decent people, and defends white supremacists, and commits conspiracy with Russians, and tells lie after lie. I'm demonized as being negative for suggesting that it may be Karma that is the reason for the disasters that keep coming on this country. But that's why the religious leaders demonized Jesus and sought to have him crucified, because he exposed the them as "sons of vipers".

I started this thread so as to not go off topic in another thread. So I leave the bible to the holier than thous. You know who you are.

So preach to us about Matthew 7: 18-23
Click to expand...

Interesting time for me to see this thread- last night I was reading a book where the author said claiming natural disasters etc. are 'God's will' or 'God's doing' is an insult to God. Author was a Catholic priest, I'm Jewish, and I agree with him. And I'm sure if you were to gather a bunch of average Presbyterians, Methodists, Episcopalians, etc., together, they'd agree too.
Seems in recent years, the term 'Christian' has been taken over by fundamentalists. You know, the folks that claimed the JFK assassination was 'God's wrath' over the Supreme Court taking prayer out of public schools. They're too widespread and have too much power to simply be ignored. As only one very serious example, if you have grandkids or other young family members in public schools, you need to know about this:
http://www.goodnewsclubs.info/abusiveshame.htm
It's been all over the U.S. for decades, but I knew nothing about it until I read a book called "The Good News Club."
 
Grumpy Ol' Man said:
The Bible may well be the "inspired Word of God". I will not claim it is or it isn't, since I'm not smart enough to read the minds of people who have been dead for centuries.

What I do know is that those who do believe in the Word, there seems to be a plethora of ways to interpret it. If all were to interpret what they read similarly we wouldn't have Catholics, Lutherans, Methodists, Baptists, etc. The scholars of the past couple of centuries cannot even agree on exactly what it says.

Then, you have the "cherry picking" of verses and the "taking out of context" opinions. It amazes me why someone who believes the Bible tells us homosexuality is wrong will be thrice married (committing adultery) will go to a barber and get their hair cut (definitely against Old Testament teachings) will work diligently to keep from assisting the poor and homeless (even though the Bible tells us to), etc., etc., etc. The most recent evidence of how differently people interpret the Bible was the benevolence... or lack thereof... of a billionaire preacher refusing to open his mega-church as a shelter for those driven from their homes. It took the media latching down on the issue and him knowing the checks may slow down supporting his lavish lifestyle if he failed to adhere to the very teachings he has made a fortune proclaiming.
Click to expand...

It's referred to as prooftexting. Some who do this claim the Holy Spirit tells them how to interpret passages in the Bible...
 
hangover said:
That's what I was told by a holier than thou, because I mixed up bible characters. Not that I don't know about Abraham and Lot in Sodom and Gomorrah, my old pharts disease inadvertently put in Noah instead of in the flood story.

So I leave the bible to him and Pat Robertson. It's like the Scribes and Pharisees driving the masses away from the truth so they can have the prestigious places. I'm glad to take the back seat where Jesus sits.

But it saddens me that I was made the fool, so that he could defend someone that commits sexual assault on women, and demonizes decent people, and defends white supremacists, and commits conspiracy with Russians, and tells lie after lie. I'm demonized as being negative for suggesting that it may be Karma that is the reason for the disasters that keep coming on this country. But that's why the religious leaders demonized Jesus and sought to have him crucified, because he exposed the them as "sons of vipers".

I started this thread so as to not go off topic in another thread. So I leave the bible to the holier than thous. You know who you are.

So preach to us about Matthew 7: 18-23
Click to expand...


I'm not sure what happened to you, but I can empathise with the sentiment.

I'm glad to take the back seat where Jesus sits.
Click to expand...

Very powerful statement, it doesn't get any better.
 
JaniceM said:
Interesting time for me to see this thread- last night I was reading a book where the author said claiming natural disasters etc. are 'God's will' or 'God's doing' is an insult to God. Author was a Catholic priest, I'm Jewish, and I agree with him. And I'm sure if you were to gather a bunch of average Presbyterians, Methodists, Episcopalians, etc., together, they'd agree too.
Seems in recent years, the term 'Christian' has been taken over by fundamentalists. You know, the folks that claimed the JFK assassination was 'God's wrath' over the Supreme Court taking prayer out of public schools. They're too widespread and have too much power to simply be ignored. As only one very serious example, if you have grandkids or other young family members in public schools, you need to know about this:
http://www.goodnewsclubs.info/abusiveshame.htm
It's been all over the U.S. for decades, but I knew nothing about it until I read a book called "The Good News Club."
Click to expand...
Positive and negative must be kept in perspective. God is positive, evil is negative. God doesn't do negative, but allows it to happen.

Evangelicals (so called fundamentalists) have made their religion the religion of America. Other religions such as Islam and Hindu and Buddhist are considered "fake" religions. But in their own bible it says that God created everything that exists....that includes all religions. So like ISIS, the fundi"s reject their own teachings.

"Never underestimate the power of large groups of stupid people."
 
hangover said:
Positive and negative must be kept in perspective. God is positive, evil is negative. God doesn't do negative, but allows it to happen.

Evangelicals (so called fundamentalists) have made their religion the religion of America. Other religions such as Islam and Hindu and Buddhist are considered "fake" religions. But in their own bible it says that God created everything that exists....that includes all religions. So like ISIS, the fundi"s reject their own teachings.

"Never underestimate the power of large groups of stupid people."
Click to expand...

It's refreshing to know that others recognize what has transpired with [some of]the fundamentalist Christian groups.

People that I know, love and respect have been led astray, and cannot be reasoned with, it's like the Taliban and ISIS for sure.
 
hangover said:
Positive and negative must be kept in perspective. God is positive, evil is negative. God doesn't do negative, but allows it to happen.

Evangelicals (so called fundamentalists) have made their religion the religion of America. Other religions such as Islam and Hindu and Buddhist are considered "fake" religions. But in their own bible it says that God created everything that exists....that includes all religions. So like ISIS, the fundi"s reject their own teachings.

"Never underestimate the power of large groups of stupid people."
Click to expand...

But not only 'non-Biblical' religions, the mainstream denominations are shot down, too.
 
I've just been reading about the doctor who is running for Governor of Michigan. If elected, he will be the first Muslim Governor in the United States. This link... https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...abdul-el-sayed-first-muslim-governor-michigan gives a pretty good synopsis of where the young man is coming from. OTOH, there is already some sites out there saying he is a representative of the Muslim Brotherhood and is pushing for Sharia Law to replace the Constitution.

I like the comparison the doctor makes between himself and JFK. My Grandmother was extremely upset when a Catholic was elected to the Presidency. She just knew the Pope would be taking over governance of the United States. If she could only be here and see the changes since.....

There is a long time to go before the Michigan election. If that state does elect a Muslim to their highest office, how do you think that will set with the "thumpers" down in the Bible Belt?
 
Grumpy Ol' Man said:
I've just been reading about the doctor who is running for Governor of Michigan. If elected, he will be the first Muslim Governor in the United States. This link... https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...abdul-el-sayed-first-muslim-governor-michigan gives a pretty good synopsis of where the young man is coming from. OTOH, there is already some sites out there saying he is a representative of the Muslim Brotherhood and is pushing for Sharia Law to replace the Constitution.

I like the comparison the doctor makes between himself and JFK. My Grandmother was extremely upset when a Catholic was elected to the Presidency. She just knew the Pope would be taking over governance of the United States. If she could only be here and see the changes since.....

There is a long time to go before the Michigan election. If that state does elect a Muslim to their highest office, how do you think that will set with the "thumpers" down in the Bible Belt?
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Personally, I don't care what anyone believes or believes in- it's their own business. However, if someone's being harmed by a practice, that's entirely different. And, in addition, 'pushing for' any other system to 'replace the Constitution' is something that must be stopped.
There's a Muslim who's been in local politics for quite a few years, to the best of my knowledge he's been doing a very good job- not trying to say his religious beliefs are going to replace the law.
 
JaniceM said:
Personally, I don't care what anyone believes or believes in- it's their own business. However, if someone's being harmed by a practice, that's entirely different. And, in addition, 'pushing for' any other system to 'replace the Constitution' is something that must be stopped.
There's a Muslim who's been in local politics for quite a few years, to the best of my knowledge he's been doing a very good job- not trying to say his religious beliefs are going to replace the law.
Click to expand...
Evangelical Christians have been trying to influence the laws of this country since the Scopes Monkey trial.
 
hangover said:
Positive and negative must be kept in perspective. God is positive, evil is negative. God doesn't do negative, but allows it to happen.
Click to expand...
Unlike plausible deniability

Plausible deniability is the ability of people (typically senior officials in a formal or informal chain of command) to deny knowledge of or responsibility for any damnable actions committed by others in an organizational hierarchy because of a lack of evidence that can confirm their participation, even if they were ...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plausible_deniability

I guess God would be people or at least a 4 &1/2 billion year old sentient being that doesn't do negative. Given the status accorded, God certainly would be the head in the chain of command. Unlike plausible deniability knowing and allowing is taking place.

I think it's bad karma to excuse negative actions.
 
Here's a link to a different point of view (if that's allowed on here....)
https://www.voiceofprophecy.com/arti...le-teach-karma and: http://biblereasons.com/karma/
Click to expand...

Hmmm....
I'm a Hinayama Buddhist and my Roman Catholic spouse enjoys daily studies on Mahayama Buddhism.

To say that karma and grace are two different things, is to misunderstand and/or twist what karma is. "As ye reap, so shall ye sow" is the essence of karma.

As my DH is fond of saying to people, "Intent is everything. If you do the 'right thing' but with the wrong intent in your heart, there is no 'grace' or 'rightness' to your action."

And that's why Joel Osteen, cited as an example above, would be recognized as a hypocrite no matter WHAT religion you belong to. Ego (leads to) Pride (leads to) Arrogance = every religion recognizes the wrongness of this.
 

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