My dad worked in a foundry when he was young and smoked. He became disabled and lived for 9 years at home. Always said "he and God had a deal". He always was able to read, play pool, shoot his long guns hunting, etc. and took care of himself right up till he took his last breath in his own bed.
LTC discussion and self-insure trust discussion
- Thread starter seniorpetra
- Start date
Some of the recent posts seem to question on the value of LTC for Nursing Home coverage. These arguments
have merit for some. I just want to point out the LTC policies (at least ours) includes Stay at Home lifetime benefits as well.
This means you can use all of the LTC lifetime benefits for home care for physical ( bathing, toileting, dressing, etc.) issues
or cognitive impairment such as alzheimer's.
have merit for some. I just want to point out the LTC policies (at least ours) includes Stay at Home lifetime benefits as well.
This means you can use all of the LTC lifetime benefits for home care for physical ( bathing, toileting, dressing, etc.) issues
or cognitive impairment such as alzheimer's.
Think that's really a good plan, unless of course it is too costly to maintain premiums. Do think the future will have more economical home care franchises and more visible assistance for home bound people of all ages, due to the growth rate of aging baby boomers. This should help most all of those who might need it.
Butterfly
SF VIP
- Location
- Albuquerque, New Mexico USA
Pills would be my first choice, as well. You've gotta know what you are doing to take enough of the right thing (or combination of things) to kill you, not throw them up, and not wind up a vegetable. That's why I said "if all else fails."
Butterfly
SF VIP
- Location
- Albuquerque, New Mexico USA
There are actually cleaning companies with teams of people who do nothing but clean up crime scenes, suicide scenes, etc. We had to hire one to clean up a scene in a rental property I once helped manage. They did a wonderful job and you would never have known anything happened there. They have special cleaning supplies that will get anything out of anything, even lovely hardwood floors. The people who do that make pretty good money, too, but I wouldn't have the stomach to do it.
mathjak107
Well-known Member
- Location
- bayside ,queens , ny
We did not buy our ny partnership plan for the 3 years coverage ...we bought it for the benefits and total asset protection once the insurance was up
Aunt Bea
SF VIP
- Location
- Near Mount Pilot
I'm a little bit leery of the quality of home care workers, I'm afraid that I would end up like Doris Duke or Brooke Astor.
I kind of like the idea of having a care team in a more structured environment.
It seems like it's a whole lot easier to get into this world than it is to get out of it.
StarSong
Awkward is my Superpower
- Location
- Los Angeles Suburbs
Boy do I ever agree with you on this! Most of the home care workers I've seen aren't worth beans, and far too many steal people blind.
What's happening around this area of Texas is that background checks and "bonding" is being done on those wanting to work, before hiring with a lot of the services...especially the franchises.
StarSong
Awkward is my Superpower
- Location
- Los Angeles Suburbs
Yes, they do that in CA also. Sadly, it's a pretty holey net that doesn't catch all the scoundrels. It also doesn't prevent previously honest caregivers from taking advantages of crimes of opportunity. Patients with failing cognitive abilities are unable to safeguard their information and valuables with rigorous judgement. Easy prey.
It becomes very difficult to prove or reconstruct how things happened. The family discovers that bank accounts have been cleaned out, valuables are missing, their relative can't remember who, what, when and where, and a caregiver or two has skipped town - or the country.
If it sounds like I know whereof I speak, it's because I saw this happen, up close and personal. Twice.
mikermeals
New Member
- Location
- Chicago
For the past 10 years we have been putting money monthly into a Vanguard Star fund which is a balanced fund and "should be" enough to take care of ltc. Most people have home health care these days to that is what we are counting on. I have monthly self funding in our retirement budget. Of course there are no guarantees but this is the plan so far.
mathjak107
Well-known Member
- Location
- bayside ,queens , ny
And if you have a stroke tomorrow then what ? Are you ready and financed ?
mikermeals
New Member
- Location
- Chicago
Yes I am still employed and have health insurance and other disability plans. Even Medicare covers the hospital/doctors and medicine. I look at LTC as nursing home/assisted living and home health care and hope I will have enough saved up for when I hit 85-95
mathjak107
Well-known Member
- Location
- bayside ,queens , ny
my question was more addressing what happens if you are like my co-worker ..he fell off a ladder painting and broke his wrist and hip .. at age 55 he had a stroke during hip surgery . he was left paralyzed and in a nursing home ... his family was impoverished at this point at 114k a year for the home..so crap happens at younger ages too .
after much thought about self insuring we went with a ny state partnership plan .
we wanted it not so much for the 3 years insurance , even though a snf is 120k-140k a year in our area , we wanted it for the perks after the insurance ran out .
no shifting of assets , full asset protection , pretty much full income protection for the stay at home spouse , a special version of medicaid picks up the bills after the insurance runs out .
i mentioned in another thread , the fact that money magazine did a feature story on us years ago .
they wanted to put their team of pro's against me since i did all my own planning .
i wanted to self insure and they were against it for so many reasons . they were right .
those who say they are self insuring really have no plan . they hope they don't need care and they hope they have the funds .
but once the stay at home spouse goes in to survival mode those funds become a battle ground usually .
the issue with self insuring is that like any insurance :
you need the funds to cover you day 1 . you have to invest that insurance money in a safe and secure fashion . it can not just be thrown in the pool of money generating your income since that assumes it can always go to zero doing so .
to self insure properly means safe low returns on that money .
for just a small percentage of the gains from keeping our money invested normally we can pay for a full blown , inflation adjusted policy that covers 3 years in a snf or 6 years assisted living or in home care .
so we ended up going the policy route .
most of our attorney's work today is the self insurer's . they are scrambling at the last minute trying to preserve assets and to protect the income of their spouse .
mikermeals
New Member
- Location
- Chicago
You are 100% correct. My plan is not for everyone.
treeguy64
Hari Om, y'all!
- Location
- Austin, TX.
LTC, for what? So you can live each boring, painful, unproductive day thinking about what your life used to be??? So you can regress to an almost infantile state wherein you'll have your diaper changed, your body bathed, your meals spoon-fed to you, as you vegetate in front of the TV screen? Hell no, not me!
To the poster who implied that those who talk about committing suicide never have the wherewithal to actually do so: I knew eight suicides, personally. They did what needed to be done. Three made a big mess, the other five thought things out and were no trouble to cart off.
When the times comes, if it does, I will neatly, and cleanly, make my exit, no big deal!
FWIW: Years ago, I did intense research into LTC policies. They were all a huge rip-off, and the fine print showed that you were never going to get the deal you were told you would get, by the selling agent.
To the poster who implied that those who talk about committing suicide never have the wherewithal to actually do so: I knew eight suicides, personally. They did what needed to be done. Three made a big mess, the other five thought things out and were no trouble to cart off.
When the times comes, if it does, I will neatly, and cleanly, make my exit, no big deal!
FWIW: Years ago, I did intense research into LTC policies. They were all a huge rip-off, and the fine print showed that you were never going to get the deal you were told you would get, by the selling agent.
StarSong
Awkward is my Superpower
- Location
- Los Angeles Suburbs
A terrifying prospect, to be sure. Even worse, so many lose their ability to process what's going on around them. They're frequently terrified, don't recognize family members, and disappear a little more each day. A terrible way to drift away from life.
I've often wondered about the validity of the long term care policies. The big selling point today seems to be "at home care". Did have a company client, that the VP (a woman) of the company became paralyzed and they had a policy that paid for an 8 hour caregiver daily for years. She finally died.
mathjak107
Well-known Member
- Location
- bayside ,queens , ny
all i know is we didn't buy our partnership plan for the three years coverage . we bought it for the asset protection and income protection it provides for ever once the insurance is up .
You know, I do think this is the main issue for most folks...protecting the remaining spouse's assets. Maybe its the "burden of riches"...lol. You can't take it with you so obviously, if you care about your spouse, you want to make them as comfortable as you can for their remaining years.
mathjak107
Well-known Member
- Location
- bayside ,queens , ny
for sure that is the reason ... i dont want my spouse to live an impoverished lifestyle ... my dad was in a home for 6 years . it was devastating
treeguy64
Hari Om, y'all!
- Location
- Austin, TX.
Get your will properly drawn up. You can do it yourself, if you're up on laws that apply in your state. Then, it's a simple matter of making sure your surviving mate gets your life insurance proceeds, the house goes into your mate's name as sole owner, and any other things of value become your mate's sole property. You don't need some rip-off LTC policy to do the preceding. If that's your thing, though, knock yourself out!
Don M.
SF VIP
- Location
- central Missouri
We took out a LTC policy almost 25 years ago. With our luck, if we have insurance, we almost never need it, but the first time we try to "save" on costs, that is usually what goes wrong. So, I'm hoping that all this money just goes down the drain, and we pass quickly.
My next priority is to get all our affairs in order, while we are still mentally alert, and probably set up a Trust with all our assets, for the kids, so that if/when we become incapacitated, and pass away, our kids don't have to go through all the hassles of "probate", etc.
My next priority is to get all our affairs in order, while we are still mentally alert, and probably set up a Trust with all our assets, for the kids, so that if/when we become incapacitated, and pass away, our kids don't have to go through all the hassles of "probate", etc.
mathjak107
Well-known Member
- Location
- bayside ,queens , ny
Life insurance does not help your spouse live until you are dead ..it does no good when she has depleted your assets down to a minimum and you are alive in the nursing home ...you Need to transfer assets five years before ,,what if it’s the spouse you transferred the assets to that needs the car ..this does not sound to good
treeguy64
Hari Om, y'all!
- Location
- Austin, TX.
If I need help living, I WILL be dead! Yeah, I know, suicide clause. Thing is, I don't actually need insurance to provide for my heirs. Alive in a nursing home??? Uh, that's not living!