Professor Akira Morita

[grahamg]

I hope people on this forum can follow this exchange taken from lets say "elsewhere" but thought it worth posting here as I've extracted (or attracted) some scorn from the "professional" who refuses to engage with any discussion on Professor Akira's views debunking "children's rights"

First their post explaining yet again their professional viewpoint, followed by my response followed by the angry response from the "Professional" (okay, - got that?).


The "Professional" writes, quote:

"In pointing out that there are more sides to a story than one, I am making an observation based on extensive experience. Not by any stretch of the imagination am I asking you a question."


grahamg's response, quote:

"Please "move on" as you are adding nothing to this thread are you (not a question BTW, just a statement).

Hopefully you'll find someone willing to take any notice of your "extensive experience" because you know I've read enough now - and for me reading anything "enriched" by your "extensive experience" feels a little like being told on other threads: "Hillary Lost" or "Trump won", "Get over it"

The "Professional" came back with this scornful post, quote:
"Oh you really can't hack someone standing up to you can you. You just want everyone to agree with you and pat you on the back saying 'poor you'. Afraid I'm not that easily convinced."

 

[grahamg]

More from the Professional

I hope people on this forum can follow this exchange taken from lets say "elsewhere" but thought it worth posting here as I've extracted (or attracted) some scorn from the "professional" who refuses to engage with any discussion on Professor Akira's views debunking "children's rights"

First their post explaining yet again their professional viewpoint, followed by my response followed by the angry response from the "Professional" (okay, - got that?).


The "Professional" writes, quote:

"In pointing out that there are more sides to a story than one, I am making an observation based on extensive experience. Not by any stretch of the imagination am I asking you a question."


grahamg's response, quote:

"Please "move on" as you are adding nothing to this thread are you (not a question BTW, just a statement).

Hopefully you'll find someone willing to take any notice of your "extensive experience" because you know I've read enough now - and for me reading anything "enriched" by your "extensive experience" feels a little like being told on other threads: "Hillary Lost" or "Trump won", "Get over it"

The "Professional" came back with this scornful post, quote:
"Oh you really can't hack someone standing up to you can you. You just want everyone to agree with you and pat you on the back saying 'poor you'. Afraid I'm not that easily convinced."

More from "my friend" the professional (someone with knowledge of domestic abuse cases and child abuse issues they say):
"No-one was arguing, least of all the other forum member and me. She posted a view, I asked her reasons for her view, she kindly gave me her reasons, which I agreed with - it's called 'discussion'.

Sorry if that disappoints you - you do seem to prefer conflict it has to be said, and your comment above (about "arguing") is just stirring."

The the professional came up with this (in response toi my saying my father would put them in their place):
"I don't think your dear old dad and his ways would worry me over much!

And it is you who insists on taking threads off-topic with your stirring and rhetoric when someone posts a view that is at variance with your proclamations.

Its pointless trying to discuss anything with you, and I know how much you suffer from lastworditis so the floor is all yours . ."

 

[grahamg]

More from "my friend" the professional _ I'm going to confuse you even more now as they're responding to another thread posted "elsewhere, on the subject of suicide. They are engaging with someone I'd decribe as a "rough diamond" who had somegood things to say on the topic in my view but the "Professional" thought otherwise as you will see:

Rough diamond, quote:
"It is of course an act of madness to imagine there is no other way than to kill yourself, if someone was driving me up the wall that badly Id' kill them. There is always an answer, just sit down and think things out, pick up your lap top and go round the world, there is always another way. If it really is the end and your faced with a death you want to avoid - then I understand - and say its your choice, but anyone troubled can message me any time and I promise to talk to them as soon as I can, just wait and be calm. I can promise you things are always better than they seem and if life has been that rough then I make it better.
Please excuse me for high-jacking this thread, it may be annoying, please be understanding...."

The "Professional" wrote:
"There may 'always be an answer' - but for some people it's not always possible to see that answer, or any other way out than suicide.

Promising someone that there is always another way is making a promise that you may not be able to keep as you can't possible know if, for them, there is another way. Promising you can make things better for someone is also wrong - you may not be able to. What happens when you can't keep those promises? You are letting an already very vulnerable person down - that could be the final straw. You probably didn't intend it, but to be honest your post above rather makes light of the situation - and solution - for people who are genuinely considering suicide. It's a far more complex situation than just being fed up and needing to talk."


Rough diamond wroite:
"I cannot agree or disagree. I have both been a carer for many years, and lost a good friend to this dark cloud, but you do not need to know the bible backwards to be a good Samaritan...or know how dark it can be to hold a lamp. I do not claim to be the font of all knowledge, just a clown with a heart...."

. ."

I hope all this stuff does make some sense to someone. I'm mainly posting it here because I want to highlight the behaviour of someone claiming to be a "professional" who seeks to put the other person down and always seems to have the conceit to believe they are right and can pontificate upon others lives with profound consequences (if they really are a professional they could be deciding whether you get to see your child again for example).

 

[grahamg]

This wont make any sense to anyone and please tell me to stop if you think I should....

Once again I want to highlight the behaviour of someone claiming to be a "professional" who seeks to put the other person down and always seems to have the conceit to believe they are right and can pontificate upon others lives with profound consequences (if they really are a professional they could be deciding whether you get to see your child again for example).

Taken from "elsewhere" a conversation about relationships with our ex.'s:

The professional wrote:
"Two of us on this presently short thread (written elsewhere) have said we are still friends with our ex, so it's perfectly possible."

A friendly Welsh person wrote:
"Theoretically it shouldn't be possible to divorce someone you still get on well with, as divorce here in the U.K.(I don't know about other countries) is based on irreconcilable differences (covers a multitude of sins) and if you are able to remain as friends then clearly those differences were not irreconcilable and you should not have been granted a divorce."

The professional wrote:
"I'm afraid that I saw my husband having an affair and then beating me when I confronted him with it as pretty irreconcilable - maybe you think differently?

Quite apart from that, we married very young, and had been growing apart for several years, added to which a career change at almost 40 gave me the confidence (and income) to call our marriage a day. Once we had both established new lives we were able to get on fine although we don't see each other very often. We still have two sons and five grandchildren and family life is much easier if there is no ill-feeling."

The friendly Welsh person wrote:
"I agree with you, that you had plenty of justification for divorce....don't see any justification for remaining on friendly terms with him."

The professional wrote:
"Well as I said, we have children and grandchildren, it makes life easier for them if we all get along. Plus I have a much better life and marriage now and life is too short to be bitter."

 

[grahamg]

As no one has so far said STOP I will now give you my late mother's views, written when my now thirty two year old daughter was about eleven or twelve:

"I am writing to say how much I enjoy the company of Graham and my granddaughter.

Graham is my eldest son. I feel his family ties mean a lot to him. He has found the break up of his marriage distressing. He has often brought his daughter for Sunday lunch and a few hours relaxation with her grandad and I.

My granddaughter is a lovely girl, very caring, capable, sensible and mature with a good sense of humour. She shows much talent with handicrafts, tapestry and sewing etc. which her grandad jokes she can do with one eye whilst watching the television with the other. She enjoys games and puzzles, her attitude to life is very well balanced.

I have asked her sometimes what would you like to see, where would you like to go, and her reply would usually be "nowhere, I am just happy here."

She is sensitive to the pressures of a devision of loyalties and realises how frustrating the situation can be. One Sunday she said "It was not right she should be upset in this way!" I tried to explain it was no fault of hers or mine, and I too feel as she does and wish everyone would be agreeable. I said we must make the best of it and not to worry too much as time will probably make things better. I will always love her very much and am so pleasd to be her grandma.

I know it means alot to Graham being able to see his daughter and the happiness of them both is very important to me. I do hope this problem can be resolved amicably."

 

[grahamg]

Some more thoughts........

As no one has so far said STOP I will now give you some more thoughts, or a discussion taking place "elsewhere" which has some relevence here"

."

Another forum member "elsewhere".

"Graham, there were a number of factors that brought down Rome. And this is a red herring to the point I disagreed on, namely that youth is morally corrupt and woe to society. I pointed to an overall arrow of progress both technologically and morally. Ok, you've accepted technological progress but have a bone of contention with moral progress. Here I say look at things like the Enlightenment, the abolishment of slavery, and the rise of liberal democracies extending and defending human rights, education, free speech, emancipation of women, and social welfare etc.

So, I'd have to remain in disagreement with your view that there has been no moral progress, and strongly assert that there has been, overall, an upward rising arrow of moral progress." [/quote]


Grahamg's response:

"As mates on this forum or at least in agreement about most things it does make things easier for us I feel when we might disagree.
For example I could post my list of things I feel show a deterioration in "morals" or "ethics" (or both), to counter your list, but I'm only going to do so half heartedly, for reasons I'll try to explain later.

I could mention the numbers of children being brought up with at least one parent who is not their own biological parent (I used to use the term "real parent" but that term "real" has been corrupted to mean something else nowadays) - how much do you think that situation helps their moral upbringing at least, with their most obvious role models being unable to stay together "for their benefit" (as my favourite guru Desmond Morris asserted in his books, Human Zoo, Naked Ape and so on). My snippet of evidence on this score concerns my own daughter who used to say aged eleven that when she married, if she wasn't happy she would just get divorced, and my response to her was that if she thought she should go into marriage with the attitude she could always pull out why get married in the first place?

Not the strongest evidence I know and "you'll have to take my word for its voracity" . However, I do have some more examples from a book written by Julia Tugenhat called "What children and young people can tell us about separation and divorce" where she found about a dozen or so children who were prepared to confide in her their feelings (the most significant finding in my view was that the children who said initially "I'm not bothered about my dad" then when she dug a bit deeper she found out just how much some of them were bothered.

I'm just watching a UK show called "The Wright stuff" and in the interlude between adverts they asked the question "What is the number one complaint by diners in restaurants?" - Answer "Unruly children" I'm afraid.

Now I acknowledge the things you listed are of a different order of magnitude to my current list of one or two aspects (just to remind everyone of your list it included "human rights, education, free speech, emancipation of women, and social welfare.....").
BUT if you and another forum member are indeed right then how do you explain why I'm told by there has been an "Infantilisation of citizenship" (at least in the UK, where for example there are "no legal rights" as in written legal rights for parents in this country as opposed to "common law rights" - sorry complex argument there). I will have to seek out the author of the paper talking about this infantilisation for you but it is fair for me to say that if there has been such progress "morally" in our children over generations why at the same time have rights for them as parents been removed if they are now so morally upstanding?

Last night there was an excellent BBC programme about the Lake District fells and the man who was acting as the guide, who had lived in that area all his life, commented that there had been a deterioration in "community spirit" during his lifetime. Again, just a small piece of evidence of a deterioration in behaviour but as we were not alive in the era he was talking about it is wrong just to dismiss his thinking isnt it? My mother said similar things in her lifetime too, or when she was a young girl/young woman, before there was so much tv, and then how much the threat posed by Nazi Germany brought people together in the UK.
No one can say what will happen next in this world but if the election of you know who does fit the maxim I was taught at school, i.e. "We get the leaders we deserve ultimately" then that might worry anyone feeling there is truth in that statement.

Its absolutely fine that we should think differently on this topic of course, and I know I'm quite happy to be out on a limb so far as my ideas are concerned nowadays.