@911 This dude is laughable concerning Pennsylvania v. Mimms. Chile Decastro has two warrants out for him in Ohio. He gets arrested on purpose then sues the police. The suit in Ironton Ohio was dismissed, he failed to plead properly. You can key in his name and get a track listing of his public documents. He cites as the Holding, an incorrect snip from Terry v. Ohio, yet he claims to be a Constitutional law scholar?? Ha! Opinion here!
Question for 911
- Thread starter ohioboy
- Start date
PeppermintPatty
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They enjoy Qualified Immunity to suits, it can be quashed though to prevail, this is of course fact specific.
againstthegrain
Senior Member
- Location
- Sun Valley, ID
The narrator claims the police had no justification to pat him down? Well that is speculative. He was not there.
A search conducted prior to Judicial authorization (warrantless) is "Presumptively unreasonable" under the 4th Amendment. The Canine sniff was the on scene justification, but can still be challenged.
Now, there may be a challenge to the length of the detention? A traffic stop must be concluded in a reasonable time. If they prolonged the detention to request a K-9 outside the time it would have taken to issue a citation, the 4th AM is triggered.
The mother was ordered to back away. The police said she was on private property, it quite appeared she was not in a proximity to interfere, regardless of the narrator pointing out they have a right to do so. They do, but the reason she was on PP is moot as far as an interference charge.
A search conducted prior to Judicial authorization (warrantless) is "Presumptively unreasonable" under the 4th Amendment. The Canine sniff was the on scene justification, but can still be challenged.
Now, there may be a challenge to the length of the detention? A traffic stop must be concluded in a reasonable time. If they prolonged the detention to request a K-9 outside the time it would have taken to issue a citation, the 4th AM is triggered.
The mother was ordered to back away. The police said she was on private property, it quite appeared she was not in a proximity to interfere, regardless of the narrator pointing out they have a right to do so. They do, but the reason she was on PP is moot as far as an interference charge.
againstthegrain
Senior Member
- Location
- Sun Valley, ID
The officer resigned, the mayor had new police accountability procedures implemented, and the subject won his suit against the PD. I'd say that is a clean sweep and clear evidence the dept was corrupt.
Here is the decision. Ah, the complaint seems clear, (par.2). The officer did a compartment search without a warrant, found nothing. THEN, summoned a K-9. Exactly my prior point about a prolonged stop!
https://casetext.com/case/lea-v-conrad
https://casetext.com/case/lea-v-conrad
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I read this story---DeCastro
I don't believe the police acted improperly or denied DeCastro his rights. The building closes at a certain time, it's a public building that has closing hours listed in a place that all could plainly see. Failure to abide by the request to vacate the building would (could) be cause to arrest for trespass, along with other charges, depending on his actions. The police seemed to act in a reasonable and professional manner.
I also reread the story and kind of think that DeCastro staged the situation to act as an aid in his case. When people file a lawsuit and "ask" for a predetermined amount of money such as this person did, it's always interesting to hear them tell the court how they arrived at the amount of damages they are seeking. I have heard some doozies of stories during my time. How does he feel he is entitled to $1,000,000.00? These would be punitive damages and I don't see where he was placed in any harm to receive any compensation.
As for Constitutional laws, the PSP always refers those cases to the local DA's office. We are not lawyers and don't want to act like one, but those of us that have been around long enough have seen many of these types of cases and I can only remember 2 cases where any damages were awarded.
I don't believe the police acted improperly or denied DeCastro his rights. The building closes at a certain time, it's a public building that has closing hours listed in a place that all could plainly see. Failure to abide by the request to vacate the building would (could) be cause to arrest for trespass, along with other charges, depending on his actions. The police seemed to act in a reasonable and professional manner.
I also reread the story and kind of think that DeCastro staged the situation to act as an aid in his case. When people file a lawsuit and "ask" for a predetermined amount of money such as this person did, it's always interesting to hear them tell the court how they arrived at the amount of damages they are seeking. I have heard some doozies of stories during my time. How does he feel he is entitled to $1,000,000.00? These would be punitive damages and I don't see where he was placed in any harm to receive any compensation.
As for Constitutional laws, the PSP always refers those cases to the local DA's office. We are not lawyers and don't want to act like one, but those of us that have been around long enough have seen many of these types of cases and I can only remember 2 cases where any damages were awarded.
I do have issues with the court's ruling in this case and the behavior of the Officers mentioned in the complaint. They could (should) have acted in a more professional manner and just because a driver makes an improper (?) turn does not give the police the right to search a vehicle without probable cause. Did they smell alcohol or drugs on the suspect or in his vehicle? Did they visibly see any drugs or alcohol out in the open? Do they really have this type of training? I doubt it or the black Officers on the force would say something.
In some cases I have sat in on, I have heard a judge say that just because the Plaintiff didn't properly do this or that excuses the actions of the defendants. The judge may ask them to refile or make changes during a recess, but judges don't always dismiss just because a sentence was not written properly or missed. Judges that really care want to get it right.
In this case, this Plaintiff did suffer damages that need to be corrected. (IMO)
ohioboy--I will be expecting corrections, so please do. Like I stated earlier, I am not a constitutional person. When I performed my duties, I knew how far I could go and after that, the DA got the case. One other thing. If there was a time when anything I was about to do was questionable, I backed away from it until I got the answers I needed to continue.
PeppermintPatty
đź”· đź’ś đź”·
Thanks, PeppermintPatty. I don’t like to criticize other police officers. Many of these small community police departments don’t have the money to send their Officers for training. “Most” training at the FBI is free, but some do have a charge and some of their training classes require overnight stays because they last 2-3 days. Small departments don’t allow for them to spend over their budgets. My opinion is they try to stay just under the radar by doing the minimum requirements.
Even if they go to college for advanced Criminal Justice is another expense that these departments just don’t have money set aside. It’s really a shame. I often wonder what they do when they are visited by the Inspectors and find out they are not receiving training. There are requirements for the Officers to complete to stay compliant.
Even if they go to college for advanced Criminal Justice is another expense that these departments just don’t have money set aside. It’s really a shame. I often wonder what they do when they are visited by the Inspectors and find out they are not receiving training. There are requirements for the Officers to complete to stay compliant.
Training of course is paramount. It would though vastly improve the system if police would do their job under the simple common sense approach also, like you said you did 911. The good faith exception is one example. The police exercise fair judgment in a function that would admit evidence under the Exclusionary Rule, where ordinarily it would not be.
Some training is a must from the FBI. The department is put on notice when Officers are no longer complaint and that will sometimes be cause for an inspection. To fail an inspection could cause the small police department their registration to stay online, so to speak.
But, you are correct. We all need the same training so that we can all be consistent when applying the rules of the road. Making stuff up is never good for anyone. Like the man that made an illegal left-hand turn. That in of itself does not allow the Officer permission to search a vehicle without probable cause. If I pull a driver over and then want to issue a warning, that's fine. When doing so, if I see a weapon or a bag of weed, now I can search the vehicle as long as it was out in the open for all to see.
It must be nice to be so well educated with the Constitution. Although while I was an active PSP, we did not study the Constitution. There were times when a Constitutional issue would arise, it would be brought to our attention. There are 2 rules we follow closely. 1. Be sure we have probable cause. 2. Be aware of any present dangers.
When I did a routine traffic stop, we didn’t look at it as a “routine” stop. Each time we made a stop, we ran the tag. Today, we have the ability to do that without calling it in. Each police vehicle is equipped with its own computer that is wired directly to PennDot. It only takes about 2 minutes to get a full report of the owner and the vehicle. If there are no wants or warrants, we approach the vehicle cautiously looking for anything suspicious or out if the ordinary. If the owner is not the driver, we also run his/her license.
Police can be sued if we do bodily arm without provocation (verbal or physical), or wrongful death. People believe their only responsibility to the cop that stops them is to show them ID, registration and proof of insurance. That’s wrong. If there has been a crime committed in the area, the police can go so far as setting up a roadblock, or even a DUI checkpoint. If while speaking with the driver, we see contraband in the car or a weapon, we will have the driver step out first.The public has the right to reasonable expectations that only qualified and legal drivers are on the road with them.
Ohioboy, you are correct. The man in the video is going to give his fellow drivers a headache with his disinformation. Believe me, I and my fellow Troopers aren’t so bored that we would just routinely make stops. That causes issues beyond what you can imagine. We did have a few zealous, young Troopers out of the Academy that tried to flex their muscle, but they soon found out doing unreasonable stops is a bad idea.
Best idea always is that when ordered to do something by a cop, just comply. If you feel that you were violated, file a complaint. You won’t be harassed or face any consequences by another cop later. We don’t do that. Do we make mistakes or screw up? Sure, we are humans and it does happen.
I never dealt with any K-9, but I do know the handlers have a set of rules they must follow. We had this really great dog that could sniff out just about any drug. One night, we were set up for a DUI checkpoint and the dog was used in case we would have a potential drug runner. I can’t remember anytime when we would arrest anyone for holding MJ with less than a few ounces.
We had been checking vehicles when a black Cadillac Escalade pulled up. The Trooper at the front was going to wave him through when the Sgt. yelled to hold the Escalade. The Sgt. asked the driver if he could check his car and he agreed and stepped out. He looked through everything and told the driver he could go. The dog just happen to be walking past the Escalade with his handler to get to the car in front when “she” stopped, sat down and was barking like crazy. The Sgt. said there was nothing there. The dog was barking at the left rear tire. We called for a tow truck, took the tire off and had the tow truck driver remove the tire from the wheel. Inside the tire was 2 pounds of Coke. Not a gold mine of cache, but the dog did her job. Ran the man’s license and found he was already on parole for a drug violation.
As of 2021, PA is the only state not to have decriminalized MJ.
Ohioboy—-I want to thank you for the Constitutional information that you share with us. Way too often, issues would come up that involved Constitution issues that would always leave me in the dark until the DA involved him/or herself.