She's 75 and getting evicted

seadoug said:
I'm assuming that because GM declared bankruptcy they were allowed to take away pensions to remain solvent. If I recall, they were bailed out by the government during the Great Recession in 2008. Pensions have very different rules in the US vs. the UK. Sad state of affairs.
Click to expand...
Makes me wonder how much GM made with this move.
 

seadoug said:
I'm assuming that because GM declared bankruptcy they were allowed to take away pensions to remain solvent. If I recall, they were bailed out by the government during the Great Recession in 2008. Pensions have very different rules in the US vs. the UK. Sad state of affairs.
Click to expand...
That can happen here . it's what the sex predator Ghislaine Maxwells' father Robert Maxwell did to all his employees.. stole all their pensions.... and spent it on Yachts and high living... however they were private pensions.. ( kind of like 401K's in the US)... and much as that was devastating to the employees they still had their State pensions, so they were not going to starve or lose their homes...

is that not the same in the US ?..do you not have state old age pensions ?:unsure:
 
hollydolly said:
That can happen here . it's what the sex predator Ghislaine Maxwells' father Robert Maxwell did to all his employees.. stole all their pensions.... and spent it on Yachts and high living... however they were private pensions.. ( kind of like 401K's in the US)... and much as that was devastating to the employees they still had their State pensions, so they were not going to starve or lose their homes...

is that not the same in the US ?..do you not have state old age pensions ?:unsure:
Click to expand...
To my knowledge, the only State pensions are for public sector employees. The rest are through companies, and they are few and far between these days. The vast majorities are 401k's. That is the reason someone who is 88 would have received a pension. My father received a pension, but it was from his employment in the 70's. Most companies no longer offer them.
 

seadoug said:
To my knowledge, the only State pensions are for public sector employees. The rest are through companies, and they are few and far between these days. The vast majorities are 401k's. That is the reason someone who is 88 would have received a pension. My father received a pension, but it was from his employment in the 70's. Most companies no longer offer them.
Click to expand...
ok... let me think this through.... so what happens if someone has never worked outside of the house like a stay at home housewife/mother... ... or has only ever worked minimal wage...so there was no pension pt to pay into... or what about the feckless who have simply never held down a job.. what happenes when they get to pension ages..(retirment age).. don't they get a state pension?

let me explain, here in the Uk the employed regardless of earnings over £12,750 must pay an Insurance contribution which is taken directly from salaries by employers to give to the government, the employer also adds a contribution to it albeit small .. Taxes are also taken out.. the average amount deducted in total from a Gross salary is approx a third, unless you earn less than £12,750.. or more than (i think ) £125k...where the tax is somewhere around 40% on the latter

The insurance deduction is what pays for everyone's state pension when they retire. The state pension is very low, but it is paid.. and it approximately £900.00 per month after the age of 66...
Now everyone is entitled to that.. peope who have paid a lower contribution or none at all will get slightly reduced pension... but everyone gets it...and that includes people who have never worked a day in their lives ( unfairly iMO .. but thems' the rules)

.so what you're tellling me if I'm understanding this correctly is there's nothing like the state pension in the USA ?.
 
OldOld said:
Depending on what you mean by "taking care”. No the government will not babysit you. But the programs are there for you to utilize them. And there are social workers and case managers to coordinate things for a fee, billable to you or to the goverment social service.
Click to expand...
In the Netherlands it depends on if you were lucky enough to get a cheap government house.

Most older people here have either money enough and a pension or they have a cheap govt house and 1400 a month plus a few 100 extra from the govt when they get 67, whether they worked or not and the govt house rent is 650 or so.

But if their ex took the cheap fatzo house, there are no cheap houses anymore, they live with their parents or on a cheap holiday park or on the street. An older guy here asked very politely for some money. So unfair. He has no cheap house so he lives on the street and if he were on drugs he'd be taken care of, but now they're like: take care of yourself. He had slept in the cold a few days cause it costs 4 euro to get a place to sleep.

They do get some govt money though. But so unfair. I know a lazy bum who hasnt worked a day since he was 20 something, for 30 years. He lives in a fatzo house for 300, smokes pot and gets a fancy govt income.
 
The Chinese honor and care for their elderly and do so lovingly.

To answer Holly's question, we have Social Security. It is a Trust fund begun in the 30s for workers to draw from after they retire from their jobs or become too injured or ill to work. Alas, our corrupt politicians have borrowed from this trust for various reasons, but never paid back the loan. Now, when we complain about this, we are accused of wanting entitlements from the government. This trust is not and entitlement. It is our hard earned money that has been held and invested over the years for us. I'll say no more about all this as it gets political.
 
When my pension was ‘taken away’, the first time, the company was required to use the accrued benefit to buy an annuity with a fixed payment that started when I turned 65.

The second time my accrued benefit was transferred to a notional account that I was able to cash in when I left the company.

We also have a government pension guarantee fund that has helped many people salvage some retirement benefits from failed companies.

About PBGC | Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation

These days retirement income for many of us is a patchwork of small amounts from several sources.
 
@hollydolly …our social security system works a bit like your state pension. I am sure someone else will clarify just exactly the figures. But you or if you are married must of paid into the system for a minimum amount of time to draw anything. This is not exactly the same thing as a pension in the Usa.
Pensions were (are) offered as part of employment packages by certain companies or government entities. I have a very good friend who receives a very nice pension which includes healthcare insurance from the state of alaska…plus draws social security. Another good friend gets a pension from Indian Health Services because she worked in that system…also collects social security
. I have social security, and no pension. 401k and 403b are funded by pretax dollars by the recipient themselves. 402k may have some employer matching funds…this is part of the employment package and varies from each employer.
 
Lewkat said:
The Chinese honor and care for their elderly and do so lovingly.

To answer Holly's question, we have Social Security. It is a Trust fund begun in the 30s for workers to draw from after they retire from their jobs or become too injured or ill to work. Alas, our corrupt politicians have borrowed from this trust for various reasons, but never paid back the loan. Now, when we complain about this, we are accused of wanting entitlements from the government. This trust is not and entitlement. It is our hard earned money that has been held and invested over the years for us. I'll say no more about all this as it gets political.
Click to expand...
this is exactly the protests that go up among pensioners when the govt tries in any way to tax or remove the state pension by classing it as a ''benefit''..menaing social security benefit, like the dole... when in fact it's been paid for by us our whole working lives and is not a benefit...
 
Muskrat said:
@hollydolly ….I forgot to mention that we pay into social security with every paycheck and so does our employer. An unemployed housewife gets a portion of her husband’s amount. Amounts vary for social security….the more you payed in the higher your benefit.
Click to expand...
so there's no reason for someone to be working like that 88 year old man..? he will be getting some kind of pension from the state ?..is that correct ?
 
Muskrat said:
@hollydolly …our social security system works a bit like your state pension. I am sure someone else will clarify just exactly the figures. But you or if you are married must of paid into the system for a minimum amount of time to draw anything. This is not exactly the same thing as a pension in the Usa.
Pensions were (are) offered as part of employment packages by certain companies or government entities. I have a very good friend who receives a very nice pension which includes healthcare insurance from the state of alaska…plus draws social security. Another good friend gets a pension from Indian Health Services because she worked in that system…also collects social security
. I have social security, and no pension. 401k and 403b are funded by pretax dollars by the recipient themselves. 402k may have some employer matching funds…this is part of the employment package and varies from each employer.
Click to expand...
we have similar, in that many employers offer a private pension... I have a small one.. and my X husband when he retires.. will have a very nice one.. and he will also have his state pension on top... which means in effect that he could 'earn'' as much sitting at home as he did when he worked.. or even more.. but the vast majority of pesnioners in the UK of our age didn't have private pensions availability within their jobs, and so have to reply on the state pension when they retire... and because it;s small... some people do choose to work into their old age... but usually only a parttime job to top up their benefit
 
Aunt Bea said:
When my pension was ‘taken away’, the first time, the company was required to use the accrued benefit to buy an annuity with a fixed payment that started when I turned 65.

The second time my accrued benefit was transferred to a notional account that I was able to cash in when I left the company.

We also have a government pension guarantee fund that has helped many people salvage some retirement benefits from failed companies.

About PBGC | Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation

These days retirement income for many of us is a patchwork of small amounts from several sources.
Click to expand...
this is also the case here for people who didn't accrue enough in Insurance contributions during their working life. For example to gain the maximum penion, an employee has to pay contirbutions for 35 years by the time they retire ... many people didn't manage to do that for various reasons... for example, stay at home mothers.. who might have a gap of 15 years by the time they returned to work... or anyone who worked part-time.. etc...so instead they get a reduced state pension..

To bring that up to near a full pension.. they are given pension credits, and that incudes, things like free dental, free eye test.. help with the cost of council tax ( Rates)... and a little help with heating costs in the winter
 
Last edited:
Cynic that I am, I have some doubts about the story of the 88 year old man. It would not be the first time when somebody made up a story and cashed in on a go-fund-me type of account.

First, he has been and is now collecting social security, perhaps not enough but something. Medicare coverage begins at age 65; not the best health insurance around but it's now only about $185/month and is fairly good at that price (although the premium has gone up and will probably continue to do so). Also, the best that a bill collector can do is place a lien against your house; the only entities that can take your house are the mortgage company for non-payment and the property tax collector. It is possible, though, that taxes and insurance forced him to sell.

So the details we have been given, IMHO, don't add up. Do I feel for him? Yes. But is it possible this is, at least partly, a scam? Yes.

Do you know that Go Fund Me keeps 10% of all donations? I knew someone who was diagnosed with cancer, no insurance. A GFM account was set up and I was going to send $500. Until I read the fine print that said they will keep $50 of that $500. I walked to his house and handed him the $500. (This was 7 years ago; maybe that has changed since then.)
 
OldOld said:
Don't believe everything you read on AI without verifiable source. Many statements from AI are just its hallucinations. I have said in another thread that, if AI is a real human being, this person would be in jail or be rejected by the society already. There is a case where a depressed teenager in San Francisco, committed suicide. During the process, chatgpt told this teenager not to tell the mother. This mothe filed a lawsuit against OpenAI.
Click to expand...
I actually just learned the term AI hallucinations the other day. (y)
 
hollydolly said:
this is exactly the protests that go up among pensioners when the govt tries in any way to tax or remove the state pension by classing it as a ''benefit''..menaing social security benefit, like the dole... when in fact it's been paid for by us our whole working lives and is not a benefit...
Click to expand...
In the Netherlands the basic amount everyone gets is a benefit and on top of that can come a pension they and their employer paid for themselves. But it would be antisocial to now take away their benefits cause they paid loads of taxes in their life to take care of their elderly and anyone who didn't work, kids money for other people's kids. The only ones who want to stop giving them that are some complainers on forums though. There's not one party that wants to do that.
 
Dr.Colosso said:
In the Netherlands the basic amount everyone gets is a benefit and on top of that can come a pension they and their employer paid for themselves. But it would be antisocial to now take away their benefits cause they paid loads of taxes in their life to take care of their elderly and anyone who didn't work, kids money for other people's kids. The only ones who want to stop giving them that are some complainers on forums though. There's not one party that wants to do that.
Click to expand...
so everyone of pension age gets an allowance of 1400 Euros a month, is that right ?.. everyone gets the same regradless of circumstance ?:unsure:
 
Planning or no planning, on a wing and a prayer, by the seat of our pants, we all seem to make it.

That is what I find so interesting.

It’s been my experience that most of the pain and discomfort is during the period of adjustment from one standard of living to another but once the income and expenses are in synch, a routine develops and we adjust to our new normal.
 
Lewkat said:
The Chinese honor and care for their elderly and do so lovingly.
Click to expand...
Traditionally, yes that's true. Under the CPC, however, it is NOT. The single child policy is now viewed as a cultural and sociologic failure, and the CPC has a very weak and minimal social safety net.

It has been known since the 1980's that China's population was aging faster than any other nation in the world, which is why Deng made such a push to merge Western capitalism into China. Sadly, the wealth gained has simply ossified into a small number of well-connected (i.e., meaning corrupt) political families.

Some of the fanciest homes in Australia (and elsewhere, including the US) are owned by Chinese 'civil servants'. One of them makes the US equivalent of $12K/yr. However, in 2019 he paid almost $5M for a massive mansion with ocean views in Australia's most exclusive neighborhood. It's one of three overseas homes he owns.

Per Google AI:
The "4-2-1 problem" in China refers to a demographic challenge arising from the one-child policy, where a single child must support two parents and four grandparents. This creates a significant social and financial burden on the one working-age person in the family, as they are responsible for the care of six elders and two parents while their own career and family are still in their prime. This situation has contributed to social concerns, financial strain, and a rapidly aging population, as well as influencing the government's decision to eventually relax the one-child policy.

The "relaxing" of the one-child policy has been a dismal failure. The Millennial and Gen Alpha Chinese are, in fact, negative on marriage. They have an extremely high unemployment rate despite being college graduates, many in the STEM fields.
 
Last edited:
GoodEnuff said:
Cynic that I am, I have some doubts about the story of the 88 year old man. It would not be the first time when somebody made up a story and cashed in on a go-fund-me type of account.

First, he has been and is now collecting social security, perhaps not enough but something. Medicare coverage begins at age 65; not the best health insurance around but it's now only about $185/month and is fairly good at that price (although the premium has gone up and will probably continue to do so). Also, the best that a bill collector can do is place a lien against your house; the only entities that can take your house are the mortgage company for non-payment and the property tax collector. It is possible, though, that taxes and insurance forced him to sell.

So the details we have been given, IMHO, don't add up. Do I feel for him? Yes. But is it possible this is, at least partly, a scam? Yes.

Do you know that Go Fund Me keeps 10% of all donations? I knew someone who was diagnosed with cancer, no insurance. A GFM account was set up and I was going to send $500. Until I read the fine print that said they will keep $50 of that $500. I walked to his house and handed him the $500. (This was 7 years ago; maybe that has changed since then.)
Click to expand...
I saw it in the paper now too. He had to sell his house when his wife got sick cause then the pension stopped and he had to pay her medical bills himself.

"The thing that hurt me the most was when my wife was really sick and when they took the pension, they also took the healthcare coverage and all but $10,000 of my life insurance"

Army vet Ed Bambas, 88, will receive $1.5M in donations in surprise ceremony at work after internet rallied to help him retire
 
Dr.Colosso said:
As a basis yes and the ones who get a pension get that on top, but the ones who don't have a pension get extra money for their house and heating.
Click to expand...
Simialr to here, except people don't get all the same basic amount... the full State pension for a couple is £460. 50 per week... or less if one or both haven't got a full 35 years Insurance contributions by the time they reach 66..

A single person's pension is... £230.25.... again dependent on the ful contributions.. .. anyone receiving full state pesnion gets no help on top...

People who receive a reduced state pension due to less than 35 years of contibrutions.. get rent, council tax paid or a portions of... and help with mortgage interest payments, .. and free dental treatment and eye tests
 

You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top