The cost of retirement keeps climbing

StarSong said:
Roombas and Roomba closes start in the $300 range.
These robots learn the layout of your house and go from room to room (though I don't know if any navigate stairs). Mine (a 2-1/2 year old $400-ish model) returns to its base for recharging or empty its contents. After recharging or emptying, it returns and finishes the job. It runs for about an hour on a charge and requires about an hour to recharge.
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Shame on you. You are putting a house cleaner out of work by using the Roomba.

Ask a neighbor for a bag of vacuum dust. Scatter it around your home. Then call a cleaner to clean up the mess. You will be helping the unemployed.
 
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hearlady said:
I have a small house. Will the Roomba go room to room by itself
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Yes. My son has one - when you set it up you map out the area you want it to cover and it goes there.

His comes out every evening, covers the area in about an hour and then returns to base to empty the contents and recharge. all the person has to do is empty the dust container it empties into every few days.
 
January said:
Yes. My son has one - when you set it up you map out the area you want it to cover and it goes there.

His comes out every evening, covers the area in about an hour and then returns to base to empty the contents and recharge. all the person has to do is empty the dust container it empties into every few days.
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It vacuums every day?! That is a housework miracle! :love:
 
Aunt Bea said:
Much of this discussion has to do with wants vs needs.

We would all like to maintain our pre retirement lifestyle, travel, age in place, leave a legacy to family, etc… but the truth is that many of us will have to make some hard choices in order to be comfortable in our final years.

IMO an attitude adjustment can be as important as many of the financial adjustments that we may face.

As we get older what do we actually need other than a safe clean room, a comfortable chair, side table, twin bed, small dresser, television, phone, a small bookcase for our treasures, a few clothes, and an endless supply of treats. 🍪🍭🍬🍹🍕🍦
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Everyone says "You should travel!"
Every other day I travel to Walmart. What else do I need/
 
OldOld said:
Who is going to find the 4 or 5 seniors to live in the same house? Who's house is it? If some of the seniors in the house need care, who will do it? There will be weaker or sickers seniors than the others. It would be unfair for the healthy ones to always do the chores.
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No decision is perfect. There are problems with everything. I can see this scenario working with a group of seniors who know each other and are familiar with each other's lifestyle, basic history, etc. Seniors living on the road, van-dwelling and boondocking have discussed it, renting or buying a large home as a group. They know what each other's lifestyles, hopes and dreams are like.

Everything in life has risks. We all just choose what risks are valuable to us. No, I wouldn't want to be one of 2-3 doing all of the work in a senior shared home, picking up slack for others who have become unable temporarily or permanently. But, it also might never happen if I chose this group living arrangement. What if I became the one whose slack had to be picked up? I wouldn't want that, but when entering into the contract, each person would be agreeing to the risks.

Documents could be drawn up to cover as many scenarios as could be thought of and what would be done about them. There's always a way.
 
I always used to say that I don’t want live with anybody unless I was married to them or gave birth to them. Now I wouldn’t even want to live with those people and I’m sure they wouldn’t want to live with me.:)).

I would rather live in a studio condo than to live with other people. I didn’t think I would like living alone when it happened five years ago, but I have to say that I really enjoy it. It’s so nice to only have to take care of myself and the dogs and not to have to put up with anyone else making a mess or telling me how to do things better.

Of course, if someone ends up needing care and can’t afford to pay for help coming in, then that’s an entirely different matter. Like most people I’m hoping that I never need any type of care. Most people in my family haven’t except for my dad so I’m hoping to be lucky also. My two other siblings who are much older still live independently also.
 
bobcat said:
I have tried to reconcile the differences between the view that retirement will become much more expensive and the other view that as robotics handle mostly everything, the cost of retirement and just general living will dramatically reduce. Both are speculation but from different assumptions. The ones predicting an escalating cost are basing it on current data and extrapolating from that. However, Musk and others are saying the current model is going to dramatically change into a technological revolution that will change the cost of housing, healthcare, transportation, manufacturing, food, and virtually everything else.

It's hard to figure out who's right, but in time, I think the latter model will be a little closer to truth. Logically, it just makes sense that if machines everywhere are able to work 24/7 with no breaks, vacations, sick pay, hourly wage, etc..., then the cost of everything should decline. It just happens gradually.

That being said, I have to keep in mind that I'm not trying to fund someone else's retirement, I trying to fund mine, and as you pointed out, there are many factors that affect what it needs to be. It doesn't take a lot to make me happy, so however it shakes out, I will deal with it if and when it happens.
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I don't understand how using more technology will reduce the cost of basic necessities. Businesses, landlords, home sellers, etc. are still going to want to make a profit and some will let greed take over. If robots are doing more of the work, that likely means more people will be out of work or working reduced hours. If that is the case, affordability will still be negatively impacted. I saw an ad for Lowes about them having a training program for carpenters. They said that AI isn't going to be able to fix your roof. That may not even be true!

I meant to add that a major factor in my not needing that intimidating million dollars is my healthcare costs are very low, despite having a myriad of ailments and taking a lot of meds. That is due to the great Medicare and RX plans I have through the State Retiree Health Benefits plan.
 
OneEyedDiva said:
I don't understand how using more technology will reduce the cost of basic necessities. Businesses, landlords, home sellers, etc. are still going to want to make a profit and some will let greed take over. If robots are doing more of the work, that likely means more people will be out of work or working reduced hours. If that is the case, affordability will still be negatively impacted. I saw an ad for Lowes about them having a training program for carpenters. They said that AI isn't going to be able to fix your roof. That may not even be true!

I meant to add that a major factor in my not needing that intimidating million dollars is my healthcare costs are very low, despite having a myriad of ailments and taking a lot of meds. That is due to the great Medicare and RX plans I have through the State Retiree Health Benefits plan.
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Well, I am a skeptic of most things and especially predictions about the future. I pretty much adhere to the "I'll believe it when I see it" group. On the surface, parts do make sense. If every stage of producing a product from the sourcing of materials to the delivery to your door are all done robotically around the clock for simply the cost of energy, then theoretically it should cost less. If one looks at the cost of Chinese goods, the reason they are cheaper is primarily because labor cost is much less. If that factor is reduced even more, then the cost of goods should go way down.

Also, if a robot tax is administered, then it would help offset the loss of jobs. However, no one really knows how that would shake out, so these are extremely dubious assumptions. That being said, the robots produced per year will be ramping up every year into the millions, so it looks like we are going to find out no matter what. The one thing that should help level the playing field is supply and demand. It doesn't do any good to produce anything if people are unable to buy it, so hopefully it will balance out somehow. IDK
 
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bobcat said:
It is loosely called a senior group home, or board and care home.
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I'm familiar with board and care homes. Dreadful places. I'd prefer a skilled nursing facility. Not kidding.

Yes, seniors who can't afford to live alone would much better off returning to our 1960s and 70s roommate patterns. I had roommates once and could do it again, if need be. But renting, not buying. Roommates aren't spouses. One year leases, maybe.

Major difference at our age: few seniors leave the house for ten or more hours a day to go to work and/or school, or have out-of-the-house plans many evenings or weekends. Even slightly irritating roommates would wear thin much faster than in our youth .

On the other hand, there'd be far fewer incidents of bumping into some random guy in his boxer shorts (or worse, tighty whities - eek!) while heading to the bathroom at 3am.
 
hearlady said:
It vacuums every day?! That is a housework miracle! :love:
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Yes, you can program it to run as often as you'd like. Or just push a button and have it run immediately. All on a phone app. My dog doesn't shed so I have mine running three days a week. I only need to empty the dust bag in the home base every few months, when Roomba's electronic voice says, "empty the bin."

DD has a golden retriever so hers runs every day and she empties the home base bag much more often.

Beats pushing around a vacuum cleaner though, that's for sure.
 
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StarSong said:
I'm familiar with board and care homes. Dreadful places. I'd prefer a skilled nursing facility. Not kidding.

Yes, seniors who can't afford to live alone would much better off returning to our 1960s and 70s roommate patterns. I had roommates once and could do it again, if need be. But renting, not buying. Roommates aren't spouses. One year leases, maybe.

Major difference at our age: few seniors leave the house for ten or more hours a day to go to work and/or school, or have out-of-the-house plans many evenings or weekends. Even slightly irritating roommates would wear thin much faster than in our youth .

On the other hand, there'd be far fewer incidents of bumping into some random guy in his boxer shorts (or worse, tighty whities - eek!) while heading to the bathroom at 3am.
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Yes, I think your idea of renting vs buying may be smarter. The landlord does the maintenance, and there's no issues with a mortgage or who owns the home. Any residents could be screened and vetted, and be admitted on a 90 day trial basis, and be fully responsible for their own healthcare, and any other needs. Rules would need to be clearly defined, and adhered to. It's not for everyone, but if a person is facing hardship financially on their own, and might benefit from this arrangement, then it may be worth considering.
 
bobcat said:
Yes, I think your idea of renting vs buying may be smarter. The landlord does the maintenance, and there's no issues with a mortgage or who owns the home. Any residents could be screened and vetted, and be admitted on a 90 day trial basis, and be fully responsible for their own healthcare, and any other needs. Rules would need to be clearly defined, and adhered to. It's not for everyone, but if a person is facing hardship financially on their own, and might benefit from this arrangement, then it may be worth considering.
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Renting means your living arrangement is based on term lease, i.e, 1, 2 3 years etc. And you may have to find a new place at the end of the lease. All your roommates will have to agree on any decision. It is quite complicated. But, you have to do it if that's what you can only afford.
 
bobcat said:
Yes, I think your idea of renting vs buying may be smarter. The landlord does the maintenance, and there's no issues with a mortgage or who owns the home. Any residents could be screened and vetted, and be admitted on a 90 day trial basis, and be fully responsible for their own healthcare, and any other needs. Rules would need to be clearly defined, and adhered to. It's not for everyone, but if a person is facing hardship financially on their own, and might benefit from this arrangement, then it may be worth considering.
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You and I are thinking along the same lines. Having had assorted roommates for six years, mostly good to great, a couple nearly unbearable (the alcoholic wasn't nearly as bad as one total weirdo, but wouldn't want to revisit either experience), I wouldn't sign on for more than a one year stint.

Not complaining. Overall my roommates were good and we got along well, but there would be many more moving parts for 3 seniors sharing a house than 3 early twenty-somethings.
 
OldOld said:
Renting means your living arrangement is based on term lease, i.e, 1, 2 3 years etc. And you may have to find a new place at the end of the lease. All your roommates will have to agree on any decision. It is quite complicated. But, you have to do it if that's what you can only afford.
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I rented a three bedroom apartment with two other roommates. Stayed there a total of 2-1/2 years and had a total of six different roommates. When one moved out, another moved in.

The remaining two never had trouble finding a new roomie when the third gave notice. It might be more difficult to find a senior roommates, but perhaps not. If all else fails, traveling nurses and other short-term renters could be brought in.
 
bobcat said:
Well, I am a skeptic of most things and especially predictions about the future. I pretty much adhere to the "I'll believe it when I see it" group. On the surface, parts do make sense. If every stage of producing a product from the sourcing of materials to the delivery to your door are all done robotically around the clock for simply the cost of energy, then theoretically it should cost less. If one looks at the cost of Chinese goods, the reason they are cheaper is primarily because labor cost is much less. If that factor is reduced even more, then the cost of goods should go way down.

Also, if a robot tax is administered, then it would help offset the loss of jobs. However, no one really knows how that would shake out, so these are extremely dubious assumptions. That being said, the robots produced per year will be ramping up every year into the millions, so it looks like we are going to find out no matter what. The one thing that should help level the playing field is supply and demand. It doesn't do any good to produce anything if people are unable to buy it, so hopefully it will balance out somehow. IDK
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I'm with you in the I'll believe it when I see it" group, especially about prices ultimately being lower. The only company I know that lowers prices for consumers when their costs go down is Costco. :D It's interesting that Musk weighed in on this, seemingly on the "pro" side because he, along with Bill Gates and Stephen Hawking issued warnings about AI.
Artificial Intelligence Quotes: Bill Gates, Elon Musk, Stephen Hawking -

This article is about Elon Musk, Bill Gates and others theorizing that AI will eliminate the need for people to work and everyone would be wealthy and have excellent health care. How the h*ll is that gonna happen?! Now there's a "believe it when I see it" prediction! We all better watch I Robot (again). I've often said that science fiction becomes science fact. My son and I were just talking today about movies in which things once thought to be fantastical have come true or were already true (covertly) when the movies were made. Another movie that comes to mind: Eagle Eye (2008)
A future without work? What Elon Musk, Bill Gates, and others in AI are saying about the future.
 
OneEyedDiva said:
I'm with you in the I'll believe it when I see it" group, especially about prices ultimately being lower. The only company I know that lowers prices for consumers when their costs go down is Costco. :D It's interesting that Musk weighed in on this, seemingly on the "pro" side because he, along with Bill Gates and Stephen Hawking issued warnings about AI.
Artificial Intelligence Quotes: Bill Gates, Elon Musk, Stephen Hawking -

This article is about Elon Musk, Bill Gates and others theorizing that AI will eliminate the need for people to work and everyone would be wealthy and have excellent health care. How the h*ll is that gonna happen?! Now there's a "believe it when I see it" prediction! We all better watch I Robot (again). I've often said that science fiction becomes science fact. My son and I were just talking today about movies in which things once thought to be fantastical have come true or were already true (covertly) when the movies were made. Another movie that comes to mind: Eagle Eye (2008)
A future without work? What Elon Musk, Bill Gates, and others in AI are saying about the future.
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Yes, I totally get what you're saying. Predictions about the future may not prove any more reliable than fortune cookies. I do believe that robotics and AI will be changing society in rather dramatic ways going forward, but there are just too many unknowns to surmise what it will be like. There are government regulations, public adoption, trust, safety, reliability, needs, ability to purchase, fear, and lots of unknowns that haven't even shown up yet.

I try to keep an open mind, and I do think significant change is coming, but industry has had many wrong guesses over the years. I remember years ago when the Segway came out. It was predicted that it would transform society and how people would get around. Well, aside from a few mall cops, it didn't pan out the way they thought. People still preferred bicycles at a small fraction of the cost, and it was already something they learned to ride as a kid, so why pay for something ten times as much that you had to learn to ride. Five years from now, I'll bet there will be many things we didn't see coming.
 
StarSong said:
I'm familiar with board and care homes. Dreadful places. I'd prefer a skilled nursing facility. Not kidding.

Yes, seniors who can't afford to live alone would much better off returning to our 1960s and 70s roommate patterns. I had roommates once and could do it again, if need be. But renting, not buying. Roommates aren't spouses. One year leases, maybe.

Major difference at our age: few seniors leave the house for ten or more hours a day to go to work and/or school, or have out-of-the-house plans many evenings or weekends. Even slightly irritating roommates would wear thin much faster than in our youth .

On the other hand, there'd be far fewer incidents of bumping into some random guy in his boxer shorts (or worse, tighty whities - eek!) while heading to the bathroom at 3am.
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I don't know about that Star. I've heard of hanky panky going on in senior buildings and nursing homes as well as STD outbreaks among seniors living in senior apartment buildings. Good point about being around annoying roommates for more time wearing thin.
 
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bobcat said:
Yes, I totally get what you're saying. Predictions about the future may not prove any more reliable than fortune cookies. I do believe that robotics and AI will be changing society in rather dramatic ways going forward, but there are just too many unknowns to surmise what it will be like. There are government regulations, public adoption, trust, safety, reliability, needs, ability to purchase, fear, and lots of unknowns that haven't even shown up yet.

I try to keep an open mind, and I do think significant change is coming, but industry has had many wrong guesses over the years. I remember years ago when the Segway came out. It was predicted that it would transform society and how people would get around. Well, aside from a few mall cops, it didn't pan out the way they thought. People still preferred bicycles at a small fraction of the cost, and it was already something they learned to ride as a kid, so why pay for something ten times as much that you had to learn to ride. Five years from now, I'll bet there will be many things we didn't see coming.
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I think there will be ethical issues to sort out too Bob. I wish I could ride one of those Segways. Speaking of which, my husband and I saw Paul Blart Mall Cop in the movies, only because we used to get complimentary movie tickets on Tuesday nights for having Optimum Triple play (internet, TV and landline). That was the first time I saw a Segway.

I never learned to ride a bike. After running into a wall and injuring myself, while Daddy was trying to teach me, I was too through. FF to adulthood, I bought a folding bike out of curiosity and tried to teach myself. I rode a little bit in a nearby parking lot when it was empty, but had balance issues. I wound up giving it to one of my step grandsons.
 
If you've had balance issues on a bicycles, riding a Segway would be probably be disastrous. I went on a couple hour Segway tour in Puerto Rico about 15 years ago. Despite my balance being excellent, the challenge of maneuvering one of those puppies left a more lasting impression than the PR landmarks and views.

Several in the group fell off their Segways, one of the tour guides included. (Yes, my hand is raised, as well.) They don't do well on uneven ground and maintaining balance while going uphill or downhill was difficult. Nobody was injured and the Segways suffered no damage, but it was more of an endurance test for DH & me than a joyful experience.

That's probably why Segways flopped with the general public. Sure, they're great if you're a mall cop gliding on even ground. Otherwise, not so much. Bikes are so much easier to balance and maneuver.
 
officerripley said:
I was reading an article about this and other retirement issues yesterday. Part of it was about the housing market being so tight partially because too many seniors are not downsizing out of their big homes into something smaller. But like the article pointed out, the reason is not always stubbornness--although in my Huzz's case it is--but even though they sell the house for a considerable amount of money, there's not always anywhere suitable to move to. Smaller houses or condos or apartments that they can afford are too far away from the services they need and want.

Also they might be moving away from neighbors and sometimes family. And unless they live in a mansion, no matter how much they sell their large family home for, it's still not enough to afford most fancy senior communities for very long.

It's become a real issue, I think.
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This!👍 We live in a larger house than we need, but we've been without a mortgage for almost 20 years so no money is spent on that. It is all spent on home maintenance, property taxes (due to the increased value) and ridiculous increases in homeowners' insurance.

It would not only be difficult to find something smaller in the general area, we would lose our homestead exemption. We love our neighborhood and neighbors and the general "outdoorsy" vibe of the area. We are also close to grocery stores, entertainment venues, doctors and hospitals. There is no other place we would want to live.

As for what we need in retirement, even if I stay within a budget my SS payments still don't cut it. I have to withdraw from investments frequently, but I try to stick within the "4% rule" (trying to withdraw no more than 4% of investments per year). We've been fortunate that our investments have grown since I retired in 2020, but one can't always count on that.

We need some painting done and a new roof, but they seem to be put on the back burner every month. We just spent $22k due to raccoons destroying the attic. I explained it in another thread. It's the home maintenance that is eats up the budget.:(
 
My former nextdoor neighbor had been living in her house for decades before she passed away in her 90's. Her house had not been maintained or painted. This is not in an HOA regulated community. I am prepared to do the same if I don't have enough money.
 
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