Thinking?

oldpop said:
I think verbally and visually and the two flow together. Sometimes they go into hyper drive and I can't distinguish between the two. Kind of like pure thought. Maybe the verbal thinking is not verbal at all and just seems that way to allow my conscious mind to process what I perceive as reality in a way more familiar to me? I wonder about how babies think before they learn to speak? I would guess visually. I only speak English so I think in English. How about people who speak other languages? What language do they think in? If you speak more than one language maybe you can answer that question. There is a lot of research done on the subject but of course there are no definite answer. That is what led me ask the original question....🤔
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Children learn languages easily when young. We're hardwired to learn language but not a specific one, if exposed several while preschool and elementary school age onr can learn several. Perhaps in part because their first language is not so firmly in place to require mental translation. All the words for book refer to the same object so a picture of such an object can be called up no matter which language.

But as we get older and more often talk of abstract ideas that don't refer to something solid whether object or action it might require more mental translation. (Just thinking of possibilities as i go here.)

When i was a teen i knew several Hungarian.Refugees, one 6 yr old among them spoke 5-6 languages, his English vocabulary was fairly typical of a 6 yr old and that was probably true of his vocabulary in others, but if he had the opportunity to use each language regularly i suspect his vocabulary in each probably grew fairly normally as he aged.

By the time i was in my third year of French classes while i had to translate English to French if writing and in beginning of a conversation once into a conversation in French i found my reslonses coming in French. Haven't used it much in later decades of my life so now i have to stop and think. Yet there is one short Montaigne poem that always comes to me French first, because that was my first exposure to it. And i have to think a moment to convert it to english for someone else.
 

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WheatenLover said:
When I was taking trig in high school, it came totally naturally to me and it was fun. Same with algebra courses. I could read the material once, and I magically understood it. Now, my daughter is in grad school for math, and I have to really think about it before I can do math problems. And trig? Who remembers how to do it by hand? I sure don't. Now people use calculators or something.

I am thinking seriously (like that takes much) about taking some free online courses in math, just to activate that part of my brain, and perhaps strengthen it. I've done that in the past, for fun, and was amazed by how much I'd forgotten.
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Have you considered volunteering as a math tutor? I did that when I was in college. It's almost more challenging to try to figure out how to teach math in a way that your student can grasp it, than to solve the problem itself.
 
feywon said:
Many animals have verbalizatons, which tho not words as we consider them, do serve that function. They have set, taught to young meanings about what food is safe and what not, about danger near, crows remember and can communicate thru their sounds which humans are friends and which are foes.
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How about "talking" dogs? These communication buttons include concepts like "I love you".

 
TooMuchMuktuk said:
Have you considered volunteering as a math tutor? I did that when I was in college. It's almost more challenging to try to figure out how to teach math in a way that your student can grasp it, than to solve the problem itself.
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Well, I can't do it now (due to illness & covid), but I do want to volunteer to tutor children in math and reading. I've been successful at it in the past.

When I was a teenager, I had a babysitting business. One of the things I did when I took care of a child was teach them how to read. They were usually 5 or 6 years old. Needless to say, I had a lot of long term clients who hired me frequently. The child had to be excited about it; nothing was forced upon them. Oddly enough, many were, especially after I pointed out they wouldn't have to wait around for someone to read to them. We did lots of other things too - mostly playing, baking, cooking, and cleaning up after ourselves.

I also taught my kids how to read. I taught them math in the elementary years using Singapore Math. I like kids a whole lot.

My four kids were a challenge. One took two years to learn how to read. Doc said his brain development just hadn't caught up. That child insisted on reading lesson for three hours a day, and kept it up the 2 years! He is just as determined to master new things today. I tried many methods with him, but Dolch sight words and phonics worked the best. They were totally out of vogue at the time. This same child had dyscalculia(a math learning disability).
 
WheatenLover said:
Well, I can't do it now (due to illness & covid), but I do want to volunteer to tutor children in math and reading. I've been successful at it in the past.

When I was a teenager, I had a babysitting business. One of the things I did when I took care of a child was teach them how to read. They were usually 5 or 6 years old. Needless to say, I had a lot of long term clients who hired me frequently. The child had to be excited about it; nothing was forced upon them. Oddly enough, many were, especially after I pointed out they wouldn't have to wait around for someone to read to them. We did lots of other things too - mostly playing, baking, cooking, and cleaning up after ourselves.

I also taught my kids how to read. I taught them math in the elementary years using Singapore Math. I like kids a whole lot.

My four kids were a challenge. One took two years to learn how to read. Doc said his brain development just hadn't caught up. That child insisted on reading lesson for three hours a day, and kept it up the 2 years! He is just as determined to master new things today. I tried many methods with him, but Dolch sight words and phonics worked the best. They were totally out of vogue at the time. This same child had dyscalculia(a math learning disability).
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WOW. That's impressive, and a testimony to the wonderful father that you have been. Your students, as well as you children have been blessed.
 
WheatenLover said:
How about "talking" dogs? These communication buttons include concepts like "I love you".

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Yes, if we observe animals enough we realize they do have the concept of love, even if they haven't been taught the word. Years ago i saw a man with a Trained German Shepherd on Johnny Carson. and that dog could follow a complex instruction like 'take the red folder from the 2nd to the bottom drawer of the file cabinet.' no gestures just verbal instructions. They love, have compassion, can hold grudges (tho dogs don't seem to as much as some animals), and grieve.
 
Well its actually much more complex though understand the intent of your simple question.

A favorite science realm of study is neuroscience and consciousness. My own leanings are we as intelligent entities are not the organic flesh and neurons of our bodies but rather the complex oscillating electromagnetic fields that exist within the containers of such. DNA organic Earth creatures from the level of tiny bilateral symmetry worms with neurochords evolved with head end light sensitive chemical receptors that required control over to move in the correct directions for feeding and escape from dangers. Thus when we evolved Earth monkeys "think", we are using a part of our brain that receives our senses and other brain memory areas, processes such with our executive control "pilot" that then causes actions in our motor cortex. The key sense is visual around which the rest is structured.
 
feywon said:
Yes, if we observe animals enough we realize they do have the concept of love, even if they haven't been taught the word. Years ago i saw a man with a Trained German Shepherd on Johnny Carson. and that dog could follow a complex instruction like 'take the red folder from the 2nd to the bottom drawer of the file cabinet.' no gestures just verbal instructions. They love, have compassion, can hold grudges (tho dogs don't seem to as much as some animals), and grieve.
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Now, from what I've read, dogs can only see the colors blue and yellow. I haven't researched this lately. But I do try to buy things for him that are blue and/or yellow because I think it adds interest to his life.

My dog is particularly good at hiding things. We have to treat him as though he will, so all medications and grooming tools are kept in secret places he cannot reach. That shows a rather complex thinking process, since he has decide to hide these specific things (which involves why hide them), decide where to put them, and emerges victorious.

Dogs are also really smart about learning hand signals and spoken commands. They can actually learn from signals no one else will notice, like a wink or a twitch ... I'd think that would be harder to teach, though. They are exquisitely attuned to their owners every "tell". My dog knows when I am thinking about grooming him and I have no idea what my "tell" is. It could just be a micro-expression on my face.
 
Pinky said:
The buttons used in this video is the same as the method used in "How Stella Learned To Talk" .. a book by Christine Hunger.
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Yes, when I was looking for the specific video I watched, I clicked on several that featured Stella.

I have decided not to teach my dog to "talk", because it isn't necessary and is a lot of hard work. Plus, I don't know how. We are very attuned to one another.
 
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WheatenLover said:
Yes, when I was looking for the specific video I watched, I clicked on several that featured Stella.

I have decided not to teach my dog to "talk", because it isn't necessary and is a lot of hard work. We are very attuned to one another.
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I have never felt the need with either dogs or cats. As it is they are so responsive to our words (my children and myself) that we'd have been accused of witchcraft in other times.
 
feywon said:
I have never felt the need with either dogs or cats. As it is they are so responsive to our words (my children and myself) that we'd have been accused of witchcraft in other times.
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Exactly! It amazes me how quickly my dog learns the meanings of new words. We have to spell some thing or use synonyms, until he learns that too. He can just look at me and I know what he is thinking or what he wants. Of all the dogs I have had, he is the one with whom I am most attuned.

It is kind of funny, considering that it took me five months to figure out how he thinks. He was always several steps ahead of me during that time. Who would think a tiny puppy sleeping under a settee would wait until no one was around to destroy its rush seat panel?
 
When our body is in the prime of it's life, It is like a driver-less car, on auto-pilot. We think and act without giving much thought to our thinking. It's much, much later, when we are up on the rack, on life-support that we have the need and the time to analyze the process, finally realizing that we face a losing struggle within.
 

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