What resources have you found to make sense of the variety of religious/spiritual/sacred traditions in the world?

MarkD

MarkD

Keeper of the Hounds & Garden
Location
San Francisco Bay Area
I was surprised to find no forum dedicated to the topic as it is generally considered one of the big topics to take into account in psychotherapy and general human well being. I know we have no political forums as that is generally a third rail path to chaos and incivility. I suppose this topic has the same potential although I don't see it specifically ruled out in the same way as politics, just hard to locate. My hope is that people will refrain from partisan cheering and jeering and just speak to what it is that helps them makes sense of the wide variety of approaches that are out there from Abrahamic traditions, to Hinduism, Buddhism, secular humanism, Wicca, Sufism, mindful meditation, depth psychology, material naturalism .. and whatever else I may be leaving out.

Rather than get into my own orientation or preferences I'll turn it over to Rev Dr Barbara Brown Taylor whose book "Holy Envy" I found very enlightening. The title comes from her experience of bringing Christian college students on field trips to visit other faith traditions and noticing aspects of each which elicit what she quotes another theologian as having described as "holy envy', something positive which you might wish your own tradition to incorporate. (She credits the source early on in the video.) Here is a good video orientation to her ideas straight from the source as delivered as a guest pastor in a Christian church, of what denomination I do not know.


There are many memorable quotes in the book but this is my favorite:

“The only clear line I draw these days is this: when my religion tries to come between me and my neighbor, I will choose my neighbor every time. Jesus never commanded me to love my religion.”
 

Jamala said:
I would love to see such a thread take off...but as we know anything about religion causes tension and anger in some....shame really!
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Me too. I’m an outsider but gaining appreciation into why this dimension of human experience is important. I guess maybe the animosity stems from our need to justify ourselves. I guess people prefer to avoid the unpleasantness. Oh well .. nothing ventured, nothing gained.
 

I'll try to keep my story short.

I grew up in the Southern Baptist church. The message was always Fire and Brimstone and I was going to Hell unless I repented. My parents stopped going and I was left to my own devices. I then moved to Church of Christ, where no musical instruments were allowed, the verses from the Bible were converted into the original language and it was adamant that I be baptized. This was for the second time because they said at 9 years old in the Baptist Church I had no idea why I had been baptized.

I soon began to question their doctrine because they basically said everyone that didn't believe as they did was going to Hell. I asked about infirm people that couldn't be baptized. I asked about other cultures in faraway lands that had never heard their gospel. I was shut down each time and told we were the only ones going to Heaven. That totally turned me off to organized religion because I was intelligent enough to realize that each religion thinks it is the only one that has all the answers.

So, to answer your question I think the purpose of the many religions around the world is to give people a sense of hope and a feeling that someone bigger than they are is guiding their lives. I also think it may lead to a greater sense of morality. Unfortunately, it also lines the pockets of the more senior leaders in some religions. I have not found any resources to make sense of the various religions, but then I admittedly haven't done a lot of research.
 
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seadoug said:
I have not found any resources to make sense of the various religions, but then I admittedly haven't done a lot of research.
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I’ve mostly been apathetic about these matters too but then my family stopped going to church before I started school so I never received much indoctrination into religious practice. I had stopped believing any of it before leaving elementary school in 6th grade but didn't identify as an atheist until high school, though not openly as most of my family was religious, though my immediate family was unchurched.

When the internet arrived I found my way to atheist forums but was never comfortable with the amount of vitriol. Later I became interested in the question - why has God belief been so prevalent from our prehistory up to the present. I personally don’t think exploitation of the sort the Bakkers represent was ever foundational; I’d say they were more parasitic than in control.

Regardless what interests me is what is the hook - what is the positive appeal that started and still supports that appeal? Not that I’m shopping but I do think there is something missing by not following any wisdom tradition; it’s like a hole in the cultural foundation. This Barbara B Taylor doesn’t answer that question but she criticizes Christianity for its insistence that only their way is any good. Both in the video and in the book she shows that not all religious traditions are obsessed with evangelism just as they don’t all make afterlife benefits central.
 
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The best explanation that I have heard, at least the one that makes sense to me, is that a lot of people use religion to fill a hole in their lives. It does not have to be a specific religion. This was told to me by a Pantheist who worshiped the Universe. He made no supernatural claims nor claims about sentience of the Universe. He just needed to (in his words) fill a hole in his life. He claimed it was a God shaped hole. Granted this makes no sense either. But if I understand the OP, you are asking why there is such a widespread belief in religions. If you stipulate a caveat that it must make sense, this could turn out to be a very long discussion, or maybe even a short one.
 
@MarkD thanks for starting this thread, I am going to give a bit more thought to it before I make a more substantial response.
Jamala said:
I would love to see such a thread take off...but as we know anything about religion causes tension and anger in some....shame really!
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You are right about some people's view of religion, however I have found most of the folks on this forum to be quite open to discussing it. And I hope the more religious folks here respond, I always respect and appreciate hearing their points of view. I think we can do this.
 
seadoug said:
I'll try to keep my story short.

I grew up in the Southern Baptist church. The message was always Fire and Brimstone and I was going to Hell unless I repented. My parents stopped going and I was left to make my own devices. I then moved to Church of Christ, where no musical instruments were allowed, the verses from the Bible were converted into the original language and it was adamant that I be baptized. This was for the second time because they said at 9 years old in the Baptist Church I had no idea why I had been baptized.

I soon began to question their doctrine because they basically said everyone that didn't believe as they did was going to Hell. I asked about infirm people that couldn't be baptized. I asked about other cultures in faraway lands that had never heard their gospel. I was shut down each time and told we were the only ones going to Heaven. That totally turned me off to organized religion because I was intelligent enough to realize that each religion thinks it is the only one that has all the answers.

So, to answer your question I think the purpose of the many religions around the world is to give people a sense of hope and a feeling that someone bigger than they are is guiding their lives. I also think it may lead to a greater sense of morality. Unfortunately, it also lines the pockets of the more senior leaders in some religions. I have not found any resources to make sense of the various religions, but then I admittedly haven't done a lot of research.
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Your comment is very worth reading. To me, all the great religions are religions of fear. They create an atmosphere of fear and condemn people who don't believe in their sayings. My late Roman Catholic aunt once said: "If I were sure, that God doesn't exist, I would left my church". There it is, fear.
Second religions and politics create fanatics, since they are mass movements which always find enough stupid people they can fanatize.
Third politics and churches often work together to suppress the people. There exists an infamous photo of German bishops who raise their right arms for the Nazi salute.
Fourth the most atrocious crimes are committed in the name of God. And this tiil today.
Now you may object that the churches as institutions have nothing in common with God. If you can seperate them, good for you. I can't and I won't. Thus I say NO to any church and no to God.
 
George1959 said:
To me, all the great religions are religions of fear.
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Well some denominations within Christianity have been like that but what reason do you have to assume it is the same with all traditions in the world?. They aren’t all so hell bent on drafting you into their fold either. Some forms of Buddhism dispense with gods and have no interest in any idea of an afterlife.
 
MarkD said:
Well some denominations within Christianity have been like that but what reason do you have to assume it is the same with all traditions in the world?. They aren’t all so hell bent on drafting you into their fold either. Some forms of Buddhism dispense with gods and have no interest in any idea of an afterlife.
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Regarding Buddhism you are right, but it is not a religion since there is no God.
 
Jamala said:
Although there are philosophical aspects in Buddhism, it is in fact, a non-theistic religion.
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Exactly. It is one of the world’s great religious traditions, one that can be devoid of any supernatural bells and whistles though there are many variations with that too. But none of them proselytize or claim you can only be saved by way of the Buddha. At the other extreme Hinduism seems to include any and all gods but they are not desperate for us to join and neither are the Jews.
 
MarkD said:
Exactly. It is one of the world’s great religious traditions, one that can be devoid of any supernatural bells and whistles though there are many variations with that too. But none of them proselytize or claim you can only be saved by way of the Buddha. At the other extreme Hinduism seems to include any and all gods but they are not desperate for us to join and neither are the Jews.
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We do not seek converts.
 
Pepper said:
We do not seek converts.
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i respect a tradition more which sets a bar reasonably high for entry over one eager to coerce you into it.

I’m coming at this from reading McGilchrist who writes on neuroscience, philosophy and the nature of consciousness. In this video he converses with a Buddhist guy I know nothing about apart from what he says here. Do you know him at all?

 
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oldlongwalker said:
How about this for a knob turner:

Who has done more good for the world: Mother Teresa or Bill Gates?
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For anyone who doesn’t worship vaccine denialism, surely Gates. That said I’d rather individuals just didn’t roll up so much of the wealth into a fund the use of which only they have any say. Capitalism needs checks.
 
It sounds as though you are looking for a religion to join in order to "classify" yourself.
Do you need to be part of a group?
The inner spirit of religion seems no longer to exist.
Only the rituals and dogma remain but it is devoid of the spirit.
Religion should be to raise the consciousness of man so that it
flows naturally with the stream of evolution and induce man to
live in fulfillment. All religions fail to do that.
This should bring a reverence to God and to man.

Also they teach a fear of God rather than a love of God.
You mentioned your "apathy". Religions should not bring a passive
attitude to their followers. It should bring a dynamism, a fulfillment.
It shouldn't leave men in struggle and suffering, or draw on their energy.
Life is to be lived in peace, harmony, happiness, joyousness,
intelligence, creativity.

You can say, "Oh, I'm a (whatever religion you chose)" but it's in name
only because the qualities of religion, the virtues, morals, love, tolerance;
the foundation is gone because the practical technique of bringing
the mind to a God value is not utilized!

This technique was part of the religions eons ago and has been forgotten
for centuries. That is the technique of transcending within yourself
to bring out the joy to celebrate your chosen religion.

There should be no strain just as there should be no refusal to
bring the absolute into your life. It must be more than "mood making".
Religions, philosophies or belief systems should naturally elevate man
to experience the potentials of consciousness in absolute joy!

One must bring the attention WITHIN! "The Kingdom of Heaven is WITHIN YOU!"
 
MarkD said:
i respect a tradition more which sets a bar reasonably high for entry over one eager to coerce you into it.

I’m coming at this from reading McGilchrist who writes on neuroscience, philosophy and the nature of consciousness. In this video he converses with a Buddhist guy I know nothing about apart from what he says here. Do you know him at all?

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Not familiar with either so I did a bit of reading. It looks to me like McGilchrist is closely following the route established by Julian Jaynes in the 70's with his publication of The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind.

"The preposterous hypothesis we have come to in the previous chapter is that at one time human nature was split in two, an executive part called a god, and a follower part called a man. Neither part was conscious."

Sounds like the title of McGilchrist's first book: The Master and his Emissary.
 
Gaer said:
It sounds as though you are looking for a religion to join in order to "classify" yourself.
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No, I’m not actually at all interested in anything ‘off the rack’. I’m just interested in what we are and can be. No validation required (or possible). But I’m happy to talk to anyone of any persuasion who can do so in a respectful manner.
 
oldlongwalker said:
Not familiar with either so I did a bit of reading. It looks to me like McGilchrist is closely following the route established by Julian Jaynes in the 70's with his publication of The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind.

"The preposterous hypothesis we have come to in the previous chapter is that at one time human nature was split in two, an executive part called a god, and a follower part called a man. Neither part was conscious."

Sounds like the title of McGilchrist's first book: The Master and his Emissary.
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TMAHE I’ve read as well as Jayne’s book. They are worlds apart. The latter is purely speculative while McGilchrist’s is carefully and thoroughly supported.
 
MarkD said:
TMAHE I’ve read as well as Jayne’s book. They are worlds apart. The latter is purely speculative while McGilchrist’s is carefully and thoroughly supported.
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Jaynes is more aligned with philosophers like Daniel Dennett. For myself, I am more aligned with the "linguistic turn" crowd.
 
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