Is The Lockdown Paradigm Collapsing?

JonDouglas

JonDouglas

Senior Member
Location
New England
The American Institute For Economic Research thinks so. They write:

It’s taken much longer than it should have but at last it seems to be happening: the lockdown paradigm is collapsing. The signs are all around us.​
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The one-time hero of the lockdown, New York Governor Andrew Cuomo, has seen his support tank from 71% to 38%, along with ever more demands that he resign. Meanwhile, polls have started to favor Florida governor and lockdown opponent Ron DeSantis for influence over the GOP in the future. This remarkable flip in fortunes is due to the dawning realization that the lockdowns were a disastrous policy. DeSantis and fellow anti-lockdown governor Kristi Noem are the first to state the truth bluntly. Their honesty has won them both credibility.​
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Meanwhile, in Congressional hearings, Representative James Jordan (R-OH) demanded that Dr. Fauci account for why closed Michigan has worse disease prevalence than neighboring Wisconsin which has long been entirely open. Fauci pretended he couldn’t hear the question, couldn’t see the chart, and then didn’t understand. Finally he just sat there silent after having uttered a few banalities about enforcement differentials.​
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The lockdowners are now dealing with the huge problem of Texas. It has been fully open with no restrictions for 6 weeks. Cases and deaths fell dramatically in the same period. Fauci has no answer. Or compare closed California with open Florida: similar death rates. We have a full range of experiences in the US that allow comparisons between open and closed and disease outcomes. There is no relationship.​
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It has long been noted that lockdowns are a substitute for quarantines and suggested there's little or no reason to quarantine healthy people and damage the economy in the process.

Note: Again, I would suggest this is another info point and not something needing denigration or Alinsky-type attacks..
 

There was a lot of paper-writing about herd immunity early in the pandemic; that to achieve herd immunity you needed both the vaccine and natural immunity (exposure). But then Pfizer applied for a patent on the vaccine and there was a shift in the paradigm.

(Not sure but I think that patent is being held up....last I read, anyway. Maybe other corporations want a piece.)
 
Murrmurr said:
There was a lot of paper-writing about herd immunity early in the pandemic; that to achieve herd immunity you needed both the vaccine and natural immunity (exposure). But then Pfizer applied for a patent on the vaccine and there was a shift in the paradigm.

(Not sure but I think that patent is being held up....last I read, anyway. Maybe other corporations want a piece.)
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One thing you can say about lockdowns is that they sell folks (who do you think is paying) a lot of vaccine shots and make a ton of money in the process.
 
JonDouglas said:
The American Institute For Economic Research thinks so. They write:

It’s taken much longer than it should have but at last it seems to be happening: the lockdown paradigm is collapsing. The signs are all around us.​
​
The one-time hero of the lockdown, New York Governor Andrew Cuomo, has seen his support tank from 71% to 38%, along with ever more demands that he resign. Meanwhile, polls have started to favor Florida governor and lockdown opponent Ron DeSantis for influence over the GOP in the future. This remarkable flip in fortunes is due to the dawning realization that the lockdowns were a disastrous policy. DeSantis and fellow anti-lockdown governor Kristi Noem are the first to state the truth bluntly. Their honesty has won them both credibility.​
​
Meanwhile, in Congressional hearings, Representative James Jordan (R-OH) demanded that Dr. Fauci account for why closed Michigan has worse disease prevalence than neighboring Wisconsin which has long been entirely open. Fauci pretended he couldn’t hear the question, couldn’t see the chart, and then didn’t understand. Finally he just sat there silent after having uttered a few banalities about enforcement differentials.​
​
The lockdowners are now dealing with the huge problem of Texas. It has been fully open with no restrictions for 6 weeks. Cases and deaths fell dramatically in the same period. Fauci has no answer. Or compare closed California with open Florida: similar death rates. We have a full range of experiences in the US that allow comparisons between open and closed and disease outcomes. There is no relationship.​
​
It has long been noted that lockdowns are a substitute for quarantines and suggested there's little or no reason to quarantine healthy people and damage the economy in the process.

Note: Again, I would suggest this is another info point and not something needing denigration or Alinsky-type attacks..
Click to expand...
They've got to set people free, vaccinated or not. because they are all losing popularity and their very jobs will follow. This is why lockdowns and mask mandates don't work in social democracies.
 
chic said:
They've got to set people free, vaccinated or not. because they are all losing popularity and their very jobs will follow. This is why lockdowns and mask mandates don't work in social democracies.
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I have to wonder if lockdown states like NY, CA, et. al. will loose more of their current crop of politicians or more people who're sick of their policies and move to a different state.
 
Speaking of lockdowns and such, Cleveland.com had this bit of news today:

COLUMBUS, Ohio - Gov. Mike DeWine is considering whether to change Ohio’s metric for ending coronavirus-related public health orders from case levels to vaccination levels, he said Wednesday.. More at Cleveland.com.​

You might get the idea that this supports @chic 's point.
 
chic said:
They've got to set people free, vaccinated or not. because they are all losing popularity and their very jobs will follow. This is why lockdowns and mask mandates don't work in social democracies.
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The mask mandate date is still in force here
 
Pink Biz said:
@JonDouglas what's up with all of your Saul Alinsky references?
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Just helping to make people aware of this commonly used political tactic. He wrote the book on how to radicalize (as opposed to logically approach) ideas and events. Personally, I prefer shared information, logic and reasoning and think it will serve us better than essentially street brawling on the internet. Here's a summary of Alinsky's tactics, so you can recognize them when you see them:

  1. 1 "Power is not only what you have but what the enemy thinks you have."
  2. 2"Never go outside the expertise of your people."
  3. 3"Whenever possible go outside the expertise of the enemy."
  4. 4"Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules."
  5. 5 "Ridicule is man's most potent weapon. There is no defense. It is almost impossible to counterattack ridicule. Also it infuriates the opposition, who then react to your advantage."
  6. 6"A good tactic is one your people enjoy."
  7. 7 "A tactic that drags on too long becomes a drag."
  8. 8"Keep the pressure on."
  9. 9"The threat is usually more terrifying than the thing itself. "
  10. 10 "The major premise for tactics is the development of operations that will maintain a constant pressure upon the opposition."
  11. 11 "If you push a negative hard and deep enough it will break through into its counterside; this is based on the principle that every positive has its negative."
  12. 12 "The price of a successful attack is a constructive alternative."
  13. 13"Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it. "
You can even see such tactics used on this forum from time to time. It tends to stifle the flow of information.
 
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JonDouglas said:
I have to wonder if lockdown states like NY, CA, et. al. will loose more of their current crop of politicians or more people who're sick of their policies and move to a different state.
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In California, people moved to other states at a rate of 5,000/year over the last 2 years, and this year that number is expected to nearly double. Major corporations have relocated, too.
 
fmdog44 said:
I have four boxes of gloves (only two are new) and probably five containers of wipes and the same number of sprays and four bottles of isopropyl alcohol.
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I've gotcha beat. I have 6 boxes of Nitrile gloves, 7 boxes of alcohol wipes & 5 bottles of alcohol.
But the gloves are for protecting my hands from gun cleaning chemicals.
The alcohol wipes are used when injecting insulin.
The alcohol is used in spray bottles so I can re-use my masks several times.
 
Murrmurr said:
In California, people moved to other states at a rate of 5,000/year over the last 2 years, and this year that number is expected to nearly double. Major corporations have relocated, too.
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My older brother used to have a saying written on the cover of his school books back when we were in grade school. It said "flunk now, avoid the June rush".

I avoided the California rush to leave by leaving when I went into the Army in 1970, and never looked back. The only way I go back to LA is if I have a return ticket. Since I am retired and don't need to go out there for business anymore, I only go for funerals.

When I first moved to the Twin Cities in 1978, I remember that one of the local radio stations had some sort of contest with the prize being an all expenses paid trip to Hollywood. I was absolutely baffled as to why anyone would want to go there. That was where all the runaways went and it was not a good part of town. All that people thought of as Hollywood had left a long time ago.

Tony
 
Murrmurr said:
In California, people moved to other states at a rate of 5,000/year over the last 2 years, and this year that number is expected to nearly double. Major corporations have relocated, too.
Click to expand...

Both California and New York are seeing more and more people moving to other States. I suspect the ridiculous "cost of living" in those areas is a primary reason. This pandemic has shown that many "office" jobs can easily be handled by people working from home....which is another incentive for many to leave the crowded/expensive cities/states. States like California, New York, and Illinois have issues with their financing, which leads to higher corporate taxes, etc., and this will cause companies to move to other States.

I have some cousins who lived/worked in the SF Bay area, and when they retired, they soon moved to Denver...where they claim their retirement money goes much further.
 
Don M. said:
Both California and New York are seeing more and more people moving to other States. I suspect the ridiculous "cost of living" in those areas is a primary reason. This pandemic has shown that many "office" jobs can easily be handled by people working from home....which is another incentive for many to leave the crowded/expensive cities/states. States like California, New York, and Illinois have issues with their financing, which leads to higher corporate taxes, etc., and this will cause companies to move to other States.

I have some cousins who lived/worked in the SF Bay area, and when they retired, they soon moved to Denver...where they claim their retirement money goes much further.
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There are a number of other additional reasons too (at least in California), but they have to do with politics so they can't be discussed here.

Tony
 
tbeltrans said:
There are a number of other additional reasons too (at least in California), but they have to do with politics so they can't be discussed here.

Tony
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I hear ya. When I see some of the political nonsense going on in some of the States, on the news, I fully understand why a lot of people might be getting fed up with that, and move to a more "sensible" part of the nation.
 
Aneeda72 said:
The mask mandate date is still in force here
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Here also because we have the misfortune to border New York. But Texas, fully open and mandate free, has better numbers than we do so it's all pretty useless unless it makes someone feel better and then they are free to wear a mask even if it's not mandated. Let the rest of us have the same option as well. The mask mandate is to keep people intimidated and afraid 24/7 that there is something abnormal and dangerous over which they are powerless. This alone would make a person sick.
 
California has plenty of residents to spare. Anyone who dislikes the politics is more than welcome to leave - and if they want to take a few friends with them, that's ok, too.

It won't hurt the feelings of those of us who love California - trust me.
 

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