hollydolly
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really?...well they sound exactly like the type of people that should be around animals....hmmm...perhaps not eh?
Do You Think Zoos, Circuses, Rodeos, etc. Are Entertainment or Animal Cruelty?
- Thread starter SeaBreeze
- Start date
really?...well they sound exactly like the type of people that should be around animals....hmmm...perhaps not eh?
CR - As you have given a clear picture of who you are by your statements and as it is obvious that your opinion on this subject here is only one among many and as you have brought your supportive network of stereotypical "tough bull riders and get in your face people who wouldn't hesitate to tell me how they feel" into the picture - it shows that Peta has a hard job ahead in this matter, but Peta's numbers are increasing while the numbers of your tough bull riders are dwindling.
ClassicRockr
Well-known Member
Well, since it's obvious you know very little-to-nothing about pro-rodeo, I'll leave your "dwindling" word alone. PETA does have a hard job ahead! Now, what about the other dude on here that likes the zoo, rodeo and the circus..........go talk to him now!
Now, back to my "kiss-butt" Classic Rock music.
Now, back to my "kiss-butt" Classic Rock music.
Greatest Show on Earth, or Greatest Hell on Earth. My heart goes out to these poor creatures when I see what their lives have become thanks to humans. Those trainers who beat them and whip them, I would like to do the same to them. Warning: language and upsetting content.
hollydolly
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- London England
I clicked on the spoiler link but as soon as I saw the title I shut it off , I just can't watch it SB.. 
From the U.K.............
There were fears that only big cats and elephants would be banned from travelling circuses after MPs’ recommendations early this summer.
But now there has been confirmation from Government ministers that a ban on the use of all wild animals in circuses in England will go ahead by the end of 2015.
Many leading charities and animal welfare organisations such as the RSPCA, Born Free Foundation, the British Veterinary Association and the Captive Animals’ Protection Society have campaigned together against wild animals being used in circuses.
The RSPCA has been particularly outspoken, warning that wild animals are likely to suffer from being dragged around the country from pillar to post just so audiences can be “entertained.
RSPCA senior scientist Dr Ros Clubb said: “It is a great relief that the Government has listened to reason and we are back on track to getting a proper ban on the use of all wild animals in circuses.
“As the Government has pointed out, there is absolutely no basis for protecting only a select group of wild animals, and no desire to do so from MPs, the public or animal welfare groups. No wild animals belong in a circus.
“Now we need to leap over the final hurdle and get a definite date for this legislation to be passed and end this outdated practise.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/nature/438753/AT-LAST-Ban-on-ALL-wild-animals-in-circuses-is-passed
There were fears that only big cats and elephants would be banned from travelling circuses after MPs’ recommendations early this summer.
But now there has been confirmation from Government ministers that a ban on the use of all wild animals in circuses in England will go ahead by the end of 2015.
Many leading charities and animal welfare organisations such as the RSPCA, Born Free Foundation, the British Veterinary Association and the Captive Animals’ Protection Society have campaigned together against wild animals being used in circuses.
The RSPCA has been particularly outspoken, warning that wild animals are likely to suffer from being dragged around the country from pillar to post just so audiences can be “entertained.
RSPCA senior scientist Dr Ros Clubb said: “It is a great relief that the Government has listened to reason and we are back on track to getting a proper ban on the use of all wild animals in circuses.
“As the Government has pointed out, there is absolutely no basis for protecting only a select group of wild animals, and no desire to do so from MPs, the public or animal welfare groups. No wild animals belong in a circus.
“Now we need to leap over the final hurdle and get a definite date for this legislation to be passed and end this outdated practise.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/nature/438753/AT-LAST-Ban-on-ALL-wild-animals-in-circuses-is-passed
hollydolly
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- London England
Wooohooooo great news Bee
ClassicRockr
Well-known Member
SB, a lot of people, for whatever reasons, don't want to know what goes on "behind-the-scenes" of anything. There are plenty of people, not raised on a farm or ranch, that don't want to know where the meat came from that they buy in their grocery store. Most people who were not raised ON a farm or ranch couldn't/wouldn't visit one. In these two places, owners take great care of their livestock, but there are things that "look" like abuse, but sure aren't. Farm and ranch animals can hurt people, so sometimes they have to be handled with caution and certain "tools of the trade" have to be used for the protection of people.
The people that don't like rodeo's, zoo's and circus's sure aren't going to show (video) the really great parts of these things.
People do abuse animals and I don't like it. There are some people that make a living in the rodeo industry and a darn good one at that. Some high school kids get fully-paid scholarships to college's and universities as long as they compete on the rodeo team.
Heck, there are folks that don't like the sport of fishing. They hate seeing a hook put into a fishes mouth and all I can say about that is..........whatever! Gee, what are we suppose to do for entertainment for families. SeaWorld is great family entertainment, but there are those that think that place should be shut down.
The people that don't like rodeo's, zoo's and circus's sure aren't going to show (video) the really great parts of these things.
People do abuse animals and I don't like it. There are some people that make a living in the rodeo industry and a darn good one at that. Some high school kids get fully-paid scholarships to college's and universities as long as they compete on the rodeo team.
Heck, there are folks that don't like the sport of fishing. They hate seeing a hook put into a fishes mouth and all I can say about that is..........whatever! Gee, what are we suppose to do for entertainment for families. SeaWorld is great family entertainment, but there are those that think that place should be shut down.
rkunsaw
Well-known Member
- Location
- Clarksville, Arkansas,USA
I have been a hunter all my life. I've had dogs all my life. I like to go to zoos, circuses, and rodeos. I eat meat.
I am also an animal lover. Probably more so than any member of PETA. I plant trees and vegetation for all sorts of wildlife. I supply food and mineral blocks for deer and other animals. I feed wild birds and squirrels.
I have never treated dogs and cats as children. To me that is animal cruelty.
So tell me "animal lovers" what do you do yourself to help animals? (Complaining about what others do doesn't count.)
I am also an animal lover. Probably more so than any member of PETA. I plant trees and vegetation for all sorts of wildlife. I supply food and mineral blocks for deer and other animals. I feed wild birds and squirrels.
I have never treated dogs and cats as children. To me that is animal cruelty.
So tell me "animal lovers" what do you do yourself to help animals? (Complaining about what others do doesn't count.)
I clicked on the spoiler link but as soon as I saw the title I shut it off , I just can't watch it SB..
Me either!
ClassicRockr
Well-known Member
SifuPhil
R.I.P. With Us In Spirit Only
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I agree with this. Many people don't want to know anything about what they buy, other than "Is it on sale?"
There are some people who make great livings selling heroin and illegal guns, too.
As for the scholarships - like with other sports, getting a free ride through college where the professors give you passing grades if you show up to class?
I wouldn't want any of them to go out with MY little sister ...
So how is fishing a sport? Isn't a sport a contest between two EQUAL contestants? How can you equate a guy who buys an application-specific boat and high-powered motor, fish-finders and hundreds / thousands of dollars of gear with a dumb, naked fish? It's just like bullfighting - ten guys in the ring with lances verse a worn-out bull?
Now if you're talking survival - catching a fish so you can eat - then yes, it's a good thing. But catch-and-release? "Oh, it doesn't hurt them!". Try sticking a treble hook in your mouth then pulling it out and going about your day.
Family entertainment? How about a walk through the woods? With cameras? How about swimming or paddling alongside those fish in the lake?
People make a big deal out of visiting Auschwitz, then they come back here and go to the circus and the zoo for a good time. Personally I don't see much difference - the prisoners are locked up, mistreated , used for experiments, humiliated and finally put down when their usefulness is at an end.
ClassicRockr
Well-known Member
Well, at least you agree with me on one thing........sure is better than none.
I don't know about the "catch and release" thing in fishing. I know what it's about, but being abusive to fish? Would really like to hear from fishermen that do this.
I don't know about the "catch and release" thing in fishing. I know what it's about, but being abusive to fish? Would really like to hear from fishermen that do this.
I agree with this. Many people don't want to know anything about what they buy, other than "Is it on sale?"
There are some people who make great livings selling heroin and illegal guns, too.
As for the scholarships - like with other sports, getting a free ride through college where the professors give you passing grades if you show up to class?
I wouldn't want any of them to go out with MY little sister ...
So how is fishing a sport? Isn't a sport a contest between two EQUAL contestants? How can you equate a guy who buys an application-specific boat and high-powered motor, fish-finders and hundreds / thousands of dollars of gear with a dumb, naked fish? It's just like bullfighting - ten guys in the ring with lances verse a worn-out bull?
Now if you're talking survival - catching a fish so you can eat - then yes, it's a good thing. But catch-and-release? "Oh, it doesn't hurt them!". Try sticking a treble hook in your mouth then pulling it out and going about your day.
Family entertainment? How about a walk through the woods? With cameras? How about swimming or paddling alongside those fish in the lake?
People make a big deal out of visiting Auschwitz, then they come back here and go to the circus and the zoo for a good time. Personally I don't see much difference - the prisoners are locked up, mistreated , used for experiments, humiliated and finally put down when their usefulness is at an end.
I posted the link from the U.K. to show what animal lovers have actually achieved.
In my post 65, I did say just because I enjoy going to the zoo and keep a budgie in a cage, it doesn't make me any less an animal lover.
SifuPhil
R.I.P. With Us In Spirit Only
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- Pennsylvania, USA
LOL - I'm sorry. I don't mean it to sound like I'm jumping on you - just trying to add a little pizazz to the forum.
Well, I know fish have a very hard upper palette, and it seems that there's a lot of info available for conscientious fishermen. I agree (that's twice!) that it would be good to hear from fishermen on this score ...
Empathy:
Definition: The ability to understand or share the feelings of another.
The topic of animal use and abuse seems to be a sensitive one and more complicated than I thought - it is very frightening to have your core values and beliefs challenged and the way you have been raised in society questioned. If those beliefs and values are threatened you might become afraid and angry because without them, you really haven't much to hold on to. The things you have done and thought you had accomplished become meaningless or even wrong.
People have been mistreating animals for eons, and it has been encouraged and condoned by their communities and society and even considered necessary for survival. But that is no longer the case. It is no longer considered very admirable to hurt animals. Big game hunting is gone. People are becoming more conscious and empathetic as well as knowledgeable about animals and how they are very similar to humans in many many ways.
So far I have noticed on this forum topic that there are only a few angry champions of animal mistreatment, defending it as if their life depended on it, yet everyone else speaks strongly against it.
Definition: The ability to understand or share the feelings of another.
The topic of animal use and abuse seems to be a sensitive one and more complicated than I thought - it is very frightening to have your core values and beliefs challenged and the way you have been raised in society questioned. If those beliefs and values are threatened you might become afraid and angry because without them, you really haven't much to hold on to. The things you have done and thought you had accomplished become meaningless or even wrong.
People have been mistreating animals for eons, and it has been encouraged and condoned by their communities and society and even considered necessary for survival. But that is no longer the case. It is no longer considered very admirable to hurt animals. Big game hunting is gone. People are becoming more conscious and empathetic as well as knowledgeable about animals and how they are very similar to humans in many many ways.
So far I have noticed on this forum topic that there are only a few angry champions of animal mistreatment, defending it as if their life depended on it, yet everyone else speaks strongly against it.
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rkunsaw
Well-known Member
- Location
- Clarksville, Arkansas,USA
Hmmm, I must have missed the posts from angry champions of animal mistreatment. Animal lovers like me and CR would never mistreat animals.
Hmmmmm - I can withdraw those words if you like - but you seem to be identifying with them.
This topic is about mistreatment of animals in zoos and rodeos and other venues of 'entertainment' such as greyhound racing and horse racing. From what I have read there are some posts which seem to be in favour of these entertainments and which deny that the animals are mistreated, contrary what has been shown. Perhaps your idea and definition of mistreatment and abuse is different from mine.
This topic is about mistreatment of animals in zoos and rodeos and other venues of 'entertainment' such as greyhound racing and horse racing. From what I have read there are some posts which seem to be in favour of these entertainments and which deny that the animals are mistreated, contrary what has been shown. Perhaps your idea and definition of mistreatment and abuse is different from mine.
I don't think either of you would mistreat or abuse animals. I still eat meat and know exactly where it came from, there are processing plants which are as humane as possible, and the practices of others are atrocious and the animals suffer greatly.
I still go fishing, although not so much as when I was younger. When we go camping we'll catch a few trout and fry them up in the pan for dinner. I haven't been around too many ranches or farms in my life, but when I was young I often visited a small farm where we bought our fresh eggs. The ladies who lived there were very kind to all the animals, and it was a wonderful experience.
I know there are a lot of animal lovers who enjoy going to zoos, circuses, etc., especially those with young children who want to learn about different animals of the world. Some zoos that are more like sanctuaries that provide acres of land and climate similar to what the animals are used to are much better than some zoos I have seen in my life. I have no problem with hunting, when the hunter makes use of the meat and hunts in the wild. The canned hunts or hunters who just want to shoot something for the hell of it, are things I'm against.
Although many folks may go to these places and still be animal lovers and be kind to them, the fact that these industries have a lot of abusive handling of the animals behind the scenes is an unfortunate fact of life, but I think things are getting a little better than they were years ago, thanks to the activists who are watching . The animals can't speak for themselves, and any animal lover with any empathy has to feel sorry for them, IMO.
I'm like you Cookie, I can't and won't go to dog or horse races, zoos, etc. I just can't enjoy myself, because my mind immediately focuses on the animal's well being. I had a dog years back, who I showed in a few dog shows as a puppy, both obedience and show. I didn't continue with it for various reasons, even though my dog did well and won his share of ribbons.
Having both participated in shows and gone as a spectator, I saw some treatment of the show dogs behind the scenes that I didn't care for. Owners being very short and angry with their dog if he was getting antsy. Dogs being in tiny cages for hours on end, until it was their turn to show, etc. No real abuse, but enough to make me feel sorry for them. I don't dress my pets up or anything like that, but I do treat them as part of the family and will always refer to them as my furkids. Sometimes their comfort is put before mine.
Thanks SeaBreeze - I feel the same, I can't deal with people who shout and get angry at animals. I once saw a man slapping and yelling at his dog on the street. I stopped and shouted at him to stop. He replied that he could do what he wanted because it was his dog. I've seen much worse things but can't speak of them as they are too painful even to think about. Hopefully people are more aware now and treat their animals better. But there are still many reports in the news of terrible abuse.
I always considered my cats part of my family and I treated them that way. They greeted my friends when they came to visit and took part in family events. But my mother's background was a rural one where they considered all animals as livestock even cats and dogs. My older friend who was brought up in an isolated farming community didn't seem to be able to communicate with animals at all. I'm sure most people love their animals deeply. My cats had language and understood quite a few words and knew how to communicate with me. From what I understand dogs and cats understand the spoken word very well. A friend's little Daschund dogs would only respond when spoken to in her native tongue.
I wonder whether the interest in these events is geographic or economic or social. But there are all kinds of people in this world - some very loving and kind and some not so much. Then there are those who will participate in these events but are nice to their own pet whatever it is. I'm not saying they are all bad people, that is what they know. Sorry, CR and Rk, I have to say this, but even Hitler loved his dogs and apparently his wife.
I always considered my cats part of my family and I treated them that way. They greeted my friends when they came to visit and took part in family events. But my mother's background was a rural one where they considered all animals as livestock even cats and dogs. My older friend who was brought up in an isolated farming community didn't seem to be able to communicate with animals at all. I'm sure most people love their animals deeply. My cats had language and understood quite a few words and knew how to communicate with me. From what I understand dogs and cats understand the spoken word very well. A friend's little Daschund dogs would only respond when spoken to in her native tongue.
I wonder whether the interest in these events is geographic or economic or social. But there are all kinds of people in this world - some very loving and kind and some not so much. Then there are those who will participate in these events but are nice to their own pet whatever it is. I'm not saying they are all bad people, that is what they know. Sorry, CR and Rk, I have to say this, but even Hitler loved his dogs and apparently his wife.
Those in other countries definitely treat their animal differently, in America we're not used to seeing those things. When I watch some shows on TV in certain countries, it's disturbing. Those who live on ranches and have their dogs and cats outdoors can definitely be animal lovers and not abusive at all, but I can't be that way with my pets. Even when I had an Alaskan Malamute, who had no issues at all with cold and snowy weather or being outside, came in with us at night.
When I see shows like Animal Police or Animal Cops and watch people who have dog fights in their basement, buy or acquire helpless puppies or dogs just to be used as 'bait' training, it breaks my heart. Those who leave animals tied outside 24/7 on a short leash, sometimes without shelter or even water, should suffer the same consequences, IMO. I don't know how many dogs or horses they showed that were nothing but skin and bone. People like that should not be allowed to own animals ever again.
When I see shows like Animal Police or Animal Cops and watch people who have dog fights in their basement, buy or acquire helpless puppies or dogs just to be used as 'bait' training, it breaks my heart. Those who leave animals tied outside 24/7 on a short leash, sometimes without shelter or even water, should suffer the same consequences, IMO. I don't know how many dogs or horses they showed that were nothing but skin and bone.
People like that should not be allowed to own animals ever again.
ClassicRockr
Well-known Member
I'll say one thing, Cookie.......you're definitely BRAVER than I am! I would never stop and shout something to someone about what they were doing, not in this "day and age" of people carrying concealed weapons. I value my life to much for that. Only one kind of person could do that and get away with it........a person wearing a badge and caring a 9mm w/handcuffs on a Service belt (Officer or Game Warden). Anyway, not only that, the dude was right, the dog is his and he can do what he wants to it. That is, until Law Enforcement comes into the picture.
AZ Jim
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I only see one side of this issue. The animals. I love all animals whether wild or domesticated. Unlike many others I will, can, and do become involved if I see animal abuse. It is MY business and if the situation warrants, I do consult proper authorities of the problem should my own efforts seem futile. Humans have the ability to escape danger but animals often don't or can't. What human do your know that when called will rush to you trustingly for you to do harm to them?
I have a story I'll share sometime about loyalty of an animal to his "owner".
I have a story I'll share sometime about loyalty of an animal to his "owner".
Jim, I completely admire, respect and agree with your point of view. When someone is hurting an animal in my presence or in my sight I consider my duty to try to stop them -- the same way any decent person would step in to stop someone from abusing a child.