22 mpg isn't bad for a rather large gas car. But my Accord Hybrid has really spoiled me - 52 mpg in city, 48 hwy. And I filled up yesterday - 618 mile range on 12.8 gallons. I hate stopping for gas, so I actually wish the tank was 20 gallons, which would give me around 1,000 mi. range.
Florida family drives into electric car problem: a replacement battery costs more than vehicle itself
- Thread starter Robert59
- Start date
OneEyedDiva
SF VIP
- Location
- New Jersey
Helen, I knew that HP printer ink was expensive, even at Costco, because that's the printer my husband used at his store and seems he always needed more ink. When my son and honorary daughter bought me an HP printer a couple of decades ago, I was horrified. Turns out the printer never did work right so I told them to take it back (and not replace it). I would have hated to have to buy ink cartridges for that thing. I've been very happy with my Canon printers.
OneEyedDiva
SF VIP
- Location
- New Jersey
I love it when I see classic cars on the road, which doesn't happen often. Last time I saw one was about two months ago. Your car is beautiful HC.
Tish
SF VIP
- Location
- Rural N.S.W. Australia
That is a huge chunk of change!
Please reread the post - Nissan wasn't quite so blunt, but VW said the batteries would "last the life of the car", 8 years or 160,000 km. Essentially saying, the cars are now a disposable item. Dead batteries? Buy a new car, scrap the old. And if you read the link in the OP, they have an 8 years old EV and replacement batteries are not available.
SeniorBen
Senior Member
Maybe there need to be some standard battery sizes so aftermarket batteries can be sold and used. I don't know. EV technology is still in its infancy and there are bound to be many more anecdotes such as the on in the OP before it's smooth sailing, but we're getting there. I've been seeing more and more EVs on the road, and that's a good thing.
I don't drive enough for it to be worth the investment, but if I were a commuter, I would. I switched over to electric lawn equipment and that's worked out pretty well.
I don't drive enough for it to be worth the investment, but if I were a commuter, I would. I switched over to electric lawn equipment and that's worked out pretty well.
I'm sure you all know that the idea of EVs is not new. Been around for almost 200 years. Here's an interesting article from Car and Driver. Lots of cool pictures... I especially liked the one of the EV Corvair, since my mother purchased a shiny new Monza in 1961
Electric Cars
Electric Cars
And as an aside, I got a call a couple of days ago, and I had to be in Southern Ohio the next morning at 9 am for a meeting. I left Central Florida at 2 pm, drove to somewhere in Virginia, took a snooze in a parking lot, later had breakfast at McDonalds, and was a few minutes early for my meeting. Left Ohio at 10 am, arrived at Florida home at about 11:30 pm. Round trip was 1,830 miles in less than 34 hours, and I averaged 33 MPG going mostly about 75. Let me know when you have an EV that would allow me to do that...
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SeniorBen
Senior Member
That's bizarre. It doesn't seem very efficient, but there must have been a good reason for it.
Bizarre? Not really. Even today some things have to be done in person. But my post was about the utility of a ICE vehicle vs an EV.
SeniorBen
Senior Member
Yeah, I wouldn't trust an EV for a long trip. They're not quite ready for prime time in that regards, but it would be a great commuter vehicle or a fleet vehicle. They would barely need any maintenance. No oil changes or tune-ups. Very few moving parts. Companies wouldn't need as many mechanics, so they'd save money. I wouldn't be surprised if a vehicle is introduced with easily swapped battery so dead batteries could be replaced rather than recharged and then taken back to the shop to recharge.
horseless carriage
Well-known Member
The early problem of changing the Tesla's batteries:
Has now been overcome. Access was always difficult
But now there's a vast improvement in battery access.
Em in Ohio
Senior Member
- Location
- OH HI OH
The life expectancy of new cars is a measly 8 years??? My 2005 Chevy is still running! It had over 150,000 miles on it when I bought it - but I haven't added much since. I was looking into buying a used Subaru Forester, but maybe I'll just sink some cash into my old girl!
Em in Ohio
Senior Member
- Location
- OH HI OH
Out of curiosity, what did the gas cost for this round trip?
The 8 years is for the EVs. ICE cars last longer. Currently, the average car on the road is a little over 12 years old. My current car is an '14 and I plan on keeping it for at least 4 more years. My older brother has a pick up truck that is almost 20 years old and has over 250,000 miles on it.
Cost of gas? I had to do the math, and I used approx 55 gallon. My car requires premium fuel so I'd estimate $250 or so. The prices varied by more than $1 per gallon. Paid the most in WV, paid the least in VA (I think). But the point is, if I had an EV, it would have taken 3 days to get there, and 3 days to get back. 6 days instead of a day and a half. What is time worth?
As they say, YMMV
Don M.
SF VIP
- Location
- central Missouri
Same here. Our vehicles are quite "old".....1997 Dodge Dakota with 108K miles,(17MPG), and 2006 Chevy Impala with 87K miles,(26MPG), both in good shape, mechanically and cosmetically. We are thinking about a small sedan or SUV, because my wife is having trouble driving the big Impala...she never drives the PU.
However, when we go past a car dealer, all we see on the lots are big SUVs and PUs....in the rare case where they have a compact vehicle, they want a ridiculous price, usually well above "sticker".
We only drive about 6K miles/yr., and even with better fuel mileage on a newer car, it would take us decades to break even on fuel costs. Over the years, I probably only spend a couple hundred a year for normal maintenance....oil, filters, tires, etc., etc. I put new tires on them about 3 years ago, and the Only major expense was a new water pump in the truck a couple of year ago....$400.
There is a major car show in the city in a few weeks, so we may attend it just to compare some vehicles without having a salesman bugging us. But, until there is a good supply of new small cars at the dealers, I doubt we will waste a bunch of money on a new car.
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We have a '91 Jeep Renegade...original with "bumpettes". Straight 6 that you can't kill with a hammer. Been garaged all this time...hub uses it every week - we call it our "toy" and take Sunday drives in it just for kicks. Its so old its been going up in value for some time now. Has about 50,000 miles on it.
Jules
SF VIP
Here’s an interesting description of the types of chargers.
https://www.canadadrives.ca/blog/car-guide/how-long-does-it-take-to-charge-an-electric-vehicle
Read more: Going Electric: Should I Buy an EV in 2022?
Online app resources like ChargePoint and ChargeHub offer maps for finding public charging stations across North America at all voltage levels, including Tesla Supercharger stations.
Read more: Charging a Tesla: How Much Will It Cost & How Long Will It Take?
Level 2 home chargers are separate units. They use 240-volt outlets – the same amount of power used by your home appliances like a stove or dryer – but they charge a lot faster than Level 1 (anywhere from three to seven times faster). The typical price for charging those units range between $700 to $1,000 and require a professional electrician to install it, so accounts for around $1,000 more for the labour and supplies. Tesla has a Level 2 Wall Connector that costs $635.
It costs Tesla drivers who use the Supercharger stations approximately 40% of what the same range would cost on a gas-powered car. As for charging rates at public stations, it’s up to the station owner to set their rates. Petro-Canada, for example, charges $0.27 per minute with their EV fast-charge network in BC, though many public charging stations in cities offer to charge at no cost to incentivize EV adoption. Pricing details are listed on ChargePoint’s online maps for each station.
The CAA website has a great driving costs calculator that can help you understand what your yearly charging costs will look like depending on your province or territory. Based off these CAA calculations (and not including initial home charger installation costs), a:
https://www.canadadrives.ca/blog/car-guide/how-long-does-it-take-to-charge-an-electric-vehicle
How Long Does It Take To Charge an Electric Car & How Much Does It Cost?
But while EV adoption continues to uptick, there are still a lot of common unknowns when it comes to charging electric vehicles – where to do it, how much it costs, and how far you can get on a single charge, just to name a few. We’re going to plug you in with answers to all these common questions about charging electric vehicles.
Read more: Going Electric: Should I Buy an EV in 2022?
What are the different types of EV chargers?
Whether you’re charging at home in your garage or at a public station, you are going to experience different levels of speed and voltage power. A standard home outlet is likely going to be your slowest option, but it will also be the most convenient. Public charging stations can vary in speed and adaptability. Here’s a look at the various types of EV chargers:Level 1 & 2 charging
Most home and public charging stations across Canada use Level 1 and Level 2 charging, with the J1772 protocol outlet, that works for all makes and models. Level 1 uses a 120-volt connection, while Level 2 delivers twice the power at 240 volts and a big increase in charging speed. Both are good if you can plug in for multiple hours or need a slight top-up at a public station to get home to an overnight charge.Level 3 charging
There’s also a combination of the two that uses both the Level 1 and Level 2 charging ports with one adapter (called CCS Combo) for fast-charging capabilities. Known as DC Fast Charging, or Level 3 charging, this is your fastest option at 480 volts. Almost all electric cars can use it since it’s a standard supported by most carmakers. Tesla now offers an adapter for owners to use CCS networks too.Tesla Superchargers
The Tesla Supercharger network is a different beast. These are proprietary Tesla charging devices that can add up to 320kms of range in just 15 minutes. The Supercharger network is exclusive to Tesla owners – at least, for now – and the network stretches from coast to coast in Canada. Many early adopters received free Supercharger access, but that program has been retired for recent purchasers.Online app resources like ChargePoint and ChargeHub offer maps for finding public charging stations across North America at all voltage levels, including Tesla Supercharger stations.
Read more: Charging a Tesla: How Much Will It Cost & How Long Will It Take?
How does home charging work for electric vehicles?
All chargers designed for residential installations are either Level 1 or Level 2. Most cars have Level 1 chargers integrated into the vehicle with just an electrical cord to connect and plug into a traditional socket. On average, it adds around 200kms of charge per 20 hours plugged in. In other words, keep your calendar free if you want a full charge.Level 2 home chargers are separate units. They use 240-volt outlets – the same amount of power used by your home appliances like a stove or dryer – but they charge a lot faster than Level 1 (anywhere from three to seven times faster). The typical price for charging those units range between $700 to $1,000 and require a professional electrician to install it, so accounts for around $1,000 more for the labour and supplies. Tesla has a Level 2 Wall Connector that costs $635.
What does it cost to charge an electric car?
Currently, charging rates follow your province’s electricity rates although provinces like BC are considering adopting EV charging rates for home users. That could increase the price to charge your EV, but it will still be considerably less than filling up with gas.It costs Tesla drivers who use the Supercharger stations approximately 40% of what the same range would cost on a gas-powered car. As for charging rates at public stations, it’s up to the station owner to set their rates. Petro-Canada, for example, charges $0.27 per minute with their EV fast-charge network in BC, though many public charging stations in cities offer to charge at no cost to incentivize EV adoption. Pricing details are listed on ChargePoint’s online maps for each station.
The CAA website has a great driving costs calculator that can help you understand what your yearly charging costs will look like depending on your province or territory. Based off these CAA calculations (and not including initial home charger installation costs), a:
- 2021 Tesla Model 3 (Long Range) sedan owner in Ontario can expect to pay about $375* in fuel costs per year.
- 2021 Nissan Leaf Plus SV 5D hatchback owner in British Columbia can expect to pay about $550* in fuel costs per year.
- 2021 Chevrolet Bolt LT 5D hatchback owner in Alberta can expect to pay about $535* in fuel costs per year.
- *Based on 45% highway, 55% city driving and 20,000 annual kilometres (November 2021).
SeniorBen
Senior Member
Why didn't you fly?The 8 years is for the EVs. ICE cars last longer. Currently, the average car on the road is a little over 12 years old. My current car is an '14 and I plan on keeping it for at least 4 more years. My older brother has a pick up truck that is almost 20 years old and has over 250,000 miles on it.
Cost of gas? I had to do the math, and I used approx 55 gallon. My car requires premium fuel so I'd estimate $250 or so. The prices varied by more than $1 per gallon. Paid the most in WV, paid the least in VA (I think). But the point is, if I had an EV, it would have taken 3 days to get there, and 3 days to get back. 6 days instead of a day and a half. What is time worth?
As they say, YMMV
dobielvr
Well-known Member
- Location
- California
Where do you put it?EV battery packs are HUGE! Here's one from a 2017 Chevy Bolt, which is a pretty small car. The battery pack is nearly as wide as the car.
I guess swapping out the battery instead of recharging isn't practical.
...technology still in it's infancy...
This is exactly a forced transition into electric vehicles won't work. Even a voluntary expedited transition to ev's won't work. EVs should be slowly and steadily integrated to the car market because of everything else associated with them besides price. For those where price isn't issue go for it. But EVs are not ready for prime time yet.
SeniorBen
Senior Member
It's mounted on the underside of the car.Where do you put it?
SeniorBen
Senior Member
Are they calling it a "forced transition" on Fox "news?"
The oil industry is still heavily subsidized and tax incentives for clean energy development was defeated in Congress, so I don't understand how someone could think that it's a forced transition.
When the energy and more recently the transportation secretary says 'pain' is needed from high gas prices as an incentive for people to buy an EV and wants more financial incentives/subsidies for people to buy evs sooner than later. How can a sooner not be part of planned and/or coerced transition to EVs?
https://nypost.com/2022/07/19/buttigieg-begs-for-electric-car-subsidies-as-americans-feel-pump-pain/
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