Farrah Nuff
Senior Member
- Location
- East of the sun, West of the moon
Senior grandmother stabbed in her garage in a gated community by a car thief.
- Thread starter WhatInThe
- Start date
JimBob1952
Senior Member
So what is your conclusion? That the 77 year old lady should have been packing heat? That she should have got the drop on the assailant and shot him dead? Despite your wishes, we're not all going to be toting .45s around.
There were about 45,000 people killed by firearms in the US in 2020. Suicides accounted for more than half of those deaths. So if you're a gun owner, you're much more likely to kill yourself than you are an assailant.
If a .45 is too much for an elderly lady, a 38 Spl, .380 or even a .22 would work. At least she would still be alive.
I have taught many women (young & old) who were frightened of guns to effectively defend themselves. It doesn't take an expert to hit a man-sized target from a few feet away; anyone can do it.
A firearm is the only way for an elderly person to survive an attack by a younger, stronger, larger person.
That's called "Reality." And "Reality" is the world intelligent people live in.
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^^^^ a fabricated statistic, designed by anti-gun zealots to discourage gun ownership.
In my gated community, there has been lots of talk about how we have the illusion of security, rather than real security. One example: a car driving in, without a resident's decal on the windshield, has to stop at the gate. The driver has to show a visitor's pass, or something else showing that they are there on official business (Uber, delivery vehicle, etc.) Otherwise, they have to give the name of the person they are visiting, who gets a phone call from the gatekeeper, and only after they verify that this person really is coming to visit them, are they allowed to enter.
BUT.... a regular bus drives right in, about once an hour, and discharges passengers! No passes, no questions asked, etc. I can't understand this for the life of me. The only reason given is that people coming to work, such as cleaning people, etc. who don't have a car, have to be able to come by bus.
Anyway, we have a (partially) gated community, I guess.
BUT.... a regular bus drives right in, about once an hour, and discharges passengers! No passes, no questions asked, etc. I can't understand this for the life of me. The only reason given is that people coming to work, such as cleaning people, etc. who don't have a car, have to be able to come by bus.
Anyway, we have a (partially) gated community, I guess.
The suspect apparently jumped a fence to get in the community. He also had also just stolen a bottle of vodka from a local liquor store. He was intoxicated and the store refused the purchase.
https://nypost.com/2022/12/13/anton...r-allegedly-stole-vodka-before-home-break-in/
Most drunks I knew can't jump a fence so he might have been on something else as well. Apparently he was in agitated state. The liquor store called him aggressive.
https://nypost.com/2022/12/13/anton...r-allegedly-stole-vodka-before-home-break-in/
Most drunks I knew can't jump a fence so he might have been on something else as well. Apparently he was in agitated state. The liquor store called him aggressive.
One place I worked had a police person come out to talk to us about parking lot safety, and that guy told us that an attacker would be a lot more experienced than us and would probably get the weapon away from us and use it on us. Considering my difficulties just getting my key fob oriented well enough to lock my car, I suspect he was correct.
Teacher Terry
Well-known Member
I live in a secure condo building. Although someone can certainly follow a resident in I feel safer with the inside hallways because if someone was trying to break in my neighbors would hear. I intentionally didn’t consider any places without them. Locally most have their door to the outside.
I agree people are people, but we have gun laws, and serious background checks.
One of the biggest myths perpetrated by some macho cops is that women are not capable of defending themselves & therefore should remain helpless victims. Part of the reason for that nonsense is the need for some men to show they're "superior" because they're bigger & stronger than women. The fact is, the biggest, strongest & "most experienced" thug would be utterly helpless against anyone with 15 minutes of firearms training.
Yes, an attacker CAN get a weapon away from anyone - especially if they are HESITANT to use it. It's quite rare for an attacker with holes in him to get anything away from anyone; he'll have enough trouble breathing.
What happens when people don't choose to be helpless:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ygjxLjEKp4
Victoria
Member
- Location
- San Diego, California
Wow, I guess that burst my bubble. Here I was thinking a gated community was pretty safe. Sometimes I didn't bother to lock my car doors if I knew I was going back out. 
Victoria
Member
- Location
- San Diego, California
There's also super spray mace that comes in the shape of a gun too for those afraid to use a real gun.
If they let a regular bus come on in, they might as well take down the gates because everything else they do is useless.
The bus defeats the purpose!
Indiana Joe
Member
- Location
- Indiana, USA
New York, Illinois and California have some of the toughest gun laws in the USA. The armed gangs own the major cities in those states.
You anti gunners just don't get the message: ONLY honest people obey laws.
Indiana Joe
Member
- Location
- Indiana, USA
And, I should have added -
When caught in one of those states, the monsters get out that same day on $10 bail
And, we all know from where they got their bail money - from robbing one of us.
She walked into her garage, probably carrying some laundry, or if she was going out, her purse and some packages. Is she supposed to have her gun drawn as she moves about her house? Was she supposed to be able to get it out of her purse faster than he could stab her? I just don't see most guns being handy enough to use during most of these events.
This is a sad thing to have happened but so are all those suicides and accidents caused by guns in the home.
I believe the statistics, the NRA keeps trying to refute them, but for every story about someone saving their family because they had a gun, there are more stories like my brother's friend's. He heard a bang on the front porch and found his six year old with his head blown off because the neighbor kid brought his father's gun over to play with.
That's where they get their guns, too.
I'm not in favor of stricter gun laws. I'm in favor of banning them completely with only a few exceptions for certain occupations. Eventually, particularly with the police buying guns back, there just wouldn't be that many around.
Indiana Joe
Member
- Location
- Indiana, USA
Ban them all you want. The predators will still get them. Unless of course you close all the gun manufacturers.
You know what you've accomplished then? You've made many of the eastern and Slavic countries joyful to now have a new market for their manufacturing of guns. Guess where a lot of those guns will go? Smuggled right into the USA. And do I need say which segment of society will have them? Remember, honest people follow the law, crooks and killers don't.
So now we are left the fact that a few honest people will chance buying an illegal weapon. However, all of the law breakers will desire to get their hands of one, and they will when they get the $$. And where will they get the $$?
C'mon! Quit acting stupid. They'll rob or kill honest us to get them.
Gee, banning guns and their manufacture really works? Right?
hollydolly
SF VIP
- Location
- London England
well it does here... and in most places in the world...
JimBob1952
Senior Member
Guns are banned in Japan. They had fewer than 100 gun related deaths last year. We had 49,000.
JimBob1952
Senior Member
Australia banned semi-automatic and pump weapons after a horrible mass shooting. Here's what happened:
Just over a year ago, Australia marked the twenty-fifth anniversary of the transformation brought about by the Port Arthur rampage. In a country of roughly twenty-seven million people, there are still a lot of guns in private hands—in 2020, there were an estimated 3.5 million. But the number of mass shootings, defined as attacks in which at least four people are killed, has declined precipitously. In the decade before Port Arthur, there had been eleven such incidents. In the quarter century since, there have been three, the worst of which involved a farmer in Western Australia killing six family members.
Just over a year ago, Australia marked the twenty-fifth anniversary of the transformation brought about by the Port Arthur rampage. In a country of roughly twenty-seven million people, there are still a lot of guns in private hands—in 2020, there were an estimated 3.5 million. But the number of mass shootings, defined as attacks in which at least four people are killed, has declined precipitously. In the decade before Port Arthur, there had been eleven such incidents. In the quarter century since, there have been three, the worst of which involved a farmer in Western Australia killing six family members.
JimBob1952
Senior Member
The UK has 0.24 gun deaths per 100,000 people. The US has 10.95 per 100,000 people.
Again, there are an estimated 400,000,000 firearms in the hands of individuals in America.
400 million
and 20 million or so are "AR" type weapons
and about 1/3 of American households have weapons
or to put it another way, about 80,000,000 Americans own weapons
And if you do the math, the average gun owner has 5 or so weapons.
How successful do you think you will be banning a type of weapon? It's too late.
And, comparisons to what happens in other countries is totally meaningless. For example, in Australia's buy back program, they took in 650,000 weapons. Americans bought 19,000,000 weapons in 2021, and 2,000,000 or so were of the feared "AR" type.
And we have an 1,800 mile, more or less open border with Mexico, home of many major drug cartels. Ban a gun here and in a New York minute, those guns will be pouring across the border with the drugs. How big is the border between Australia and Mexico? Japan and Mexico? England and Mexico?
One more number: in 2021, 5,400,000 Americans were first time gun buyers. 5.4 million new gun owners.
Have a nice day.
400 million
and 20 million or so are "AR" type weapons
and about 1/3 of American households have weapons
or to put it another way, about 80,000,000 Americans own weapons
And if you do the math, the average gun owner has 5 or so weapons.
How successful do you think you will be banning a type of weapon? It's too late.
And, comparisons to what happens in other countries is totally meaningless. For example, in Australia's buy back program, they took in 650,000 weapons. Americans bought 19,000,000 weapons in 2021, and 2,000,000 or so were of the feared "AR" type.
And we have an 1,800 mile, more or less open border with Mexico, home of many major drug cartels. Ban a gun here and in a New York minute, those guns will be pouring across the border with the drugs. How big is the border between Australia and Mexico? Japan and Mexico? England and Mexico?
One more number: in 2021, 5,400,000 Americans were first time gun buyers. 5.4 million new gun owners.
Have a nice day.
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Morons (like your neighbor's parents) should not own guns. They shouldn't drive, either.
"Police buying guns back?" We've had several "Gun Buy Back" programs. Some people brought junk, non-functioning guns just to make $100.00. And some people actually purchased cheap guns & made money selling them to the buy back.
As for "Banning guns completely," that's a wonderful idea. How would you suggest convincing criminals to turn their guns in??
JimBob1952
Senior Member
Different arguments going on here. Is more stringent gun control desirable in the US? In my opinion, yes.
Is it possible? Probably not. And it's not just Mexico, it's the hardened attitudes of the gun enthusiasts. They've weathered anti-gun sentiment after Columbine, Sandy Hook, Las Vegas and now Denver. Nothing has changed, except that there are more guns than ever.
But that's just part of my overall thesis, which is that in many sectors of life the US has lost the will and/or the capacity to govern.
Is it possible? Probably not. And it's not just Mexico, it's the hardened attitudes of the gun enthusiasts. They've weathered anti-gun sentiment after Columbine, Sandy Hook, Las Vegas and now Denver. Nothing has changed, except that there are more guns than ever.
But that's just part of my overall thesis, which is that in many sectors of life the US has lost the will and/or the capacity to govern.
Of course morons shouldn't own guns. That's my point. There's no way to filter those people out. The man was an engineer, I'm sure he did fine on IQ tests and had no criminal record. People can be careless, can gun dealers tell who is and who isn't going to be careless on any given day?
As for how to get criminals to turn in their guns -- that's what the buy back is for. Criminals are often addicts and at times they will sell anything they can for quick money. As for some people bringing in junks or buying guns to sell, who cares? The point is to get the guns off the street not to make a profit.
There's no way to get rid of all the guns, but other countries have managed to greatly reduce the number of guns and reduce gun crime in the process.