Dying with Dignity Canada 🇨🇦

[PeppermintPatty]

I have been asked by Helen Long to share this message which is what I’m doing.


As Canada’s leading organization working to defend end-of-life rights, DWDC has heard from thousands of people who have described the very real human cost of denying people across Canada fair access to medically assisted dying.

Without the option of making an advance request, countless individuals from coast to coast will continue to live in fear of losing capacity due to a catastrophic neurocognitive condition, disease, or disorder.

This is cruel and wrong — and will lead to unnecessary suffering for many people across Canada.

That is why we are keeping advance requests for medical assistance in dying on the national radar — and why the message you just sent to your Member of Parliament is so important. 

The Final Report of the Special Joint Committee on Medical Assistance in Dying was released on February 16, 2023, and recommended that the Government of Canada amend the Criminal Code to allow advance requests following a diagnosis of a serious and incurable medical condition, disease, or disorder leading to incapacity. But this does not mean that advance requests are legal.

Right now, PeppermintPatty , we have momentum on our side: an overwhelming majority of people across Canada (85%) support advance requests for assisted dying.

With your continued help, PeppermintPatty we can spread the word even further by sharing it with your friends and family on Facebook or social media — so that they too can make their voices heard. Every share, every like and every email sent brings us closer to a Canada in which the right to choose an assisted death is respected – and advance requests are legislated.

Sincerely,

Helen

Helen Long
CEO
Dying With Dignity Canada

 

[Murrmurr]

Hopefully, the right to assisted euthanasia will become a permanent law.

 

[fuzzybuddy]

The problem with assisted dying is who gets to decided what a "diagnosis of a serious and incurable medical condition, disease, or disorder leading to incapacity" is. Does someone, who has Alzheimer's, but not in pain, be a candidate? Is vanity an adequate reason not to endure life?
I have two fears about assisted dying. One is Nazi Germany and its attempt to euthanize the mentally ill, deformed and other 'drains' on national resources. While this seemed farfetched, and impossible in 1930, by 1945, it was all too true. And the other is using assisted dying to cut medical costs.
And assisted dying is essentially assisted suicide. The thing is, is the suicide justified?
I understand the desire to alleviate unnecessary suffering during final stages of life, but I think with the concept of hospice care, we may be doing a good job in that area.
Can you give who would be a candidate for assisted dying?

 

[Sunny]

Fuzzy, I think Peppermint Patty answered your question very well.

Without the option of making an advance request, countless individuals from coast to coast will continue to live in fear of losing capacity due to a catastrophic neurocognitive condition, disease, or disorder.

Examples would be:
One of those horrible incurable neurological diseases, obviously becoming worse and leading to total helplessness
Terminal, incurable cancer
Extreme Alzheimer's, where the person is extremely confused and helpless, and getting worse, requiring care around the clock

Those are some of the examples that make sense to me.

 

[birdy]

My two cents....there can be quite a bit of suffering and pain long before the "final" stages. Especially with a neurodegenerative disease.

 

[PeppermintPatty]

The problem with assisted dying is who gets to decided what a "diagnosis of a serious and incurable medical condition, disease, or disorder leading to incapacity" is. Does someone, who has Alzheimer's, but not in pain, be a candidate? Is vanity an adequate reason not to endure life?
I have two fears about assisted dying. One is Nazi Germany and its attempt to euthanize the mentally ill, deformed and other 'drains' on national resources. While this seemed farfetched, and impossible in 1930, by 1945, it was all too true. And the other is using assisted dying to cut medical costs.
And assisted dying is essentially assisted suicide. The thing is, is the suicide justified?
I understand the desire to alleviate unnecessary suffering during final stages of life, but I think with the concept of hospice care, we may be doing a good job in that area.
Can you give who would be a candidate for assisted dying?

You don’t have to be dying of an incurable disease to qualify.

The link below is from health Canada

https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/medical-assistance-dying.html

Medical Assistance in Dying

• To be eligible for medical assistance in dying, you must meet all of the criteria below:
• You are at least 18 years of age;
• You are eligible for publicly funded health services in Canada;
• You are able to make decisions about your health and provide informed consent to receive MAiD;
• You have a grievous and irremediable medical condition, which means:
• You have been diagnosed with a serious and incurable illness, disease, or disability;
• Your medical condition has advanced or declined to the point where it cannot be reversed; and
• You experience unbearable physical or mental suffering that cannot be relieved under conditions that you consider acceptable;
• You have been informed of the methods available to relieve your suffering, including palliative care; and
• You are making this request of your own free will, without pressure or influence from others.
• Currently, the MAiD legislation does not recognize mental illness as a disease, incurable illness, or disability
• HOWEVER mental illness was supposed to be added this year but it has been extended to next year 2024
• You do not need to have a fatal or terminal condition to be eligible for MAiD.

Who decides whether you qualify? An entire team of experts

Medical costs all federally funded in Canada. We don’t pay for medical costs

YES human euthanasia IS assisted suicide. If euthanizing our beloved pets is the humane thing to do why do we have to suffer so?

Why? Because there’s a LOT of money in taking care of aging bodies. Nursing homes don’t care that you’re in-cognitive and need your diapers changed. As long as your heart is still beating, it’s Ching Ching.

I’m not going to comment to the Nazi topic since I find it irrelevant to this topic.

This service can be offered in the convenience of your own home so you don’t even have to drive. You can invite family and friends if you wish.

 

[Wigglestein]

Both my parents had "Advance Directives" on file 15 years prior to their passing. Both went onto hospice near their ends. Dad had cancer and had no cognitive issues. He was ready and had chosen his path. Mom had dementia and was failing. She had in her directive a section on dementia.

 

[davey]

this 'topic' and 'abortion' are very very personal issues one concerning the beginning of life the other the end - I always thought that God started both however just to make it even more complex he/she did include a 'get out' clause in the original instruction manual ; it;s there if you care to search but just incase you don't want to ; or can't or won't it says something to the effect " however I also give you freewill"? don't believe me ; take a look - Now where does that leave us? - can a foetus exercise free will or a totally confused person in end term dementia ? - no easy get out clauses on this one?

 

[PeppermintPatty]

Can dementia patients request euthanasia?


Patients diagnosed with dementia may carry out a written request detailing the circumstances of how they wish to die beforehand, rather than waiting for the advanced stages where they will no longer be able to express their will.

If those requirements are met, someone living with dementia can request access to MAID through what is called a waiver of final consent.

If this goes against peoples religious beliefs then I suggest not doing it

 

[Lilac]

I agree with @fuzzybuddy. There is too much room for abuse. History has already shown this. Please think seriously about this as once passed, it will be very hard, if not impossible to undo. I see nothing but bad things headed down the road in Canada. I don't want to see that in the U.S.

Since 1996, my husband & I have our medical wishes set up with our attorney & on paper what we want done. Our family has been privy to our personal discussion in these matters & we don't want our family to have to make these decision so did it for them. They also know up front what we want & we have told them, nothing held back. This decision was made right after the Terry Shiavo case came to the national spotlight in 1995.

Long story to tell about Mrs. Shiavo, but IMO her side of the family should have a special place in hell waiting for them. A husband & wife knows what each other wants in personal matters. A H#LL of a lot more than any parents or siblings do in personal matters, let alone medical. Other family members can be so selfish in these matters thinking only of themselves.

My husband & I had a very very good friend who was diagnosed with ALS/Lou Gehrig's Disease. It was further advanced than was realized when John was first diagnosed & he went down fast. He was in a wheel chair, had problems feeding himself & was barely able to go to the bathroom by himself. John didn't want to see anyone in person at this point & he would only talk to us on the phone.

John was a proud man who always took care of himself & those he loved. I knew we could rely on him if we had too. In the end, he knew what was going to happen & he took care of everything himself. He decided to he wasn't going to be what he considered a burden to others, nor was he going to ask someone else to do it for him. He did it on his terms, his way. I respect him for this & will defend what he did. God knew what he was going through & I don't think it was against His law.

This has been the only suicide that was personal. The other suicides I & my husband dealt with was in law enforcement. Out of all of the those, only one I think had any justification for taking his life. Those are other stories.

And DON'T compare a person to an animal. An animal can't make that decision verbally for themselves.

In my opinion, if you want to end it, do it yourself. Don't ask someone else to do it for you.

I learned from John what it means to die with dignity.

 

[davey]

for those believers God once said supposedly "I give you free will................" remember??

 

[PeppermintPatty]

I agree with @fuzzybuddy. There is too much room for abuse. History has already shown this. Please think seriously about this as once passed, it will be very hard, if not impossible to undo. I see nothing but bad things headed down the road in Canada. I don't want to see that in the U.S.

Since 1996, my husband & I have our medical wishes set up with our attorney & on paper what we want done. Our family hasn't been privy to our personal discussion in these matters & we don't want our family to have to make these decision so did it for them. They also know up front what we want & we have told them, nothing held back. This decision was made right after the Terry Shiavo case came to the national spotlight in 1995.

Long story to tell about Mrs. Shiavo, but IMO her side of the family should have a special place in hell waiting for them. A husband & wife knows what each other wants in personal matters. A H#LL of a lot more than any parents or siblings do in personal matters, let alone medical. Other family members can be so selfish in these matters thinking only of themselves.

My husband & I had a very very good friend who was diagnosed with ALS/Lou Gehrig's Disease. It was further advanced than was realized when John was first diagnosed & he went down fast. He was in a wheel chair, had problems feeding himself & was barely able to go to the bathroom by himself. John didn't want to see anyone in person at this point & he would only talk to us on the phone.

John was a proud man who always took care of himself & those he loved. I knew we could rely on him if we had too. In the end, he knew what was going to happen & he took care of everything himself. He decided to he wasn't going to be what he considered a burden to others, nor was he going to ask someone else to do it for him. He did it on his terms, his way. I respect him for this & will defend what he did. God knew what he was going through & I don't think it was against His law.

This has been the only suicide that was personal. The other suicides I & my husband dealt with was in law enforcement. Out of all of the those, only one I think had any justification for taking his life. Those are other stories.

And DON'T compare a person to an animal. An animal can't make that decision verbally for themselves.

In my opinion, if you want to end it, do it yourself. Don't ask someone else to do it for you.

I learned from John what it means to die with dignity.

Don’t tell me what I can and cannot do with my life. If I could commit suicide I would have done it long ago. You don’t know me and know nothing at all about my situation.

If this isn’t for you then don’t do it but don’t tell me I can’t do it
And I can and will compare a compassionate exit of a loved one even if it’s a dog or cat to an incompassionate exit of a human being if I friggin’ want to.

Who the **** do you think you are to lecture and dictate about what I should and shouldn’t do?

You’ve chosen how you’d like to go
I have the right to do this same.

If this offends you then perhaps skip over the thread

 

[PeppermintPatty]

for those believers God once said supposedly "I give you free will................" remember??

Exactly and free will gives people a right to choose which I am doing. I’m exercising MY free will . Everyone has the right to choose for themselves. Nobody had the right to choose for you. Some people may want to keep that in mind.

 

[Lilac]

Don’t tell me what I can and cannot do with my life. If I could commit suicide I would have done it long ago. You don’t know me and know nothing at all about my situation.

If this isn’t for you then don’t do it but don’t tell me I can’t do it
And I can and will compare a compassionate exit of a loved one to an incompassionate exit of a human being if I friggin’ want to.

Who the **** do you think you are to lecture and dictate about what I should and shouldn’t do?

You’ve chosen how you’d like to go
I have the right to do this same.

If this offends you then perhaps skip over the thread

I'm not telling you what to do or not to do. Nor was it a lecture. It was my opinion from my personal experiences.

I just said be careful of what you choose as there may be no going back after the fact. Once something is in law, it may not be the law you intended or thought it would be.

Yes, everyone has free will & I witnessed that first hand with a man doing so in a no win situation for him. He did it with dignity.

And I still stand by not comparing our animals who can't speak for themselves with people who can.

Sorry you feel this way, but if you want support for anything, then you have to have dialog from both sides.

 

[Alligatorob]

Hey @PeppermintPatty thanks for the thread, and I for one agree with you. You have put the case well, and I wish something similar would be done in the US.

My husband & I had a very very good friend who was diagnosed with ALS/Lou Gehrig's Disease. It was further advanced than was realized when John was first diagnosed & he went down fast. He was in a wheel chair, had problems feeding himself & was barely able to go to the bathroom by himself. John didn't want to see anyone in person at this point & he would only talk to us on the phone.

John was a proud man who always took care of himself & those he loved. I knew we could rely on him if we had too. In the end, he knew what was going to happen & he took care of everything himself. He decided to he wasn't going to be what he considered a burden to others, nor was he going to ask someone else to do it for him. He did it on his terms, his way. I respect him for this & will defend what he did. God knew what he was going through & I don't think it was against His law.

@Lilac I appreciate your story about your friend John, and can see you cared about him. However what he did probably was against the law. Something like this would make it legal.

 

[PeppermintPatty]

I'm not telling you what to do or not to do. Nor was it a lecture. It was my opinion from my personal experiences.

I just said be careful of what you choose as there may be no going back after the fact. Once something is in law, it may not be the law you intended or thought it would be.

Yes, everyone has free will & I witnessed that first hand with a man doing so in a no win situation for him. He did it with dignity.

And I still stand by not comparing our animals who can't speak for themselves with people who can.

Sorry you feel this way, but if you want support for anything, then you have to have dialog from both sides.

You most certainly DID tell me what to do and it WAS a lecture.

This thread is NOT in the debate zone.

You started off stating that you see bad things happening happening down the road in Canada.

You and your husband have your personal plans set up since you don’t want your family to have to make any of the decisions.

You did this right after the Terry Shiavo case came to the national spotlight in 1995.

Well that’s great for you.
So basically YOU are doing this the way YOU want which is good. Everyone should be granted to do this the way they want. That’s what ‘free will’ is all about.

Then you go on about your personal feelings towards someone you don’t like stating they should have a personal place in HELL!

Wasn’t this the guy lethally injecting people illegally?

Theres your personal story regarding a friend of yours who committed suicide and how brave he was and decent cause he didn’t want to be a burden to anyone. You respect his decision and KNOW God was ok with it and YOU don’t think it was against HIS law.

You tell about other suicides you know of and give us your own personal judgment about those and that only one of them was justified.

Then you claim “A husband and wife KNoWS what each other wants in personal matters. A HELL of a lot more than any parents or siblings do in personal matters , let alone medical.

You then tell me “DON’T compare a person to an animal.

And lastly suggest I illegally commit suicide and don’t let anyone help me rather than going the legal compassionate route.

Just W-T-F!!!

If THAT wasn’t an outrageous lecture I don’t know what is

You made your plans the way you wanted them which is the way it should be. I wouldn’t dream of telling you that you are doing it ALL wrong. It’s NOT my place nor my business.

You praise the friend who committed suicide and state how respectful he was and KNOW God was ok with it. HIS suicide was justifiable but the others you knew WEREN’T?

I’m guessing this friend just easily picked up a gun, since they are everywhere, and shot himself.

We don’t have any guns and frankly I wouldn’t have any idea where to get one.

Whether GOD approves???
I certainly have no idea but apparently you do . I suppose God didn’t approve of the others you spoke of.

Generally claiming which relative KNOWS best is truly presumptuous. Now you are claiming that you know everyone else’s situation better than they do?

A husband and wife would know best? Maybe according to YOU but that’s not always the case. This might be FAR from the truth in many situations.

Telling me DON’T compare a human to an animal? You took the statement out of context. As an owner of pets we are obligated to make sure they don’t suffer needlessly. People AREN’T owned so we don’t actually have someone caring for us in the same way and how many people suffer horrible deaths full of pain, humiliation and heartache. It happens all the time. Dying of old age is a very profitable business. We will be kept alive as long as possible.

And lastly to tell me to go commit suicide on my own illegally instead of having compassionate professionals inject me LEGALLY is REALLY messed up for lack of a better word.

Do you know how many people trying to commit suicide fail and are left paralyzed , brain dead, seriously disfigured or bed ridden for life having to have a relative wipe their butt because they can’t?

Do you think those relatives are thinking how proud and courageous they were while their family has to spend all their life savings to get the specialized treatment their loved one’s needs?

Or even if the person is successful maybe a friend or family member has to wipe their brains off the wall.

With a lethal injection at least it gives family time to adjust to the decision made and be with that person during the planned and LEGAL exit.

Don’t ever lecture me again about YoUR personal opinions concerning MY final wishes.

And lastly I WAS NOT asking for YOUR support and even if I WAS, there was nothing supportive about your post. It was ALL about your judgmental opinions.

That WAS my lecture back at you.

 

[davey]

perhaps what we really need is are several different threads on the same topic? you know 1. for christians [but listing different denominations 2. for Muslims 3 for Atheists etc etc get the idea?

 

[OneEyedDiva]

And just think...Dr. Kevorkian was prosecuted for facilitating assisted suicide. However, it was presented that some of his patients were not terminal. Anyway, I have mixed feelings about this subject. While I feel for patients who suffer from debilitating illnesses including those that cause chronic pain, I'm not sure I would personally make the choice to die by assisted suicide. One reason being that suicide is considered a sin in Islam (in Christianity and other religions as well). But I watched my grandmother and my co-wife suffer, both from cancers and it was so heartbreaking!

 

[Jamala]

Sometimes, I have to hold my tongue when I hear some whinger carrying on about some of their minor “pain” ailments. Compare that to someone who is writhing in pain from an incurable illness. Think of the suffering of their loved ones watching them go through this. Horrific.

Now let me say, I believe a law is in order….very much so! If the doctor agrees (keeping to legal requirements) and if the suffering patient made it known beforehand that this is their wish…then I believe in this case, euthanasia is a blessing.
People should do their own thing and mind their own business when others want to do theirs!

I certainly would not want my family watching me suffer. I love them too much. Today, I have been receiving phone calls from all over the globe from children and grandchildren...I love them so much. Any decision I make, is to free them from the burden of making it for me.

My husband is Muslim and I am Protestant, neither of us are very religious and therefore neither of us believe in the sin bin!

 

[oscash]

I carry a Red Card with my Driver's Licence saying that I want to Donate my Organs when my death is eminent., either by fatal car accident or End Of Life. My boys know my wishes and know who to inform when the time comes. If I'm found dead while I'm still in bed then it would be obvious my organs would not be of any use. Some of my family think this is terrible, but I told them this is my choice. I asked my Doctor, seeing I have had open heart surgery, would my heart organs still be considered? All he did was shrug his shoulders; I don't think he wanted to discuss it.

 

[perChance]

perhaps what we really need is are several different threads on the same topic? you know 1. for christians [but listing different denominations 2. for Muslims 3 for Atheists etc etc get the idea?

And one where someone can voice their opinions without being attacked.

 

[Sunny]

As an athiest, I always think it's kind of funny when the "believers" claim to know what God does or doesn't want. If you believe in an all-powerful, all-knowing being, the only conclusion you can come to is that God "wants" things to be exactly as they are. Otherwise, this all-powerful being would change them. God isn't supposed to be the mayor of your town, or even the highest official of your country, sitting up there and watching to see what we do, and hoping we do the "right thing." Our own free will would be imaginary. Everything that happened would be God's will.

I think bringing God into this kind of discussion is irrelevant. These are human decisions, period.

Lilac, not all people in the situation you described (ALS, also called Lou Gehrig's disease) are physically able to "do it themselves." People who are paralyzed, in a coma, or even just constantly bedridden, etc. are not always able to kill themselves. That's the reason for compassionate assisted suicide. The more fortunate ones have it in their will, and live in a state or country where it is legally available to them.

 

[Alligatorob]

And one where someone can voice their opinions without being attacked.

Always for the best!