LGBTQ books in public school libraries

Sunny

Sunny

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Location
Maryland
Today's paper had an article about several parents (in Maryland, of all places!) who have removed their kids from their public school because of some of the books in the library about gay or transgender kids, animals who were "gay," etc. They are now suing to get the state to reimburse them for the expenses they have incurred by putting their kids in private schools. (Not sure if they are religious schools or what, it didn't specify.) They claim that if it were not for those books, their kids would be in public school.

I think the claim for reimbursement is ridiculous; people put their kids in private/religious schools for all sorts of reasons, and why on earth should the taxpayers finance that? But I also have some doubts about the appropriateness of such books on the elementary school level.

Where do you stand on this kind of issue? Should books about very controversial religious, social, or political topics be in an elementary school library? How about high school? Whose responsibility should it be to select the books in the library? Do parents have the right to protest? Or is it a slippery slope, which could end with a return to the Dark Ages?
 

Jamala said:
Of course the claim for reimbursement is totally ridiculous!
My own personal view is that children should be respectfully informed about
all aspects of life.
That way, they will grow up into empathetic and well adjusted adults.
We want an accepting world (at least I do) not one separated by divisions which serve no purpose.
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Agreed - LGBT seems to be here to stay - let's get on with recognizing it : respecting it and accepting it. Removing kids to private schools is sticking your head in the sand imo. The world is what it is we can't keep hiding away from it
 

Sunny said:
But I also have some doubts about the appropriateness of such books on the elementary school level.

Where do you stand on this kind of issue? Should books about very controversial religious, social, or political topics be in an elementary school library? How about high school? Whose responsibility should it be to select the books in the library? Do parents have the right to protest? Or is it a slippery slope, which could end with a return to the Dark Ages?
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Discussion of sex has always rested with parents. Indoctrination of grammar school five year olds in various abnormalities, and even though not mentioned in this post, Critical Race Theory, reeks of political indoctrination and has no place in public schools, at least not elementary school.
 
I don't think anyone wants to get into all that with 5 yer olds, however little Johnnie, a 5-year-old might possibly have 2 daddies or 2 mommies, so the class could simply be old that there are many different families, and Johnnie's is simply another family that loves each other and little Johnnie. That should suffice until the kids are a bit older. Any discussion about sex will probably come after the kids have already discussed it among themselves and got it all wrong.
 
ElCastor said:
Discussion of sex has always rested with parents. Indoctrination of grammar school five year olds in various abnormalities, and even though not mentioned in this post, Critical Race Theory, reeks of political indoctrination and has no place in public schools, at least not elementary school.
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this is stickin our collective heads in the sand - how many parents can be relied upon to carry out this task - probaby less than 1% - it can be done much more professionally and effectively at school level. who for goodness sake has mentioned critical race theory and I would not suggest sex education for 5 yr olds they should be having much more exciting things to do besides mucky old sex?
 
I think it is important for kids to be indoctrinated in all aspects of life because if they aren't when they are children they will be unprepared as adults. I wish my parents had been more forthcoming with me about LGBTQ issues, but it was the 70s and it was not discussed. I would have been much more prepared for life if they had. My Dad did have lunch with me after I came out and told me it was a difficult life but he would support me in whatever decision I made. My mother just cried all the time because she thought it was her fault. How times have changed.

Today, it isn't even an issue. Heck, gay marriage is supported by almost 70% of the country, so I don't know why some parents are making it a big deal. As @mrstime mentioned, I'm sure there are kids with two daddies or two mommies who live in loving households and they are being made to feel like outsiders.
 
During our most recent school board election a local Mom threw her hat in the ring. Her 12 year old daughter had brought home a book from the school library from the "Heartstopper" series. Not only was it a primer on gay sex but included the "F" word 18 times. The child is 12 and this is what her school library has for her. The Mom lost the election running against the teachers union endorsed candidates. The school was petitioned to remove the book and refused. The school board won't remove it either. They say kids see this stuff on the internet and maybe so. But seeing it on the internet and being provided with it by your school is another matter entirely. My question is if this book was about HETEROSEXUAL sex would it be allowed... OR would it be considered PORN!
 
I think it can be content ......

https://nypost.com/2023/02/28/knox-zajac-reads-aloud-from-pornographic-book-at-school-board-meeting/

even the recommended age of some of the books are older then the kids who now have access to this. seems like some very clear play by play descriptions and when this was on news on TV they could not even play the sound as it would not pass FCC rules.

that is not just understand that some kids have 2 moms or 2 dads etc..... but items that are more graphic save for older set.

In many states schools get x amount of dollars per student ...... the child not enrolled the public schools do not get that money...... so when parents put into private type schools in some states and more are passing the $$$$ follow the student ...........

this In my opinion is a good way for parents to have some choice if they disagree with some of the things that ARE going on in public schools
with the money following student ..... maybe lower income parents have choice not just the ones who can afford to change schools.
 
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you ask some pertinent questions W and not for the faint hearted. the first one would be at what age should school kids be exposed to such books in their school library ; and are such books necessarily bad for them - parents sometimes disagree with what happens to their kids at school but having parent nights has been a good option but whether parents should be playing much more active parts in running a school is another thing and fraught with difficulties - there are no simple answers but these matters should neither be ignored
 
davey said:
this is stickin our collective heads in the sand - how many parents can be relied upon to carry out this task - probaby less than 1% - it can be done much more professionally and effectively at school level. who for goodness sake has mentioned critical race theory and I would not suggest sex education for 5 yr olds they should be having much more exciting things to do besides mucky old sex?
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Don’t agree with sex education for grammar school kids? Sounds like you agree with those suing parents.
 
I was 5 when my grandma got me, the first thing she did was get me to an eye doctor the second thing she did was get me a library card. I don't remember being taught to read, but she must because I was reading before I started school. A lot of parents would tell the library what their child could read and what they couldn't. Grandma never put any restrictions on what I could read, and I have thanked her over and over for that! I read well ahead of my grade level, and comprehended it too. As a result I too didn't put restrictions on my kids reading and they read well above their grade levels too.
 
I think we should expect our libraries to provide current and well written content. I also was reading early and way way above my grade level. I could read a book at a very rapid pace. Any book that discussed content my mother was uncomfortable with would of been old news in a matter of days. In other words…no big deal. Exposure to alternative lifestyles…or political views is necessary to promote the type of critical thinking that people need to negotiate an ever changing world.
 
Jamala said:
Of course the claim for reimbursement is totally ridiculous!
My own personal view is that children should be respectfully informed about
all aspects of life.
That way, they will grow up into empathetic and well adjusted adults.
We want an accepting world (at least I do) not one separated by divisions which serve no purpose.
Click to expand...
Well said, agree. I think these parents who are overreacting are the main problem. We all live together on this earth, all people are different, it is beneficial for children to learn with an open mind instead of turning out like their parents.

I'm sure these books don't contain hard porn, that would be the only thing I was against, and that would not happen. The reimbursement is completely ridiculous, if your meltdown makes you yank your kid out of a school, you pay for your own anti-tolerance and homophobia.
 
Given that some 7% of Americans currently identify as LGBTQ+ (and the numbers are increasing), chances are excellent that among a classroom of 25 children several have a parent, sibling or very close relative who is not hetero/cisgender.

Kids are much more accepting of this than their parents/grandparents. Indeed, most kids don't understand what all the fuss is about.

To me, this says it all.

wanda.JPG
 
I was a school librarian for a while. It’s a tough call. Do you want a kindergarten kids reading about gay animals? Why make animals sexual at all? Completely unneeded for elementary kids. I tried to buy books of general interest, or books that supplemented curriculum. I certainly never pushed a political agenda, and I think that’s what this is. It would be interesting to see how much was spent on LQBTQ books, and what percentage of the book budget it was.
 
seadoug said:
My Dad did have lunch with me after I came out and told me it was a difficult life but he would support me in whatever decision I made. My mother just cried all the time because she thought it was her fault. How times have changed.

Today, it isn't even an issue. Heck, gay marriage is supported by almost 70% of the country, so I don't know why some parents are making it a big deal. As @mrstime mentioned, I'm sure there are kids with two daddies or two mommies who live in loving households and they are being made to feel like outsiders.
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Kudos for your father for supporting you and being open-minded enough to have a discussion. Sorry that your mom was so upset, but she was not alone I'm sure, even in the seventies. I was born in the fifties, when they wanted anyone who was gay to stay hiding in the closet, luckily my parents were accepting and never had bad words to say about gay people.

I've had some close gay friends over the years, both men and women, and I was blessed to have known them. They were good, caring people and a pleasure to spend time with. Mrs.Time had it right, the world would be a better place if we all were informed and more accepting of other human beings. Too much ignorance and hate, and that's very sad and not necessary.
 
Wigglestein said:
During our most recent school board election a local Mom threw her hat in the ring. Her 12 year old daughter had brought home a book from the school library from the "Heartstopper" series. Not only was it a primer on gay sex but included the "F" word 18 times. The child is 12 and this is what her school library has for her. The Mom lost the election running against the teachers union endorsed candidates. The school was petitioned to remove the book and refused. The school board won't remove it either. They say kids see this stuff on the internet and maybe so. But seeing it on the internet and being provided with it by your school is another matter entirely. My question is if this book was about HETEROSEXUAL sex would it be allowed... OR would it be considered PORN!
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If the child is 12, chances are she already hears the F word more than 18 times a day and is probably quite inured to it.

By 12, she is unlikely to need a primer on gay - or any other - sex. Quite literally, today's kids have all that info and more at their fingertips whenever they log onto the internet.
 
Such a hard subject.
I think kids should be informed of the real world in ways that won't harm them. That's the parents job but so many parents had bad parents that didn't teach them well. They're not teaching their children well.
Children are exposed to things in the wrong way, at the wrong age, and in the wrong settings.
Parents need help.
 
Not sure I know enough to have a reasonable opinion. My gut reaction is that nothing related to se*ual orientation or the like belongs in public schools. However I don't have the experience @seadoug does, and I would want to make kids feel as comfortable as possible... And maybe more importantly safe.

My one recollection of something like this was my school's first attempt at se* ed. I was about 13 years old. It was done by the gym teacher, and we were separated from the girls. Most of the "education" was about the evils of STDs. In fact after watching the film I wasn't sure how the STDs were transmitted, it appeared that getting too close to the wrong girl would do it... No mention of condoms. After the film the coach asked if we had questions, it was clear he was very uncomfortable. When one boy asked it if was possible to get an STD from another boy the coach blew up and said that was the most disgusting thing he had ever heard. Then he shut the class down, ending any se* ed... Didn't learn much. Hopefully we can do better than that today.

This girl may have benefited from earlier and more useful se* ed.

Indiana doctor reprimanded, fined $3,000 for talking publicly about Ohio 10-year-old’s abortion
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation...ing-publicly-about-ohio-10-year-olds-abortion
 
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Don't ask me because I am sick and tired of this issue and some others and I tend to skip these sort of articles. The First Nations and the Gay segment of our population have grown so powerful in the last few years that all politicians and almost the rest of our society tremble from fear of "not doing the right thing." We have become a very intolerant, conservative society where freedom of thought and action is frowned upon and very much discouraged by the so called "Politically Correct." Neutrality is not allowed. You are either with us or against us!

Last year our Prime Minister walked in the Gay Parade in Ontario. Our local premier was greatly criticized for not marching in the local Gay Parade. She decided to walk this year but is being "punished" by not being allowed to do any public speaking.

It is climate change that is going to destroy many coastal cities and kill millions of people; not whether you and I march in the local Gay Parade or whatever the media is telling you to do.

Enjoy your "warm" summer!
 

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