11 People Killed, Dozens Injured During Four Mass Shootings in the U.S. Over The July 4th Holiday!

[Murrmurr]

So long as our criminal justice system is based upon "coddling" the criminals, nothing will change.

That's the truth.

You watch or read about these courtroom hearings where the judge reads from a casefile, 3 felony domestic violence, 4 probation violations, 2 violations of parole, and 6 violations of a No Contact order..."I'm going to dismiss all charges except the one probation violation; how do you plead?"

"Guilty." Because, hell yeah, I'll take that deal. 93 days minus 67 served, plus an 8-hour class over 2 days that I'll never attend? You bet, now let me outa here asap so I can go victimize my ex some more...this time permanently.

 

[WhatInThe]

Most of these killings are done by younger males under the 30 in general. The Philly shooter was a different in that he was 40(mid life crisis ie the dabbling with cross dressing?) But being that lifestyle is frowned up in many communities, religions, ethnicities etc he might have been bullied when young.

Also many weekend shootings happen at gatherings and night clubs both of which have ample suppy of alcohol, drugs, dealers, gang members etc but there is also alot of innocent public around. But most of these shooters are from a world where death is the known penalty for a list of transgressions.

 

[Gary O']

And we can't rely on police. An armed officer can be at your home in anywhere from 4 to 20 minutes on average, depending on where you live. It takes a hyped-up, coked-up, meth-tweaking psycho, who's nervous as hell, 2 seconds to shoot your face off. Or shoot your kid, and then shoot your face off.

Yeah, where we lived, in the mountains, the local authorities did everything short of enforcing mountain dwellers to have a gun.
Anyone up there without one is a sitting duck.
Authorities do not go up there in the event somebody calls.
They generally mosie up that way when there's a body count
and only then after the dust settles...days, not hours

 

[Murrmurr]

. But most of these shooters are from a world where death is the known penalty for a list of transgressions.

And they do it anyway. Why? Because gang is family, and you'll do anything for your family.

But so will I.

 

[Murrmurr]

Yeah, where we lived, in the mountains, the local authorities did everything short of enforcing mountain dwellers to have a gun.
Anyone up there without one is a sitting duck.
Authorities do not go go up there in the event somebody calls.
They generally mosie up that way when there's a body count
and only then after the dust settles...days, not hours

Yeah, I've lived in some remote areas. You don't even bother to call the police til it's over. You've handled it; you just call to let them know so they can get the paperwork done and notify the kin, or whatever.

Dumb criminals like remote areas. I guess they're thinking is, police won't be a problem.

 

[Myrtle]

Please keep in mind that gun laws in America are very different than the rest of the world so those in other countries can’t possibly relate to what’s going on. We don’t have the same attitude or viewpoints that you are all accustomed to. It’s understandable that there’s going to be some friction due to this alone and since it IS an international website, there IS going to be opposing views.

Sure, there are opposing views. But the bottom line is the only people who can change things here are citizens and we already have many opposing views among citizens.

I'm a bit perplexed by why international members are so focused on American problems. Generally it seems they are far more focused on us than we are on them. I can't quite see myself telling the international members here how to run their countries because it seems disrespectful. Apparently they think less of us. Perhaps a difference between cultures.

Several (I'm not sure how many) of these recent shootings were during street parties. It's hot, people want to gather and party. Outside is the best place. That kind of scene is much easier for gang shootings, for settling a grudge and for getting away with it whatever the motivation.

 

[mrstime]

15 mass shootings over the weekend! Will Americans ever tire of it?

 

[Myrtle]

15 mass shootings over the weekend! Will Americans ever tire of it?

Have a great day, Mrstime.

 

[PeppermintPatty]

Yes indeed, I've heard them all. And I do understand them. I mean, I understand that it seems like one problem with one simple solution. But that just isn't the case. We're not just a bunch of gunslingin' cowboys over here, we're mostly decent people who are being victimized by an endless supply of sociopaths daily. Daily.

And we can't rely on police. An armed officer can be at your home in anywhere from 4 to 20 minutes on average, depending on where you live. It takes a hyped-up, coked-up, meth-tweaking psycho, who's nervous as hell, 2 seconds to shoot your face off. Or shoot your kid, and then shoot your face off.

Because HE has a gun. And he's extremely motivated.

Due to your laws being different and that guns are allowed, I’m assuming it makes it that much easier for crooks to take advantage of decent law abiding citizens. Being a law abiding citizen being taken advantage of by thieving, vandalizing crooks I CAN relate to.

Our laws here don’t protect citizens either and we have the same problems with police help wait times. Our laws are equally as frustrating and at a times, perhaps even more so. Its complicated stuff; 6 of one, half dozen of another.

One thing that isn’t as common here is gun ownership and the right to carry arms so, generally speaking, we don’t have that same threat. I can’t speak for all Canadians but I think many people feel that if they have a weapon , like a gun in their possession, that the chances of it being used on them by a criminal out to take advantage, would be greater. Having said that, most of us don’t know, because our laws don’t give the option.

Since we don’t have that option, most of us can’t relate to living freely amongst a bunch of armed citizens and we definitely can’t relate to living in a country that has an average of 2 mass shootings a day. Many of these shooters being children who got their parents guns/ weapons and went on a rampage killing many other children along the way.

In conclusion, I can understand the need for weapons to protect yourself and your loved ones however I can’t help notice the problems that come with these decisions; children get murdered as well as other innocent people.
That’s the part that seems senseless but as you’ve already stated, it’s complicated.

 

[Jeni]

it does not help when media reports with a slant ......... that may be the only thing people in other countries see....
example this same weekend a hotel employee in Las Vegas was able to stop what could have been a mass shooting as the employee was carrying his own gun.... not even a footnote on the shooting roundup....

BOTH police and media tend to bury those stories because for police it says no one counts on them and for media it does not feed a panic piece.

 

[Murrmurr]

Due to your laws being different and that guns are allowed, I’m assuming it makes it that much easier for crooks to take advantage of decent law abiding citizens. Being a law abiding citizen being taken advantage of by thieving, vandalizing crooks I CAN relate to.

Our laws here don’t protect citizens either and we have the same problems with police help wait times. Our laws are equally as frustrating and at a times, perhaps even more so. Its complicated stuff; 6 of one, half dozen of another.

One thing that isn’t as common here is gun ownership and the right to carry arms so, generally speaking, we don’t have that same threat. I can’t speak for all Canadians but I think many people feel that if they have a weapon , like a gun in their possession, that the chances of it being used on them by a criminal out to take advantage, would be greater. Having said that, most of us don’t know, because our laws don’t give the option.

Since we don’t have that option, most of us can’t relate to living freely amongst a bunch of armed citizens and we definitely can’t relate to living in a country that has an average of 2 mass shootings a day. Many of these shooters being children who got their parents guns/ weapons and went on a rampage killing many other children along the way.

In conclusion, I can understand the need for weapons to protect yourself and your loved ones however I can’t help notice the problems that come with these decisions; children get murdered as well as other innocent people.
That’s the part that seems senseless but as you’ve already stated, it’s complicated.

Here's the thing, hon....criminals can get guns, and they don't get them legally. True, they steal them from legal owners, but a lot of guns come in through Mexico, which is a massively huge border. Mexico is the favored source of weapons for gang leaders because they are relatively pristine, some are specialized and come with all kinds of cool accoutrements, and they're extremely difficult to trace.

 

[Murrmurr]

Due to your laws being different and that guns are allowed, I’m assuming it makes it that much easier for crooks to take advantage of decent law abiding citizens. Being a law abiding citizen being taken advantage of by thieving, vandalizing crooks I CAN relate to.

Our laws here don’t protect citizens either and we have the same problems with police help wait times. Our laws are equally as frustrating and at a times, perhaps even more so. Its complicated stuff; 6 of one, half dozen of another.

One thing that isn’t as common here is gun ownership and the right to carry arms so, generally speaking, we don’t have that same threat. I can’t speak for all Canadians but I think many people feel that if they have a weapon , like a gun in their possession, that the chances of it being used on them by a criminal out to take advantage, would be greater. Having said that, most of us don’t know, because our laws don’t give the option.

Since we don’t have that option, most of us can’t relate to living freely amongst a bunch of armed citizens and we definitely can’t relate to living in a country that has an average of 2 mass shootings a day. Many of these shooters being children who got their parents guns/ weapons and went on a rampage killing many other children along the way.

In conclusion, I can understand the need for weapons to protect yourself and your loved ones however I can’t help notice the problems that come with these decisions; children get murdered as well as other innocent people.
That’s the part that seems senseless but as you’ve already stated, it’s complicated.

Also, if you look at maps that show data on gun violence, most of them stress a correlation between education-levels and/or poverty and gun violence. Using the same maps and data, you can argue equally well that the correlation is between social programs and gun violence.

In states or counties where there's significantly less gun violence against individuals (specifically), you are also very likely to find less funding for programs like food stamps and unearned cash, free medical, free housing, free legal services, etc. They are places that refuse to coddle bad actors.

 

[PeppermintPatty]

Sure, there are opposing views. But the bottom line is the only people who can change things here are citizens and we already have many opposing views among citizens.

I'm a bit perplexed by why international members are so focused on American problems. Generally it seems they are far more focused on us than we are on them. I can't quite see myself telling the international members here how to run their countries because it seems disrespectful. Apparently they think less of us. Perhaps a difference between cultures.

Several (I'm not sure how many) of these recent shootings were during street parties. It's hot, people want to gather and party. Outside is the best place. That kind of scene is much easier for gang shootings, for settling a grudge and for getting away with it whatever the motivation.

We can’t relate to your gun culture or attitudes cause we don’t live there and if we keep seeing threads about mass shootings where children are shot and innocent people killed on a daily bases, it shocks us so we respond.

Are you suggesting that members from other countries shouldn’t respond at all to the shootings that happen in your country even though they are plastered on our forum on a daily bases? There are some members who seem focussed on your gun problems but I don’t view it the same way. I see members disapproving of your gun laws, not disapproving of members personally.

To be brutally honest, the people who do speak up about the American gun laws are basically echoing the rest of the worlds viewpoints. I’m quite sure these people fully understand that their viewpoint isn’t going to change your gun laws and I also don’t view it as them trying to tell you how to run your country.

It’s an international forum. There’s currently chaos happening in France and I know without a doubt that responses to those threads aren’t solely from the French members. Do you Americans not comment on other countries politics? Of course you do.

There’s a war between Russia and Ukrania .
Do we expect only members from those countries to discuss this war? Of course not.

Of course we have different cultures, with different attitudes and viewpoints. How could we not? I don’t think members think any less of other members due to where they live or their gun laws.

Maybe Americans are so used to hearing about mass shootings that they are desensitized to it. When members start comparing guns with spoons, it definitely leaves me scratching my head. At times it gets to me as a member which is why I try not to click on them but I haven’t quite reached that stage of maturity yet . I’m a work in progress type of person but willing and ready to learn to interact better however I’m not going to apologize for feeling how I feel.

 

[Naturally]

Sensationalism sells. Main stream media has to attract advertisers and sell.

"People Were Shot Today" isn't sensational enough, otherwise you'd find out about them only in obituaries.
No, now days it has to be "MASS SHOOTING", whether it meets the criteria for a mass shooting or not.

AND, they usually don't mention the demographics and/or other relevant details involved either. Usually not politically correct.
It is selectively edited and worded "news" articles to incite emotions and gain reactions.

More and more, main stream media is nothing more than editorial propaganda rather than real journalism we once knew.
People go to college for this stuff and they get lots of practice doing it. Their jobs depend on it.

Main stream media isn't here to solve social problems ... they are here to sell "news".
If it bleeds, it leads ...

 

[RadishRose]

Sensationalism sells. Main stream media has to attract advertisers and sell.

"People Were Shot Today" isn't sensational enough, otherwise you'd find out about them only in obituaries.
No, now days it has to be "MASS SHOOTING", whether it meets the criteria for a mass shooting or not.

AND, they usually don't mention the demographics and/or other relevant details involved either. Usually not politically correct.
It is selectively edited and worded "news" articles to incite emotions and gain reactions.

More and more, main stream media is nothing more than editorial propaganda rather than real journalism we once knew.
People go to college for this stuff and they get lots of practice doing it. Their jobs depend on it.

Main stream media isn't here to solve social problems ... they are here to sell "news".
If it bleeds, it leads ...

I agree.

 

[Myrtle]

Due to your laws being different and that guns are allowed, I’m assuming it makes it that much easier for crooks to take advantage of decent law abiding citizens. Being a law abiding citizen being taken advantage of by thieving, vandalizing crooks I CAN relate to.

Our laws here don’t protect citizens either and we have the same problems with police help wait times. Our laws are equally as frustrating and at a times, perhaps even more so. Its complicated stuff; 6 of one, half dozen of another.

One thing that isn’t as common here is gun ownership and the right to carry arms so, generally speaking, we don’t have that same threat. I can’t speak for all Canadians but I think many people feel that if they have a weapon , like a gun in their possession, that the chances of it being used on them by a criminal out to take advantage, would be greater. Having said that, most of us don’t know, because our laws don’t give the option.

Since we don’t have that option, most of us can’t relate to living freely amongst a bunch of armed citizens and we definitely can’t relate to living in a country that has an average of 2 mass shootings a day. Many of these shooters being children who got their parents guns/ weapons and went on a rampage killing many other children along the way.

In conclusion, I can understand the need for weapons to protect yourself and your loved ones however I can’t help notice the problems that come with these decisions; children get murdered as well as other innocent people.
That’s the part that seems senseless but as you’ve already stated, it’s complicated.

Due to your laws being different and that guns are allowed, I’m assuming it makes it that much easier for crooks to take advantage of decent law abiding citizens.
It's a right, not just a law, that we've had since the beginning of our country. There are more of them. Some of us value our rights highly, some don't. The disagreement is about keeping our rights or throwing them away.

You said, One thing that isn’t as common here is gun ownership and the right to carry arms so, generally speaking, we don’t have that same threat."
You see it as a threat but I would say you don't have that same protection, the option to protect yourself. Maybe it's just a matter of what we are used to. Isn't it a good thing that there are different places where things are done differently? I think so.

Since we don’t have that option, most of us can’t relate to living freely amongst a bunch of armed citizens and we definitely can’t relate to living in a country that has an average of 2 mass shootings a day. Many of these shooters being children who got their parents guns/ weapons and went on a rampage killing many other children along the way.
Not everyone agrees that those mass shooting numbers are reliable. Some of them come from gun control groups with an agenda to push. If I'm ever in a public place with an armed criminal I will hope that there will be a legally armed citizen there to tend to business and there's a pretty good chance of it.

It makes sense to me that international members see things differently. I don't mind that people have opposite views. On this issue they have become repetitive because there are some here who feel so strongly that the topic is posted often. Then we all say the same things again.

--------

Ok, I see you've added more. I'll just go ahead in this one post.

Are you suggesting that members from other countries shouldn’t respond at all to the shootings that happen in your country even though they are plastered on our forum on a daily bases? There are some members who seem focussed on your gun problems but I don’t view it the same way. I see members disapproving of your gun laws, not disapproving of members personally.
Yes, they are posted on almost a daily basis. It's confusing that there is no politics allowed but this is a very hot political topic. It doesn't matter, that's just how it is. Sometimes I just ignore these threads. Unfortunately some comments aren't going to win friends. EDITED TO CLARIFY: No, I am not suggesting that members from other countries should not respond.

To be brutally honest, the people who do speak up about the American gun laws are basically echoing the rest of the worlds viewpoints. I’m quite sure these people fully understand that their viewpoint isn’t going to change your gun laws and I also don’t view it as them trying to tell you how to run your country.
That's not very brutal. Yes, some of us may care more about the world's view than others. It's not how I make decisions. I accept that we are different here and it's a good thing to many of us. If people understand that they can't change our laws and they can't change opinions, I'm not sure of the point of the repetition of the same topic.

Maybe Americans are so used to hearing about mass shootings that they are desensitized to it. When members start comparing guns with spoons, it definitely leaves me scratching my head. At times it gets to me as a member which is why I try not to click on them but I haven’t quite reached that stage of maturity yet . I’m a work in progress type of person but willing and ready to learn to interact better.
I won't answer the desensitized comment with what came to mind, better left alone. I forgot who posted the spoon but I noticed the reactions. I think it was meant as an attempt to lighten the atmosphere or maybe to poke a little fun. I suspect we might see that differently too. That's another thing about this country. We are vast with many different kinds of people and have many little sayings that must seem strange to others.

If I've missed anything important you can let me know. I appreciate you, Patty.

 

[Packerjohn]

Here's the suspect who has been arrested for the shooting in Philadelphia.

----

EXCLUSIVE: Cross-dressing gunman behind July 4 Philly bloodbath that left five dead is BLM supporter who made chilling Facebook posts about 'black massacres' and 'evil spirits'​

The Philadelphia gunman who left five dead has been unmasked as a cross-dressing Black Lives Matter supporter who made chilling Facebook posts about 'evil spirits.'

Kimbrady Carriker, 40, shot dead four men and a 15-year-old boy in the Kingsessing neighborhood on the eve of the Fourth of July.

He is now in custody and facing multiple murder charges after rampaging through the streets with an AR-15, a handgun and wearing a ballistic vest.

The killer has now been revealed to be a computer nerd who was obsessed by firearms - even posting video a few days ago of children at a gun range.

Facebook posts from March 2022 show Carriker dressed as a woman, wearing a bra, hooped earrings and gold bracelets.

He had posted eerie articles to Facebook titled: 'How do you know if an evil spirit is following you,' as well as a photo of a map listing historic 'black massacres' throughout the US with the caption stating: 'We kept the receipts.'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...y-bloodbath-left-five-dead-BLM-supporter.html

There are more photos at the Daily Mail link.

I thought you weren't allowed to say anything negative about black people in the US? We in Canada are not allowed to say anything negative about the "First Nations" regardless of what happens.

They just say that it was "a person of interest." Love those politically correct fiends!

 

[Alligatorob]

I thought you weren't allowed to say anything negative about black people in the US?

So far as I know we can say bad things about any mass murderer, regardless of race, religion or anything else...

I have and do.

 

[Myrtle]

I thought you weren't allowed to say anything negative about black people in the US? We in Canada are not allowed to say anything negative about the "First Nations" regardless of what happens.

They just say that it was "a person of interest." Love those politically correct fiends!

Well now, I guess Canadians must need a little help with "First Nations." Maybe all us Americans could solve that for you.

 

[PeppermintPatty]

“It’s a right, not just a law that you’ve had since the beginning of your country!”

This is what you grew up with. This is how it’s always been for you. I suppose this is like legalizing anything; there are always ones who will take advantage and ruin it for the rest.

“You see gun ownership as a threat!

No I don’t see gun ownership as a threat. Threat was the wrong word. I’m not sure what the right one should have been though. Lol

I see guns as killing tools. That’s what they are made for and my inner being / spirit doesn’t want anything to do with killing tools.

I’m not religious at all however I DO believe “thou shall not kill” and take it seriously. If someone comes at me with a gun in order to kill me, then I accept that I’m going to die but YES I do think coming from different places and sharing our ideas is a great thing.
Absolutely!

“Not everyone agrees with those mass shooting numbers.”

Well I’ve got to agree with Naturally in that news sells and is sensationalized.
Even Covid news was apparently exaggerated. New sells, disaster sells therefore mass shooting is a top seller.

THIS ^^^^^ is so true. New reporters always exaggerate current events cause that’s what’s pays their rent/mortgage. This is something I shall keep in mind.

“Yes mass shootings are posted daily and it’s confusing that’s this is a very political topic yet there’s a no politics rule.”

The ‘no politics’ rule is a fluctuating rule and I won’t elaborate on that one. Lol! Generally speaking I usually stay away from politics. It frustrate me, annoy me and waste my time yet I get caught up in those sensationalized titles. They seem to be made to seduce you in.

Some comments aren’t going to win friends. This is true. I’ve no doubt that I’ve angered members. It’s their country and they are going to be offended. If I’m offending members then I shall no longer share how I feel about guns and gun rights. It’s not that important to me especially considering I don’t like politics.

“That’s not very brutal.”

Well that’s good. I’m quite certain most people know that they can’t change your country’s rights or laws no matter how much they oppose but I honestly don’t think they are trying to. I think many of the people who strongly oppose laws, rules and ideas just like debating. In fact, I think it’s safe to say that most people who enjoy discussing politics also just like to debate. I think debates can look more aggressive than they actually are.

“I won’t answer the desensitized comment”

That’s probably not the best word I could have used. I probably should have just said that maybe you are used to this type of news and of course you aren’t. You probably feel very much like I do and that you hate seeing headlines about mass shootings.

“Comparing a gun to a spoon.”
I don’t think it was a hoax since the poster left links about an inmate being murdered by a spoon.

Another person suggested that I’m killing myself with a spoon everyday by over eating thereby proving that there’s no difference between using a gun to kill and a spoon.

Anyway I shall stay off of the threads if I am upsetting people. My opinion truly isn’t that important to me. I can let it go.

Interesting conversation Myrtle

 

[PeppermintPatty]

Well now, I guess Canadians must need a little help with "First Nations." Maybe all us Americans could solve that for you.

You truly don’t want me answering this one!

 

[OneEyedDiva]

No one thinks nothing can be done but what plans are differs ........
i read the links
#1 Chicago 2 of the 3 items were drive bys and also 2 were after 1 am at night..... drive by often have a motive (payback) or if random perhaps a gang initiation type thing......this was an average weekend for Chicago who has very strict gun laws .....laws only work if enforced not after the fact.

#2 Kansas night club after midnight...... my guess equals drinking maybe drugs and some basic argument and someone pulled out a weapon....... my question is why were they even carrying in that type of environment... where tempers can escalate over almost anything. insults or hitting on a date etc not a great place for anyone to carry any weapon in.

#3 Philadelphia random shooting carried out by suspect who seems to being dealing with a real mental health crisis.....

#4 Fort worth .... parking lot crowd hanging out after some parade etc.... late night is what was said .......again how much did alcohol play ? and how is large gatherings in parking lots not equal loitering......

Details matter in trying to discuss solutions to shootings........... but all we hear is it is the guns fault .........running around with out a hand on trigger?
look at WHO is behind a gun.....a person with false bravado .... a person who felt disenfranchised ..... a person on substances .... a person with no conscience or moral compass.......

We have escalating divisiveness in this country ........add any mind altering substance and zero thought of consequences.......before tragedy happens often late at night ...equals many bad things...

I was being facetious when I said nothing can be done Jeni. I do, however, realize that this is a very complicated problem. Still it seems to me that more could be done to at least try to find solutions to reduce the threats. I'm sure there are measures that could be put in place to eliminate some of the shootings. As if things aren't bad enough, FLA governor DeSantis has signed a law that allows carrying guns without having to have permits for them! I also realize that criminals will find ways to get guns no matter what laws might be passed to restrict access.
@Been There You wrote: "Too many people have no respect for weapons and do not understand their capabilities. Just because you aim at an object doesn't guarantee that's where the bullet is going. A simple .22 can travel over a mile when used to make noise."
Seems to me that if someone takes an oozie into the streets, or school, or shopping mall, etc. and starts shooting people, whether randomly or targeting specific people, they don't care where the bullets wind up. And some clearly have the "more I can kill, the better" attitude.

 

[Jeni]

I was being facetious when I said nothing can be done Jeni. I do, however, realize that this is a very complicated problem. Still it seems to me that more could be done to at least try to find solutions to reduce the threats. I'm sure there are measures that could be put in place to eliminate some of the shootings. As if things aren't bad enough, FLA governor DeSantis has signed a law that allows carrying guns without having to have permits for them! I also realize that criminals will find ways to get guns no matter what laws might be passed to restrict access.

i know you were not being literal it is just many many facets to this issue. I only pointed out drive bys and any club or gathering with alcohol and drugs is bigger then just a gun issue.
The criminals have no respect for life we just cannot paint with only broad strokes ......... many should not have guns... bad guys ( or gals) and novice that have not had training....
I honestly think video games and overly violent movies like the John Wick ones are not realistic....
video games your push restart get a "new life" and no harm done. movies where people take several shots and the person just gets up and keeps going or recovered in minutes.
In real life even an errant bullet could end someone. no one is taught consequences anymore....... on almost anything everyone thinks they get a do-over.

traffic death estimates for the same weekend
There is uncertainty associated with any estimate. The 90% confidence interval for the estimate of traffic deaths this holiday is 515 to 731. This chart shows NSC Independence Day holiday fatality estimates and confidence intervals compared to the actual number of deaths. Because the holiday varies from 1.25 to 4.25 days long, the number of fatalities during the holiday also fluctuates widely from year to year.

 

[Myrtle]

This is what you grew up with. This is how it’s always been for you. I suppose this is like legalizing anything; there are always ones who will take advantage and ruin it for the rest. Yes, that's true. I grew up with them and because it's part of the history of my country, I think that it is unlikely that any minds will be changed in these discussions about gun control.

I see guns as killing tools. That’s what they are made for and my inner being / spirit doesn’t want anything to do with killing tools. Yes, for hunting and self defense, along with contests, practice, etc. It's fine that you don't want anything to do with them. Typically, pressure over guns is not insisting that someone use them but the other way around, people who insist that they should not be available.

A few days ago there was an archery thread, a very nice thread. But a bow and arrow, the kind used these days, is very much a deadly weapon. It was interesting to me that no one reacted to it that way. My relative is an archer and he has defended himself as a last resort with that tool, not against a human but against a very deadly animal.

Ok, no need to worry about the wrong word.

Yes, I've spoken to others who would rather die than use a gun to defend themselves. It's not that unusual. It's outside my understanding but it exists and I don't challenge it. People know what they want.

Yes, Naturally had a very good post about the media placed in a good spot in this thread.

The no politics rule is very confusing to new people. I've figured out that it 'floats' depending, and I'll let go at that.

I forgot that there were two spoon comments. The serious one referenced prisoners in jail filing spoons into shivs. Very serious indeed. The other one about overeating with a spoon is the one I thought was meant lighthearted but maybe there was another meaning.

I don't think you are upsetting or offending people, certainly not me. I'm pretty passionate about my country and about politics. There are lots of better places to discuss those issues and that's what I generally do. Somehow the gun control threads keep sucking me in here. Hopefully, I'll be over it and talk about the issue elsewhere. No promises, though.

 

[OneEyedDiva]

i know you were not being literal it is just many many facets to this issue. I only pointed out drive bys and any club or gathering with alcohol and drugs is bigger then just a gun issue.
The criminals have no respect for life we just cannot paint with only broad strokes ......... many should not have guns... bad guys ( or gals) and novice that have not had training....
I honestly think video games and overly violent movies like the John Wick ones are not realistic....
video games your push restart get a "new life" and no harm done. movies where people take several shots and the person just gets up and keeps going or recovered in minutes.
In real life even an errant bullet could end someone. no one is taught consequences anymore....... on almost anything everyone thinks they get a do-over.

I agree with everything in your last reply. I think video games also desensitize the act of killing and maybe even glorify it. I think some believe they are too smart to get caught, some think being locked up gives them street creds, some are mentally ill and should never have had access to guns in the first place and others are just plain evil and have no qualms about taking lives. We are in a sad state. God help us if things continue to escalate!