Debrah N.
Senior Member
- Location
- Alberta, Canada
I have said on several occasions that what Hamas did was horrible. I've never excused it. So how about you call out Israel for killing thousands of children over the past 70 years?
College campus protests news
- Thread starter Don M.
- Start date
Only Ohioans, Della
Call me crazy. It is clear that there are paid agitators on campuses stirring something that really smells. We can detect the actions of a fly scratching his rump light years away, and we CAN'T identify where the financing is coming from. I'm sorry but I just don't buy it. The majority of students involved in these events can't even articulate their own beliefs. Maybe we should start wondering just what makes some of these universities GREAT.Students at the local public University have set up an Autonomous Zone that they consider their private space. Apparently it’s no longer a public space for all students, but now belongs to a small group with muscle to enforce their beliefs. Lots of rules of conduct In the AZ such as no filming, and restrictions on who can enter the area. Speech is restricted both in terms of who you can talk to and what you can say. Thankfully, these students will protect us from fascists and other threats to our democracy. right?
Sadly the student union building at the local state university was occupied overnight by demonstrators a few weeks ago and trashed before the demonstrators were removed.
I read an article this morning about an MIT researcher who figured out that students in these so called protests were immature and misguided kids. Does it really take and MIT grad to figure that one out. Keen sense of the obvious. There is a monied source behind the paid instigators, and that is where the focus should be. Follow the money and find the coward in the background.
VintageBetter
Senior Member
@Remy UCLA and USC are super-proud of accepting low income students as long as they ave the smarts and grades, so not all their students come from privilege. But yeah, at both colleges, you'll have Trust Fund students.
I understand that some are still in the brain development years. That's true. But that's no reason to disrespect them. They have a lot of rage, they remember that the BLM marches made that issue important to the happy leaders in their towers, so they know that public demonstrations can get a point across.
My one big criticism of what the younger generations have studied over their lifetimes is GAME THEORY. When you have time read about game theory. I find it maddening because *&^% %$#it, LIFE is not a GAME. People's LIVES are not a GAME.
Maybe the older generations were raised on church and the Bible, right? Either as kids or young adults, we found a faith tradition, or even the 12 Steps of AA, NA, ACA or AlAnon and we found guidance on how to live our lives based on those inputs.
In school, we would get in trouble is we messed up. Nowadays, at so many schools, the kids really have to do something heinous to get suspended. Cuss out a teacher? Not bad enough to be suspended so go back to class.
But TODAY'S young people - are they churched? Not very many. Do they have strong, supportive nuclear families? Divorce rate is still 50% for their generations just like it was for earlier ones. Are their parents financially secure? Maybe, but maybe not. Depends on how many times their employer chose to downsize or leave the country.
But what is the ONE constant in their brains since probably age 4 and up? Computer games and later, the Internet and social media. CONSTANT input from the games and social media as to
Who I Am, and
How Life Should Be, and
What is Fair and Just, and
Who is Good in This World (they are) and
Who is Evil (old codgers like us).
Constant! Wake up and there is your phone teaching you about life.
Anyway - if you want to know how the youngers think, one way is to learn what they have been soaking in since age 4 or 5. Game Theory.
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/nash-game/
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/game-theory/?ref=theknowledge.io
https://people.eecs.berkeley.edu/~ddgarcia/papers/ABriefIntroductionToGameTheory.pdf
I understand that some are still in the brain development years. That's true. But that's no reason to disrespect them. They have a lot of rage, they remember that the BLM marches made that issue important to the happy leaders in their towers, so they know that public demonstrations can get a point across.
My one big criticism of what the younger generations have studied over their lifetimes is GAME THEORY. When you have time read about game theory. I find it maddening because *&^% %$#it, LIFE is not a GAME. People's LIVES are not a GAME.
Maybe the older generations were raised on church and the Bible, right? Either as kids or young adults, we found a faith tradition, or even the 12 Steps of AA, NA, ACA or AlAnon and we found guidance on how to live our lives based on those inputs.
In school, we would get in trouble is we messed up. Nowadays, at so many schools, the kids really have to do something heinous to get suspended. Cuss out a teacher? Not bad enough to be suspended so go back to class.
But TODAY'S young people - are they churched? Not very many. Do they have strong, supportive nuclear families? Divorce rate is still 50% for their generations just like it was for earlier ones. Are their parents financially secure? Maybe, but maybe not. Depends on how many times their employer chose to downsize or leave the country.
But what is the ONE constant in their brains since probably age 4 and up? Computer games and later, the Internet and social media. CONSTANT input from the games and social media as to
Who I Am, and
How Life Should Be, and
What is Fair and Just, and
Who is Good in This World (they are) and
Who is Evil (old codgers like us).
Constant! Wake up and there is your phone teaching you about life.
Anyway - if you want to know how the youngers think, one way is to learn what they have been soaking in since age 4 or 5. Game Theory.
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/nash-game/
https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/game-theory/?ref=theknowledge.io
https://people.eecs.berkeley.edu/~ddgarcia/papers/ABriefIntroductionToGameTheory.pdf
I don't have a bone to pick with our younger generation. If there is an issue there we need to look at the parenting that was or wasn't there. Maybe I'm seeing this through a different lens. It's what I have observed. I have a grandson who received acceptance letters from some very esteemed universities. He had a difficult choice, actually a life changing decision to make. I look at the path he did choose and I'm proud of his reasoning. Most of all I'm proud of the fact he knew it was a critical point in his life's journey and he has a strong family encouraging him. He'll do well.
TabbyAnn
Southern Indiana, U.S.A.
- Location
- Southern Indiana USA
Yes, follow the money.
This from the National Post::
Hamas's top leaders are worth billions. Here's how they continue to grow rich
Hamas's top leaders are worth billions. Here's how they continue to grow rich
Senior Hamas leader Ismail Haniyeh, right, with Emir of Qatar Sheikh Hamad bin Khalifa al-Thani,
Hamas leaders net worth:
Abu Marzuk $3 billion
Khaled Mashal $4 billion
Ismail Haniyeh $4 billion
Hamas’ annual turnover: $1 billion
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Debrah N.
Senior Member
- Location
- Alberta, Canada
When we're talking about Syria, your comment will be relevant. Today the discussion is about thousands of Palestinians deliberately killed by Israel and the disregard and complicity of the West.
Paco Dennis
SF VIP
- Location
- Mid-Missouri
Accusations about paid protesters haven’t been supported by evidence that I can find?
Debrah N.
Senior Member
- Location
- Alberta, Canada
I haven't seen any either.
Lilac
Well-known Member
- Location
- Flyover Country
You are making a gratuitous assumption.
Sounds like you just gave an example that we aren't receiving fair & balanced reporting because BBC & CNN are rebroadcasting what Al Jazeera has produced.
For the truth to come out, you have to have independent reporting & fact finding done by reporters from other news agencies. If a news agency uses the work of only one other, how are you to know the truth?
Which stories are you saying were made up?
Again, you're making another assumption that I haven't condemned Hamas terrorist for the vile actions they committed on Oct. 7th & hiding behind the civilians in Gaza using them as a shield.
The acts Hamas committed were beyond horrible that day. They killed parents in front of their children. They butchered children & babies. They burned families alive. They raped women to death. They tortured people & mutilated the victims while alive & dead. They even killed the pets.
From some of your posts, IMO, it sounds that if someone doesn't believe as you do you're upset with them. Everyone here has a right to voice what they think & there's no reason to be rude, just agree to disagree. Strange, you remind me of someone else who used to post here & was very upset over the view point of others at the beginning of this war.
As of now, we aren't going to be able to agree. Have a nice day.
Paco Dennis
SF VIP
- Location
- Mid-Missouri
Violence against civilians, especially children, is tragic and unacceptable, regardless of the perpetrators. Both Hamas and the IDF have been involved in actions that harm innocent lives. Acknowledging this complexity doesn’t diminish the horror of any specific incident.
The suffering of civilians on both sides doesn’t negate the need for accountability.
Mobilman44
Member
In the '60s, "they" were called "agitators", for that was their roll - to agitate the populace - and they sure helped accomplish that.
Today, we have a new breed of "agitators", and it seems pretty obvious their goal is also to agitate the populace - and it looks like they are well on their way to that goal.
Today, we have a new breed of "agitators", and it seems pretty obvious their goal is also to agitate the populace - and it looks like they are well on their way to that goal.
Paco Dennis
SF VIP
- Location
- Mid-Missouri
Yep, the legacy of agitators lives on. They continue to stir the pot, question authority, and remind us that change is possible—even necessary.
Mobilman44
Member
I'm reminded of a saying I heard many years ago from someone who was highly respected.
"Diplomacy is basically being able to tell someone to go to Hell, and have them look forward to the trip!"
There is a huge difference in peacefully protesting a perceived wrong, versus personal violence and destruction.
"Diplomacy is basically being able to tell someone to go to Hell, and have them look forward to the trip!"
There is a huge difference in peacefully protesting a perceived wrong, versus personal violence and destruction.
Brookswood
Senior Member
This is interesting.
sorry but the article is behind a paywall.
Students Sought Training Before Protests
sorry but the article is behind a paywall.
Students Sought Training Before Protests
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Paco Dennis
SF VIP
- Location
- Mid-Missouri
These campus protests reflect broader global conversations about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. They highlight the power of collective voices and the persistence of student activism.
The recent protests may have surprised many, they are rooted in careful planning, historical context, and a commitment to justice. The voices of protest all across America's campuses, urging change and dialogue.
The recent protests may have surprised many, they are rooted in careful planning, historical context, and a commitment to justice. The voices of protest all across America's campuses, urging change and dialogue.
Lilac
Well-known Member
- Location
- Flyover Country
This is a complex matter. As history has shown over & over in war innocent people die. It's very sad, but true. Remember Cologne, Berlin, Dresden, Hiroshima, Nagasake ... those are just a few. Maybe the civilians should be standing up to the ones putting them in harms way.
Please tell me what you would do to end Hamas who hide in tunnels under hospitals/schools & within civilian housing using their own people as human shields & stop future terrorist attacks to take place.
When are other Arab nations going to take Gazan women & children in as refugees out of the present war zone?
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TabbyAnn
Southern Indiana, U.S.A.
- Location
- Southern Indiana USA
One way to stop IDF violence is not to attack Israel. But how do you stop Muslim violence when they run all over the globe attacking people all over the world?
This from Wikipedia:
Islamic terrorism (also known as Islamist terrorism or radical Islamic terrorism) refers to terrorist acts with religious motivations carried out by fundamentalist militant Islamists and Islamic extremists.[1][2][3]
Incidents and fatalities from Islamic terrorism have been concentrated in eight Muslim-majority countries (Afghanistan, Egypt, Iraq, Libya, Nigeria, Pakistan, Somalia, and Syria),[4] while four Islamic extremist groups (Islamic State, Boko Haram, the Taliban, and al-Qaeda) were responsible for 74% of all deaths from terrorism in 2015.[5][6] The annual number of fatalities from terrorist attacks grew sharply from 2011 to 2014 when it reached a peak of 33,438
Since at least the 1990s, these terrorist incidents have occurred on a global scale, affecting not only Muslim-majority countries in Africa and Asia, but also Russia, Australia, Canada, Israel, India, the United States, China, the Philippines, Thailand, and countries within Europe.
Islamic terrorism - Wikipedia
Paco Dennis
SF VIP
- Location
- Mid-Missouri
The protests are about a massive humanitarian crisis happening today/now.
At Arizona State a large number of students were arrested and subsequently suspended. Now we hear they are suing because the suspension bars them from registering for classes. It doesn't sound like education was doing them much good. I suggested individuals at Columbia should be arrested should spend some time in Rikkers Island. I pretty sure hard case individuals they would share cells with would leave a lasting impression. You do the crime you do the time. Quit sending them to time out, it isn't working, put their parents in the same cell, and watch the word spread like wildfire.
Debrah N.
Senior Member
- Location
- Alberta, Canada
You obviously aren't receiving balanced reporting from any news outlet. Take the protests for example. Every news piece I've seen has failed to mention that October 7th wasn't the start of all of this. Every news piece I've seen has typified the protests as supportive of Hamas as opposed to pushing for a ceasefire and to end the bombins and starvation and an end to American dollars and weapons going to Israel. And I haven't seen any CNN or CBC or CTV piece talking about how some of the Israeli government are openly talking about allowing settlers to start building in Gaza...
As far as what Hamas has done, I think you're still hanging on to fabricated horrors to a degree. Fourteen kids got killed during the entire horrifying experience according to the Times of Israel. There were no burned babies or beheaded babies, no babies on clothes lines and the stories of rape that were presented in the NY Times have been debunked. (New York Times admits its Hamas rape story was fabricated). All this in the face of 13,000 Palestinian children being killed according to UNICEF.
If anything, I'm disappointed that there seems to be such little concern about the thousands of people who've been murdered in all of this. And Lilac, I don't think I've been rude at all, but I and some others have challenged your loyalty to a government that is murdering all these people, as well as the lack of empathy that's so evident in some posts. Humanity is full of pain and suffering and willing to cause or allow more of the same.
Debrah N.
Senior Member
- Location
- Alberta, Canada
IDF has been brutalizing Palestinian people for decades. Even when Palestinian people haven't done anything to them. I'd suggest you do a Google search for Breaking the Silence and read and listen to video testimonials from IDF soldiers who are speaking out about the shame of their abuse against Palestinians. You'll hear about them targeting families in the middle of the night, beatings, extra-judicial killings, destroyed homes, support of settler attacks.....Remember, this didn't start on October 7th, 2023
A bit different topic, but along the same lines. From Reuters.
But the U.N. Development Programme assessment notes that Gaza would need "approximately 80 years to restore all the fully destroyed housing units" under a scenario assuming the pace of reconstruction follows the trend of several previous Gaza conflicts.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/rebuilding-bombed-gaza-homes-may-take-80-years-un-says-2024-05-02/#:~:text=But the U.N. Development Programme,of several previous Gaza conflicts.
But the U.N. Development Programme assessment notes that Gaza would need "approximately 80 years to restore all the fully destroyed housing units" under a scenario assuming the pace of reconstruction follows the trend of several previous Gaza conflicts.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/rebuilding-bombed-gaza-homes-may-take-80-years-un-says-2024-05-02/#:~:text=But the U.N. Development Programme,of several previous Gaza conflicts.
Remy
Well-known Member
- Location
- California, USA
I guess we could all pack out sh*! and go. Give it back to the First Nations and Native Americans. But no one is going to do that either because I'm not moving to Eastern Europe.