US Birth Rates Plummet To 40-Year Low

oh don't worry - having kids means paying for plenty yourself - I havent met anyone who thinks we shouldnt have public education schools though.

Good luck with changing that.

I'm glad we have subisidised tertiary education here in Australia too - university shouldn't only be accessible for rich people.
 

January said:
oh don't worry - having kids means paying for plenty yourself - I havent met anyone who thinks we shouldnt have public education schools though.

Good luck with changing that.

I'm glad we have subisidised tertiary education here in Australia too - university shouldn't only be accessible for rich people.
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I never said college should be only for the rich. Get a loan if needed ....... but pay it back.
 
That would be the result of not having publicly subsidised education - it would only be available to the rich.
 

davey said:
which part of the reducing popn is gonna look after the old and infirm - are will you rely just on more imported immigrants?
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It probably isn't really going to be that.

No, this feels like another "Well, let them eat cake!" attitude to me. Typical of those who want to ride in the boat while others pull the oars.
 
davey said:
which part of the reducing popn is gonna look after the old and infirm - are will you rely just on more imported immigrants?
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And in the long run which part of the planet are you going to live in if the population increases exponentially?

Population reduction happens over time - if we have ZPG then we have same number of young people to look after the old and infirm in this generation and in future generations.
 
you can play with numbers all ya like - right now it doesn't look like many young are interested in caring for their own elderly - they're having too much fun travelling around the globe and getting hitched and havin own kids - I wonder if we took a head count here how many of us could say yes I am well cared for by my family ? still with those google and amazon layoffs = plenty of younger to look after the elderly now!
 
Not sure what point you are making now. 🤔

Whether young people are all travelling round the globe ( rather a sweeping generalisation there) or staying at home looking after old and infirm relatives doesn't change birth rates.

I want my children to travel if they want to and have fun - doing so and caring about older family members isn't mutually exclusive
 
January said:
And in the long run which part of the planet are you going to live in if the population increases exponentially?

Population reduction happens over time - if we have ZPG then we have same number of young people to look after the old and infirm in this generation and in future generations.
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I have worked and clinically supervised in the aged care sector both in uk and oz and never seen hardly any young people ever working there - clinical training placements YES but not a commitment to work there. The sector does NOT attract young people - unless you can count TV produced programs showing them mixing for a 4-6 week tv program
 
January said:
Whether young people are all travelling round the globe ( rather a sweeping generalisation there) or staying at home looking after old and infirm relatives doesn't change birth rates.

I want my children to travel if they want to and have fun - doing so and caring about older family members isn't mutually exclusive
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Same here. My children are all near 40 and do a little traveling, but their steady jobs keep them planted in the area most of the time. They are here for us when we need them and vice-versa.

Our hope is to age in place in our home (or perhaps a smaller one) and hire help as needed, with our children overseeing our care, if necessary. They're on board with that, having seen (and participated) in our care for our own parents.

If we need to hire caregivers or move to a facility, they'll do the vetting, just as we did for our folks.
 
The question is where those caregivers are going to come from, for everything from semi-skilled care on up to brain surgery. And how about research into improving and creating new treatments and care?

You can say "immigration" but if you've had any actual encounters you'll know that this pool has already been extensively tapped. The shortage still exists and will only get tighter over time.

25 years from now those entering their "golden" years will be facing even tighter access to necessary care. Reversing population decline now is the only thing that will help. I don't really expect that though. Selfishness is too culturally ingrained as a product of urbanization.

That probably means an even faster population decline in the future. Fewer are being born and fewer old folks will be able to get the needed care and thus die off sooner. And that doesn't even consider the lack of people to keep the world turning by producing food, building and maintaining housing and transportation, etc. Along with that economic woes will surely follow, leading to the need for shortcuts like rolling back environmental progress turning rivers into sewers again with orange skies in California.

It even looks more dire in most of the rest of the world.
 
In Pennsylvania, we have a state TV channel. One of the programs is an hour long visit to a PA. manufacturers. It's like a PA, "how it's made". One of the things I noticed was that in all these factories, the workers were in their 40s, 50s & 60s. In the next 20 years, we're going to be losing a lot of people, and were going to have a lot of unfilled jobs.
 
davey said:
I have worked and clinically supervised in the aged care sector both in uk and oz and never seen hardly any young people ever working there - clinical training placements YES but not a commitment to work there. The sector does NOT attract young people - unless you can count TV produced programs showing them mixing for a 4-6 week tv program
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that is a separate issue to whether people care about older family members.

I worked in Aged Care for over 20 years.

The workforce had plenty of younger staff members.

But more people are not going to be attracted to it as a career unless work place conditions improve and pay is better.

That has nothing to do with birth rates though
 
January said:
that is a separate issue to whether people care about older family members.

I worked in Aged Care for over 20 years.

The workforce had plenty of younger staff members.

But more people are not going to be attracted to it as a career unless work place conditions improve and pay is better.

That has nothing to do with birth rates though
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they must be camera shy when the docos are filmed?? - show us the stats then??
 
I don't have any stats. Nor were any docos filmed in places I worked.

That is my experience of working and of visiting various aged care facilities.

However whether Aged Care is attractive as a career is really a separate issue to the birth rate or population predictions or whether people care about their own older family members.
 
Pepper said:
The thought of strangers 'caring' for me. I'd rather be dead.
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I would so much rather strangers than having my son do it although I know from when I had Covid that he is a great natural born carer.

After I broke my leg I was in a nursing home for three weeks and I didn't mind it at all. I could see how well they cared for the helpless and very old. My roomie was 100. I think it varies a lot from place to place but it doesn't have to be awful.

My brother and his wife just moved into one of those places with graduated care. He is 79 and she is 65. They're both perfectly healthy and run around all day, he golfs, she does crafty things. They have a sweet little apartment with bedroom, living room, dining and kitchen, so they can eat at home when they want, but they usually prefer the dining room which they say has great food and delightful teenage waitresses who sing and dance as they serve.

Residents are provided transportation to all doctor visits, golf, church, the beach, etc. Their apartment is cleaned for them and there is medical staff on call 24/7.

I would love to know what it all costs. This is at Myrtle Beach.
 
fuzzybuddy said:
In the next 20 years, we're going to be losing a lot of people, and were going to have a lot of unfilled jobs.
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There won't be though. Business will adjust as time goes on. If they know there are less workers, they'll change it up.

There have long been campaigns against OVER-population. Here's one of them:

What we do - Population Matters

"Population Matters campaigns to achieve a sustainable human population, to protect the natural world and improve people’s lives.

We promote positive, practical, ethical solutions – encouraging smaller families, inspiring people to reduce excessive consumption and helping us all to live within our planet’s natural limits. We believe everyone should have the freedom and ability to choose a smaller family. We support human rights, women’s empowerment and global justice."

We shouldn't focus on numbers, and instead focus on sustainability and over-consumption.

You can see more historical scare-mongering from the 1960's - search Google for "The Population Bomb".
 
Pepper said:
I'm sure it's a fortune. I'm sure I can't afford it.
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Back in the 80's [I know, may not be a fair comparison] my mother lived in a place {St,Paul Lutheran} that was very similar . And [on SSI] she afforded it. My sister & I would kick in once or twice p/yr , but mostly she afforded herself.

Now the cafeteria was the type where you purchased the meal, but it was cheap, and I'll tell ya from eating there experience ....the food was good !
 

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