Many current elite college students can't read a book

If the messenger is that bad then THE message should be pretty easy to shoot(metaphor for the hypersensitive).

Ive seen too many stories over the last few years in which a lot of college students need to take remedial course just to get started in college. Mediocracy in education winds up spreading into medical schools, flight & law schools.

Exclusive | Nearly half of NYC DOE grads at CUNY need remedial classes

Most colleges enroll many students who aren’t prepared for higher education
 

Last edited:
WhatInThe said:
If the messenger is that bad then THE message should be pretty easy to shoot(metaphor for the hypersensitive).

Ive seen too many stories over the last few years in which a lot of college students need to take remedial course just to get started in college. Mediocracy in education winds up spreading into medical schools, flight & law schools.

Exclusive | Nearly half of NYC DOE grads at CUNY need remedial classes

Most colleges enroll many students who aren’t prepared for higher education
Click to expand...

It would be interesting to see a breakdown of preparedness for homeschooled vs private vs public schools.
 
Last edited:
Paco Dennis said:
I think when a headline or comment involves sweeping generalizations is where my radar bings. Sensational generalizations are a way to get clicks. The bias blinder comes from all perspectives, even the arguments against the bias become bias, with sweeping generalizations. Are we aware of that?
Click to expand...

Exactly. That's why I read across ideological spectrums. Our Congress can pass or not pass legislation and liberal legacy vs conservative sources will have entirely different headlines though they're discussing the exact same subject. And the headlines are written in language to sway readers to the publication's bias. (Sadly some people stop at the headlines and believe the BS spin.) Cherry picking is rampant and politicians or other people identified with Team Whatever are partially quoted out of context in order to support a news source's bias. Then there's news that simply isn't reported on by one side or the other because it's too damning to their agenda.

It takes a little extra effort thinking (and voting) independently but is ultimately so rewarding.
 
Last edited:
fuzzybuddy said:
Is the Atlantic article filled with data, numbers, graphs, or is just a couple of profs voicing opinions?
Click to expand...

Post 15 is the first part of the article. The author states there's not yet data but is based on the experiences of 33 professors the journalist interviewed. Scientists--if using the Scientific Method correctly--take anecdotal evidence such as that reported by professors and design studies in order to obtain empirical data.
 
Lavinia said:
I find this hard to believe, considering the number of new authors trying their hand at writing novels. The book store in my town can hardly keep the shelves stocked.
Click to expand...
Also interesting are statistics of what many people, especially young people are reading. Much romance novelettes, comic books, celebrity bios.

In high school during mid 1960s, I received an Incomplete one semester in an English class because she loaded us down with a ridiculous list of long fiction classics that greatly bored me. (ie Oliver Twist, Hamlet, Moby Dick etc) Although I read a bit of science fiction as a twentysomething adult, I almost never read fiction and instead large amounts of science, technology non fiction.
 
David777 said:
In high school during mid 1960s, I received an Incomplete one semester in an English class because she loaded us down with a ridiculous list of long fiction classics that greatly bored me. (ie Oliver Twist, Hamlet, Moby Dick etc) Although I read a bit of science fiction as a twentysomething adult, I almost never read fiction and instead large amounts of science, technology non fiction.
Click to expand...

I wish we had aptitude and interest testing early on in schools. Though we all need an exposure to a wide variety of subjects, intensive classes are best suited to kids who have talents and interests aligning with them and it's hard for some middle and high school kids to identify thier strenghts.

Did the English teacher who assigned the long list take time with your class to analyze pertinent life observations from all those classics?
 
Pepper said:
What a tired, old complaint, except the part about the money. So old it has whiskers! Heard that load in the sixties.
Click to expand...
Sorry to displease you. When I went to college there were actually both liberal and conservative professors -- an exchange of ideas, if you will. There are essentially no conservative professors anymore. And students are treated now as consumers, rather than as, well, students. Remember, this thread started with the observation that college students have become unused to reading entire books.
 
I feel that the problems began when we started pushing people through the system.

There was a time, not long ago, when going beyond the 8th grade was a privilege and responsibility of those with the aptitude, ability, and inclination to do so. Getting into high school required passing placement exams upon application. Just a couple of decades later the push began to force the masses into colleges in much the same way. When qualification and entrance exams became a bar to profits for the education industry they were cast aside.

To make it work things have been progressively dumbed down further and further. Graduation based on attendance became the rule and degrees are being issued in absurdly frivolous subject matter now.

Over time "education" has all but ignored teaching and become politicized centers of indoctrination. The rot extends downward into elementary schools now too, which started with BS like "mainstreaming" the emotionally and mentally challenged instead of providing them useful help.

The cost goes up and up while the value continues on a steep decline. Meanwhile our best resources are ignored and left to fend for themselves amid the violence and mediocrity they find themselves surrounded by.
 
I think you need to change your post title to........Most students can't be bothered to read books. Its not that they are incapable of the art of reading, it is a lack of motivation, I suggest. Be carefull
 
jimintoronto said:
I think you need to change your post title to........Most students can't be bothered to read books. Its not that they are incapable of the art of reading, it is a lack of motivation, I suggest. Be carefull
Click to expand...

If you read the Atlantic article (title: The Elite College Students Who Can't Read Books), they can't maintain focus long enough to read a book when reaching college because they've never done it, never have been required to. They can develop the ability to focus, sure, but probably not within the time frame of one course.
 
Last edited:
And one of these days they may be a member here ... wait ... they can't read ... much
Well, I'll leave this here in case they come for the pictures ...

X78ZWpQ.jpeg
 
AnnieA said:
Exactly. That's why I read across ideological spectrums. Our Congress can pass or not pass legislation and liberal legacy vs conservative sources will have entirely different headlines though they're discussing the exact same subject. And the headlines are written in language to sway readers to the publication's bias. (Sadly some people stop at the headlines and believe the BS spin.) Cherry picking is rampant and politicians or other people identified with Team Whatever are partially quoted out of context in order to support a news source's bias. Then there's news that simply isn't reported on by one side or the other because it's too damning to their agenda.

It takes a little extra effort thinking (and voting) independently but is ultimately so rewarding.
Click to expand...

Bias is one thing but there are subjects that are not covered at all due to corporate influence or whatever.
 
Fyrefox said:
During my brief and unhappy tenure in front of the classroom, I had 8th grade students who could not read at a 3rd grade level, yet I was expected to teach them Shakespeare’s Julius Caesar. Even prior to the advent of cell phones and social media, there were vast numbers of students who expected school to be an entirely passive process, and wanted to be entertained, not educated.

“Why do I have to do this?” was a common complaint. I think the turning point for me was when they started to light fires in their desks…
Click to expand...
And what are you doing to correct this flaw in your teaching methods?

I had the above question put to me when trying to teach fractions to students who could not multiply and divide. Something they were supposed to have started to learn two years earlier. And understood by the end of last year. .
 
Irishdude said:
We've provided links to it, why don't you read it and find out?
Click to expand...

Irishdude said:
We've provided links to it, why don't you read it and find out?
Click to expand...
My concern was not whether students are sufficiently prepared for college. My concern was Fox's headline "

Elite colleges shocked to discover students 'don't know how' to read books: 'My jaw dropped'​

was based on "several university professors." "Several college professors" is pure opinion, not a verifiable statistical analysis. And explain why this phenomenon only exists in "Elite colleges". Could it mean Fox's spin on those liberal college types? And like the National Inquirer's headlines, colleges are "shocked". If your SAT scores are sufficient to get into an "Elite" college, you know how to read a book.
 
Last edited:
fuzzybuddy said:
My concern was not whether students are prepared for college. My concern was Fox's headline "

Elite colleges shocked to discover students 'don't know how' to read books: 'My jaw dropped'​

was based on "several university professors." "Several college professors" is pure opinion, not a verifiable statistical analysis. And explain why this phenomenon only exists in "Elite colleges". Could it mean Fox's spin on those liberal college types? And, if your SAT scores are sufficient to get into an "Elite" college, you know how to read a book.
Click to expand...

fuzzybuddy said:
My concern was not whether students are prepared for college. My concern was Fox's headline "

Elite colleges shocked to discover students 'don't know how' to read books: 'My jaw dropped'​

was based on "several university professors." "Several college professors" is pure opinion, not a verifiable statistical analysis. And explain why this phenomenon only exists in "Elite colleges". Could it mean Fox's spin on those liberal college types? And, if your SAT scores are sufficient to get into an "Elite" college, you know how to read a book.
Click to expand...

Oh, God.
 
fuzzybuddy said:
My concern was not whether students are sufficiently prepared for college. My concern was Fox's headline "

Elite colleges shocked to discover students 'don't know how' to read books: 'My jaw dropped'​

was based on "several university professors." "Several college professors" is pure opinion, not a verifiable statistical analysis. And explain why this phenomenon only exists in "Elite colleges". Could it mean Fox's spin on those liberal college types? And like the National Inquirer's headlines, colleges are "shocked". If your SAT scores are sufficient to get into an "Elite" college, you know how to read a book.
Click to expand...

The Fox headline "My jaw dropped" is a direct quote from one of the elite college professors in the Atlantic article. There were 33 professors interviewed by the Atlantic journalist. The Atlantic article title is The Elite College Students Who Can't Read Books.

The problem with the students' inability to read a book is they cannot focus long enough to read a book because they've never before had to. That level of focus is a skill they certainly can--will have to--acquire.

Verifiable statistical analysis should follow this exposé. This is anecdotal evidence from reputable, first degree sources. Using the Scientific Method, scientists will take this anecdotal evidence and design and conduct studies to obtain empirical data.
 
Last edited:
Schools are also expected to be free daycare these days, increasing the resistance to ejecting and expelling problem children. Teachers are putting up with a lot, discouraging some of the best from going into or staying in this field. I won't even mention their being required to make silk purses from sows' ears another time.
 
David777 said:
Tersely..the US could still support chip factories as they originally dominated the rest of the world doing for several decades. The problem is, Wall Street and financial bean counters types became very envious of how tech industries supplanted all the old industry powers.

So increasingly moved into Silicon Valley themselves taking over corps and putting their Ivy League elites into HR departments.

These late comers that didn't create that tech, off shored, outsourced, and technology transferred our tech to highest bidders in the rest of the world, screwing all those who created it and the prosperous American public.

Originally, the foreign offshore corps Wall Street sold our tech to, used lower wages to unfairly compete but as soon as their US competition crumbled, jacked up costs. In the process, we lost control of much manufacturing engineering and with it ability to work with technology.

Much of our manufacturing closed while Wall Street fat cat types became rich. With money chasing those wealthy, inflation followed them creating the wage gap to the level, tech domestic corps could no longer hire workers at pay levels to compete.

Our universities taught myriad wealthy foreigners how to do what we used to do further screwing the American public. Wall Street outsourced to Asia much of our high paying computer software jobs that experts had for decades encouraged young people to get into. A huge lie. American young folks no longer had incentive to go into technology careers.
Click to expand...
Very well said.
 
Knight said:
Maybe if those with bias read more books they would see the reference in the context.
Click to expand...

I dunno. On both sides it's a combo of highly effective brainwashing that plays on atavistic tribalism so that might be too simple a solution.
 

Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top