GB: No Freedom of Speech Anymore
- Thread starter George1959
- Start date
Yes it's a foreign run school, I intended no disrespect to the Thai people.to be fair to Thai people - the ex pat living in Thailand school
I greatly admire the Thai people, who were never colonised.
Strange how clarity becomes "boring" the moment it challenges you.
Paco Dennis
SF VIP
- Location
- Mid-Missouri
Here is the results of a search on Google about this topic...with sources.
Police-recorded arrests for “speech offenses” in the UK have risen sharply over the past decade, particularly for online communications. Recent analyses suggest that arrests are now running at more than 30 per day, or around 12,000–13,000 per year in England and Wales, several times higher than in the mid‑2010s.[1][2][7]
## Scale and trend
Freedom of information data reported in UK media indicate that arrests for speech‑related offenses (such as “grossly offensive” or “menacing” communications and some hate‑speech offenses) rose from roughly 5,500 in 2017 to nearly 12,500 by 2022, with 2024 figures reported at over 13,000. Commentaries summarizing police records say this represents roughly a fourfold increase compared with about 2016 levels and now averages over 30 arrests per day.[2][7][1]
## Legal basis and online focus
Most of these arrests fall under laws that predate social media but are now applied heavily to online content, including provisions against “grossly offensive” or “indecent, obscene or menacing” messages on public networks and various hate‑speech and public order offenses. Human‑rights monitors have linked the rise in arrests to broader moves such as the UK’s Online Safety Act and expanded police practice of recording “non‑crime hate incidents,” which can be logged even when no criminal charge is brought.[5][6][7][1][2]
## Controversies and criticism
Civil‑liberties groups, some foreign governments, and media commentators argue that the current approach produces a chilling effect on free expression, pointing to cases involving social‑media posts, private chat groups, or even silent prayer near abortion clinics. Recent international assessments of UK internet freedom explicitly note a deterioration tied to the increase in criminal charges for online speech and the expanding scope of what is treated as a speech‑related offense.[6][7][5]
[1](https://www.forbes.com/sites/steveforbes/2025/09/09/people-are-being-thrown-in-uk-prisons-over-what-theyve-said-online-can-free-speech-be-saved/)
[2](https://eternallyradicalidea.com/p/yes-the-uk-really-is-that-bad-for)
[3](https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c62ln7mzd5ro)
[4](https://www.reddit.com/r/charts/comments/1mut3gv/12k_arrests_last_year_in_the_uk_for/)
[5](https://nypost.com/2025/08/19/world-news/uk-free-speech-struggle-30-arrests-a-day-censorship/)
[6](https://freedomhouse.org/country/united-kingdom/freedom-net/2025)
[7](https://www.city-journal.org/article/free-speech-uk-keir-starmer-unite-kingdom-rally)
[8](https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/10/world/europe/graham-linehan-free-speech-uk.html)
[9](https://www.reddit.com/r/reformuk/comments/1p1gtrq/the_uk_arrests_citizens_158x_more_than_china_for/)
Police-recorded arrests for “speech offenses” in the UK have risen sharply over the past decade, particularly for online communications. Recent analyses suggest that arrests are now running at more than 30 per day, or around 12,000–13,000 per year in England and Wales, several times higher than in the mid‑2010s.[1][2][7]
## Scale and trend
Freedom of information data reported in UK media indicate that arrests for speech‑related offenses (such as “grossly offensive” or “menacing” communications and some hate‑speech offenses) rose from roughly 5,500 in 2017 to nearly 12,500 by 2022, with 2024 figures reported at over 13,000. Commentaries summarizing police records say this represents roughly a fourfold increase compared with about 2016 levels and now averages over 30 arrests per day.[2][7][1]
## Legal basis and online focus
Most of these arrests fall under laws that predate social media but are now applied heavily to online content, including provisions against “grossly offensive” or “indecent, obscene or menacing” messages on public networks and various hate‑speech and public order offenses. Human‑rights monitors have linked the rise in arrests to broader moves such as the UK’s Online Safety Act and expanded police practice of recording “non‑crime hate incidents,” which can be logged even when no criminal charge is brought.[5][6][7][1][2]
## Controversies and criticism
Civil‑liberties groups, some foreign governments, and media commentators argue that the current approach produces a chilling effect on free expression, pointing to cases involving social‑media posts, private chat groups, or even silent prayer near abortion clinics. Recent international assessments of UK internet freedom explicitly note a deterioration tied to the increase in criminal charges for online speech and the expanding scope of what is treated as a speech‑related offense.[6][7][5]
[1](https://www.forbes.com/sites/steveforbes/2025/09/09/people-are-being-thrown-in-uk-prisons-over-what-theyve-said-online-can-free-speech-be-saved/)
[2](https://eternallyradicalidea.com/p/yes-the-uk-really-is-that-bad-for)
[3](https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c62ln7mzd5ro)
[4](https://www.reddit.com/r/charts/comments/1mut3gv/12k_arrests_last_year_in_the_uk_for/)
[5](https://nypost.com/2025/08/19/world-news/uk-free-speech-struggle-30-arrests-a-day-censorship/)
[6](https://freedomhouse.org/country/united-kingdom/freedom-net/2025)
[7](https://www.city-journal.org/article/free-speech-uk-keir-starmer-unite-kingdom-rally)
[8](https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/10/world/europe/graham-linehan-free-speech-uk.html)
[9](https://www.reddit.com/r/reformuk/comments/1p1gtrq/the_uk_arrests_citizens_158x_more_than_china_for/)
Thanks for pulling the numbers together, they actually reinforce what I was saying. When you’re looking at 12,000 to 13,000 arrests a year for speech related offenses, it’s difficult to dismiss that as "tabloid exaggeration." The scale is real, the trend is real, and the civil liberties concerns are real. That’s why context matters and why some of us aren’t willing to shrug it off. So thank you again for staying on topic and posting the information above.
Magna-Carta
Senior Member
- Location
- UK
Nothing’s being challenged -- I just didn’t find the direction particularly engaging. It felt less about the topic and more about shutting things down, which isn’t especially productive. May the echo chamber continue.
RambleTamble
Member
- Location
- U.S.
That's nuts. I guess they're trying to prevent minorities from being attacked and other hate crimes.
rbtvgo
Member
- Location
- Absecon, new jersey
Context does matter therefore 12,000 to 13,000 related to speech offenses is ambiguois. What did the 13,000 say, each one. How did it violate the law? Without all the facts, , FOR EACH INDIVIDUAL CASE, you have no basis of assuming that civil liberties have been abused.
Do the usual now and defer to some deficit in my thinking. 13,000 related cases does not equate to violations, convictions or penalties. Simple means there were 13k offenses registered.
You have to ways to go with this. Ignore me or produce the facts for all 13,000 cases that will justify what you are saying.
You’re asking for something no one has ever claimed, that all 12,000 to 13,000 arrests were wrongful. That’s a straw man. The point is that when a free society starts arresting thousands of people a year for speech, the burden then shifts and the state must justify why such broad powers are necessary. Therefore it's not the public’s job to prove every individual case was abusive.
Civil liberties concerns aren’t based on tallying 13,000 case files one by one, they’re based on the scale, the trend, and the legal principles at stake. When arrest powers expand into vague or subjective categories of "offensive" or "harmful" speech, abuses don’t need to be individually catalogued, the risk is built into the system itself. So no, I don’t need to produce 13,000 case reports to make a basic civil-liberties argument. And pretending that I do is just a way of dodging the substance.
VaughanJB
Scrappy VIP
I'll tell you something. I know that I am far too verbose. My posts are too long, and sometimes I cover too much, which means the replies can get long and twisted. But darn it, I can't stop myself. It's just who I am. I'd love the ability to be pithy. Alas.........
VaughanJB
Scrappy VIP
Yes, I get it, and even support it. My comment was rhetorical. The truth is, we (as citizens) have not been able to do whatever we want, when we want, at any time in the distant past. There have always been rules as soon as started living in groups. However, in 2025, there is a segment of people who mostly enjoy hating on things. These people don't seem to recognize that laws are made, undone, or updated over and over. We need those laws to ensure EVERYONE is free.
It's life as we've always known it. It's no different now.
So let me give you a name, Kevin Doyle. Mr. Doyle was in a counter group against an anti-immigrant protest. He was recognized in the crowd, and - because this seems to always be the accusation trotted out - he was labelled a "sex offender". A woman from the anti-immigrant side made a Tik-Tok video saying he should be lynched.
They found out where he lived, and they protested outside his home. They threatened to smash his windows, set his house on fire, and slit his throat. They stood outside chanting "Paedo!" The anti-immigrant group posted his picture on their Social Media pages. They also published his picture next to an actual offender, claiming they were one and the same person.
The group made the following post claiming some were: "standing shoulder to shoulder with a convicted predator… this isn't scaremongering… this is FACT!"
BUT NONE OF THIS WAS TRUE.
The group removed the post, laying the blame on "another group". No apology. No sorry.
SO - If you want to know why we have the laws we do, it's because of situations like this. People need protecting. There are far too many people who are willing to do and say the most heinous things in public - which effectively Social Media is. They escalate, encourage, and ramp up the angst. They want to do this without repercussion, without consequence, because you know - it's the internet. They're unhinged.
VaughanJB
Scrappy VIP
Indeed. Like Imam, Dr Zaheer Qadri, living in Scotland, who is afraid to wear religious clothing outside his Mosque because he's afraid of being attacked. This is the environment that is being created by the anti-immigrant movement today.
VaughanJB
Scrappy VIP
I'm not going to comment on your entire post (I can hear the collective sigh of relief!) However, let's take this first sentence. OF COURSE it has greatly increased. The internet is allowing people to essentially broadcast and publish their ideas in a way we've never had before in humanity. There is an organized group that have been radicalized against their country, and they're pounding the drum of "patriotism" as an excuse. it's like they can't help themselves be their very base self.
So yeah..... we NEEDED these laws because other citizens - citizens whose views get written off as lefty nonsense - need protection. Simple.
Ironically, the kind of government they seem to want would be far more restrictive.
RambleTamble
Member
- Location
- U.S.
Well, if he loves his religion so much, why did he move to Scotland? Why doesn't he live in one of the many predominantly Muslim nations -- all of which have been torn apart by his religion. Oh, I guess I just answered my own question.
Maybe the people of Scotland don't want to become a Muslim nation, so they're speaking out against Muslim immigration, as are the people of many European nations.
The way I see it, if you immigrate to another country, you should assimilate into their culture. You shouldn't expect their culture to adapt to your way of life.
hollydolly
SF VIP
- Location
- London England
George1959
Senior Member
That free speech in Great Britain is endangered is not new:
hollydolly
SF VIP
- Location
- London England
his audience are laughing, but it;s no laughing matter ! It's all true.....
hollydolly
SF VIP
- Location
- London England
No because it had already happened.. this was just 2 years ago .....and now it's much, MUCH worse.. no-one outside of the UK>.. certainly no-one outside of Europe can possibly imagine how much our freedom of speech has been stolen from us... it's like living in an Iron curtain country...
George1959
Senior Member
I wanted to edit my comment, but just had deleted it by mistake. But it's in your answer too.
George1959
Senior Member
You are so right. The people just can't imagine what happens in GB and Europe. After the Brexit I thought that GB would be in a better position regarding free speech, but NIL. The opposite has happened.
hollydolly
SF VIP
- Location
- London England
Precisely.. and people who deny it's happening..remind me very much of denials about events during Germany's occupation in WW2.... I'll say no more than that..don't want to cause uneccesary offence or upset..
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VaughanJB
Scrappy VIP
There simply is no way to respond to this. Good grief.
You've got to be joking. If anything, it's those against immigrants that are whistling the old Germanic tunes. All you've got to do is know your history.
But aren't you all protesting about lack of freedom of speech?
and freedom of religion and dress too, I presume
or does that only apply to people of same religion and dress as you??
and how is he expecting the culture to adapt to him? - he is dressing that way, he isn't telling anyone else to do so
VaughanJB
Scrappy VIP
Seems to me that the "culture" he's supposed to assimilate to is one of thuggery, intolerance, and hatred. Perhaps that wasn't for him.
VaughanJB
Scrappy VIP
As a follow up to the "culture" in Scotland. In Scotland, drug misuse and death and the highest in Europe, and even the US. They have some of the highest alcohol-related death and hospital admission rates in the UK, with thousands dying from alcohol-specific causes annually.
I also wonder how many speak the native language (Scots), rather than their adopted English? Got to keep that cultural heritage going.
It's a wonder anyone can walk down the street.