Brexit??

Don M.

Don M.

SF VIP
Location
central Missouri
I've been reading some articles about an upcoming referendum on June 23rd, where the people of the U.K. will be voting on whether or not to stay in the EU. Do any of our U.K posters have any information or opinions on this subject?
 

I think there's a thread about this somewhere on this board. The debate has been going on for quite some time.
 
AH, Yes...I searched on this topic and found 2 or 3 threads from earlier in the year....I guess I didn't pay attention before. However, now that this vote is only a couple of weeks away, I am curious to hear what some of this forums members, who live in the U.K. are thinking, and what their local polls might be saying.
 

I voted no, way back when we were asked "should we join" and l shall be voting to leave, in a few days time. We don't need it and there are only a greedy minority that really benefit from it.
 
Goldfynche said:
I voted no, way back when we were asked "should we join" and l shall be voting to leave, in a few days time. We don't need it and there are only a greedy minority that really benefit from it.
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Thanks for your response. I am curious about this issue, because of the potential for this vote to upset the global financial markets. I'm sure the people of the U.K. have valid reasons, both Pro and Con, about this issue, and although it would have little bearing on the US populace, Anything that upsets the Status Quo seems to have "ripple effects". I will be watching BBC news, etc., on TV closely in coming days.
 
Don M. said:
Thanks for your response. I am curious about this issue, because of the potential for this vote to upset the global financial markets. I'm sure the people of the U.K. have valid reasons, both Pro and Con, about this issue, and although it would have little bearing on the US populace, Anything that upsets the Status Quo seems to have "ripple effects". I will be watching BBC news, etc., on TV closely in coming days.
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It could have quite some bearing on the US populace if the US carries out what some UK member of this BB posted about what might have been considered a "threat" from Obama if Britain pulls out. That's the thread I was thinking of.

If I believed in conspiracy theories I could wonder about this referendum taking place at the same time as the run-up to a US presidential election, but I don't. Could be a sea change, though. A paradigm shift.
 
Guitarist said:
It could have quite some bearing on the US populace if the US carries out what some UK member of this BB posted about what might have been considered a "threat" from Obama if Britain pulls out. That's the thread I was thinking of.

If I believed in conspiracy theories I could wonder about this referendum taking place at the same time as the run-up to a US presidential election, but I don't. Could be a sea change, though. A paradigm shift.
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Yeah, between the marvelous "Choices" we have in this upcoming Presidential election, and if the EU were to go into any major disarray, I can visualize all sorts of problems cropping up....especially to global financial markets. It's not that long ago that the mess in Greece turned the markets upside down for several weeks....and Greece is just a minor footnote compared to the U.K.
 
I voted to remain in.

The EU provides much in the way of human rights and employment protection that the UK would love to ignore. Furthermore, to increase barriers with Europe makes no sense in a world that is becoming smaller by the day. There is no hiding the fact, that the whole exit issue was kicked off by those on the right of the political spectrum for purely selfish reasons. Mostly because they find that poorer countries are now joining the EU and don't see why we should be part of a union that may expect us to support them.

Yes, there are some things that could be handled better by Europe, but over all, it makes more sense to be a part of that Union than to break from it. As for immigration. Scotland is a mix of many peoples. Possibly the largest group coming from England who have invested well, mostly in the Highlands. We have a valuable Polish community established here now. And, of course, the invaluable Indian/Pakistani immigration of the 50s that has now become such a colourful part of our culture. My own ancestry, indeed, reaches back to Ireland. So, 'immigration is' not all bad!

What some outside the UK may not know, is that should the UK vote to leave the EU, then this could spark a further Scottish Independence referendum as the preference here is more pro-Europe than elsewhere in the UK. Now that may be interesting.
 
I'll be voting to LEAVE. We've had to fight to preserve our freedom in many wars, and now some people just want to roll over and allow ourselves to be a part of a united Europe. Being on good terms with our old enemies and having trading agreements is one thing, but being slaves is another.
 
Why are Americans upset about the UK contemplating withdrawal from the EU?
I keep hearing lots of complaints on this forum about trade agreements in general and how the US should get out of them.

As a member of the British Commonwealth of Nations, I felt alienation when Britain joined the Common Market, to which we were excluded, but over the years I got used to it. If they leave now, things will not go back to what they were before, because we Australians have moved on.

In my mind as a colonial with British roots I have never really considered the British Isles to be part of Europe, but then again, I have never lived the life of a Briton. In the end, the decision is up to the British, and to them alone.
 
ossian said:
I voted to remain in.

The EU provides much in the way of human rights and employment protection that the UK would love to ignore. Furthermore, to increase barriers with Europe makes no sense in a world that is becoming smaller by the day. There is no hiding the fact, that the whole exit issue was kicked off by those on the right of the political spectrum for purely selfish reasons. Mostly because they find that poorer countries are now joining the EU and don't see why we should be part of a union that may expect us to support them.

Yes, there are some things that could be handled better by Europe, but over all, it makes more sense to be a part of that Union than to break from it. As for immigration. Scotland is a mix of many peoples. Possibly the largest group coming from England who have invested well, mostly in the Highlands. My own ancestry, indeed, reaches back to Ireland. So, 'immigration is' not all bad!

What some outside the UK may not know, is that should the UK vote to leave the EU, then this could spark a further Scottish Independence referendum as the preference here is more pro-Europe than elsewhere in the UK. Now that may be interesting.
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I am with you Ossian..........I had never thought of it before but I suppose I could call my father an immigrant to England as he originated from Edinburgh.:)

Apart from human rights and employment protection I worry that if we come out, those on the leave campaign will mess with the NHS and we may possibly lose it...............there are so many things to consider for staying in and coming out but overall I believe we will be better off staying in the E.U.
 
Capt Lightning said:
I'll be voting to LEAVE. We've had to fight to preserve our freedom in many wars, and now some people just want to roll over and allow ourselves to be a part of a united Europe. Being on good terms with our old enemies and having trading agreements is one thing, but being slaves is another.
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Good grief!

I think that is a nonsense, Capt. We are certainly not slaves to Europe any more than we are slaves to the US or any other allies. The wars are in the past and the EU, if anything, has ensured peace in Europe between nations.
 
Ossian, if you want our laws, our imigration policies, our weights and measures, our fishing industry etc.... all dictated to by Brussels, then fine, vote to stay in. If you want Britain to maintain what it's got left of its sovereignty and decide how we should be governed , then let's get OUT while we can. As for various laws that the scaremongers feel would be repealed, people have the right to vote for the party who will put in place the best laws for Britain.

Regarding and independent Scotland (which I voted against) applying to join the EU, I think I'd keep the options to return to England open.

BTW, where's Ameriscot these days? She's a pro EU and independent Scotland voter.
 
Capt Lightning said:
Ossian, if you want our laws, our imigration policies, our weights and measures, our fishing industry etc.... all dictated to by Brussels, then fine, vote to stay in. If you want Britain to maintain what it's got left of its sovereignty and decide how we should be governed , then let's get OUT while we can. As for various laws that the scaremongers feel would be repealed, people have the right to vote for the party who will put in place the best laws for Britain.

Regarding and independent Scotland (which I voted against) applying to join the EU, I think I'd keep the options to return to England open.

BTW, where's Ameriscot these days? She's a pro EU and independent Scotland voter.
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I welcome the EU influencing many of our laws. Without their controls, the Westminster Government cannot be trusted to protect employment legislation, employee rights and social welfare. One of the main drivers to exit the EU is to enable the UK to compete better with Asia. Not Europe! And how do you think they will do that?

As for Scottish Independence. Ameriscot has always impressed me as a very perceptive and wise individual. What you have told me simply confirms this. And should we ever achieve that independence, there would be absolutely no barrier to you exercising your right to return to England. However, then as a non-EU member, you may not find it so easy to return here again, remember. ;)

And here endeth my subscription to this topic. :D
 
Ossian, we elect our government. If we don't trust them, we can vote for another party. The 'Stay' supporters seem very keen to suggest that the UK government would repeal many of the employment laws, but I doubt if that would sit well with the electorate. We shall see what happens. Depending on the result, I will do what I think is best. I've lived and worked in several countries but I'm getting a bit crumbly to keep moving around. Maybe there should be a country comparison site- we could call it "uFlit".

A final thought.. if an independent Scotland joined the EU, would we have wine and beer at continental prices? That might swing it.
 
My other 2 groups are predominantly European, so I've witnessed these discussions(pro & con) time and again. I know everyone remembers the panic when the year 2000 dawned, everyone believed computers were going to shut down.... bla ...bla .... The Uk has never relinquished it's monetary system, so they were never 100% in the EU. There will be no monetary conversion, they have one of the strongest and fastest growing economies , as well militaries, in Europe. Their proximity to their West European neighbors make them vital to trade, business , as well, the security of Western Europe. I have always felt The UK gave more to the EU than they received in return. As far as the USA is concerned, my belief, Obama was merely bowing to EU pressure to attempt to sway the UK into staying. The UK is the USA's closet and strongest ally, to think the UK's leaving or staying in the EU will effect in anyway US and the UK's relationship is completely preposterous, no matter what an American President says; the US Congress would never allow it.
 
Warrigal said:
Why are Americans upset about the UK contemplating withdrawal from the EU?

I don't think many Americans are "Upset" about the UK and its relationship with the EU...certainly nowhere near as "upset" as some in other countries seem to be about US Gun laws. Speaking personally, I watch International news and events because of the potential impact global events can have on my investments and retirement funding. With the globalization of most of our corporations and industries, what happens halfway around the world can have an impact on my bottom line...and I don't want to take a hit on my IRA, etc., because of events I have no control over. Therefore, it is only Prudent to seek out ideas and opinions from those who might be directly involved, so I can be prepared for any eventuality. In that regard, I thank the UK posters who have responded to my concerns, and I'm sure that the people of the UK will make the correct decisions.
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I have moved 180 degrees. I was one a full federalist, hoping to see Team Euro marching at the Olympics, but now I'n for out.

It's simply become too big, trying to be all things to all nations but being nothing to most.

I have no illusions. If we leave we will have a ten or fifteen year economic freeze, bur we will ultimately end up stronger, though not in my lifetime.
 
Laurie said:
.........

It's simply become too big, trying to be all things to all nations but being nothing to most.
......
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And that sums it up best. They say one size does not fit all. I think that applies to the EU.

Doesn't stop individual treaties, agreements or unofficially honoring certain practices. The sky will not fall.
 
ossian said:
Good grief!

I think that is a nonsense, Capt. We are certainly not slaves to Europe any more than we are slaves to the US or any other allies. The wars are in the past and the EU, if anything, has ensured peace in Europe between nations.
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My thoughts, as stated in an earlier comment, is the UK offers more to the EU than it receives in return. I do believe no matter the path it chooses; the UK will be ok.
 
Don M. said:
Warrigal said:
Why are Americans upset about the UK contemplating withdrawal from the EU?

I don't think many Americans are "Upset" about the UK and its relationship with the EU...certainly nowhere near as "upset" as some in other countries seem to be about US Gun laws. Speaking personally, I watch International news and events because of the potential impact global events can have on my investments and retirement funding. With the globalization of most of our corporations and industries, what happens halfway around the world can have an impact on my bottom line...and I don't want to take a hit on my IRA, etc., because of events I have no control over. Therefore, it is only Prudent to seek out ideas and opinions from those who might be directly involved, so I can be prepared for any eventuality. In that regard, I thank the UK posters who have responded to my concerns, and I'm sure that the people of the UK will make the correct decisions.
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I do not think most US Citizens are concerned, because of Obama's yielding to EU pressure and supporting UK's staying in the EU, with whether the UK stays or goes, but I believe most recognized the UK will be alright, no matter their decision.
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Someone had asked about financial market impacts resulting from the vote and I found this from earlier this afternoon.

Here's a brief intro for anyone interested:

"So will there be market mayhem?


In the immediate term, an intense burst of volatility in financial markets on Thursday night and Friday morning is more or less assured, regardless of the outcome of the referendum vote. The outcome of the plebiscite is the dominant issue in the minds of traders and asset managers in the City of London and, increasingly, in other financial centres around the world. Various indexes of expected market volatility have been rising in recent weeks.


Who will be trading?


Some financial players, such as hedge funds, will be speculating on the outcome (or more precisely market movements in response to the outcome) with their own money. Other players, traders working for banks, will be anticipating a rush of orders from corporate customers for various assets in response to the outcome and they will be looking to position themselves to make a profit by making a market for these clients. There is expected to a be a frenzy of action in the spread-betting markets too on the value of currencies, as there usually is for high-profile political events with economic implications (such as general elections)."
 

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