Childless Couples....Selfish?

Going back a number of years when we had a business. One of our customers told us she would have loved to have had a child, but it never happened. Her husband was a leading Obstetrician at a large hospital. When we went to their house, she greeted us and gave us a tour of her house. She and her husband never shared a bed and had separate rooms. The relationship seemed very strange.
I asked her how they spent Christmas and she said they would reserve a table at a large golf club, on their own. I felt so sorry for her, here they were living in grandeur, and trying to impress us, but in my opinion, they had nothing. We were struggling in our business and had two beautiful sons, more than they could ever have.
 

Childless couples are not selfish. Some are childless by choice. That's not a crime, nor is it selfish. Some are childless because of circumstances beyond their control. People make assumptions as to why a couple is childless; whatever the reason, it's nobody's business.
 
I was adopted at age 3 and my name was changed from my birth name. I think that was the beginning of my identity crisis that has lasted my whole life.

The point is....my adopted parents couldn't have children of their own so they adopted me. They shouldn't have. They were never affectionate and always critical. They were unhappy with themselves and they hated each other. It was a confusing time for me growing up. No...some people shouldn't have children. You see too much child abuse or neglect these days and many people shouldn't breed. I had one child and that was enough for me. Not every woman has that maternal gene. I never had it and neither did my mother.
 
That brings back an old memory. About 3 years into my first marriage, my in-laws asked when we would have children and said we were selfish. I turned to them and told them if they were willing to pay for their upbringing, we would have one right away. That shut them up.
ETA: We did have 2 sons later at a time of our choosing.
 
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Colleen said:
I was adopted at age 3 and my name was changed from my birth name. I think that was the beginning of my identity crisis that has lasted my whole life.

The point is....my adopted parents couldn't have children of their own so they adopted me. They shouldn't have. They were never affectionate and always critical. They were unhappy with themselves and they hated each other. It was a confusing time for me growing up. No...some people shouldn't have children. You see too much child abuse or neglect these days and many people shouldn't breed. I had one child and that was enough for me. Not every woman has that maternal gene. I never had it and neither did my mother.
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Right. And of course it isn’t that you would have been better off with your birth parents. Maybe but it could as easily have been worse.

I keep thinking what’s wrong with selfish anyway? Do we look down on people who strive to achieve what they desire or who choose items based on their own taste? Apart from a conviction that reproducing is something good for everyone to do for the general good why would anyone think it selfish. I don’t mind saying I am selfish in those ways but I’m also someone as cutely aware of how others are doing. That isn’t a contradiction.
 
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hollydolly said:
agreed...in fact it could be said that it's more selfish to HAVE children in many ways...
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The reactions in this thread were a tonic. It came back to me whilst reading the US Birth Rates Plummet To 40-Year Low thread. There is such a strong correlation between the two.
The United Nations puts the world's population at more than three times larger than it was in the mid-twentieth century. The global human population reached 8.0 billion in mid-November 2022 from an estimated 2.5 billion people in 1950, adding 1 billion people since 2010 and 2 billion since 1998.

Estimates range from 70 to 80 million combined war deaths for WW1 & 2.
The world's deadliest infectious diseases and there estimated annual losses are:
COVID-19: 1.24 million. Tuberculosis: 1.13 million. HIV/AIDS: 630,000. Malaria: 620,000.

It would seem that war, pestilence or birth control has scant impact on population numbers.
Rather than worry about it and being in my twilight years, I think I would rather go to the pub!
 
horseless carriage said:
The reactions in this thread were a tonic. It came back to me whilst reading the US Birth Rates Plummet To 40-Year Low thread. There is such a strong correlation between the two.
The United Nations puts the world's population at more than three times larger than it was in the mid-twentieth century. The global human population reached 8.0 billion in mid-November 2022 from an estimated 2.5 billion people in 1950, adding 1 billion people since 2010 and 2 billion since 1998.

Estimates range from 70 to 80 million combined war deaths for WW1 & 2.
The world's deadliest infectious diseases and there estimated annual losses are:
COVID-19: 1.24 million. Tuberculosis: 1.13 million. HIV/AIDS: 630,000. Malaria: 620,000.

It would seem that war, pestilence or birth control has scant impact on population numbers.
Rather than worry about it and being in my twilight years, I think I would rather go to the pub!
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Mine's a coke if you get there before me... :sneaky::D
 
Some just have physical conditions that run in both their families, but many adopt too.
World population seems to double every 40 years. USA population has more than tripled
since I was young. There seem to be plenty of Aliens willing to replace the unborn. A young
Couple from Turkey with a lil baby live about 1/2 mile of me. Very nice to talk with. Traffic
Jams used to be in the middle of the city, now they are nearly everywhere most of the time.
Last Thursday the closed the Interstate after placing Cement center Barriers for 7 miles in
a week. That evening they opened it back up as a one laner each way. The Detour in the morning
was a nightmare of Semi's and Pickups pulling campers.

It must be difficult to work from home and raise the lil ones till school age too. Many Young, at
least one is working from a home office. My wife is one. She says no way she could raise a young.

Speaking of Aliens, the other afternoon at a resale shop, coming out, I witnessed a New white
Cadilac with Mexico Plates on it and the Lady getting into it and driving out of the parking Lot in
a small town in the heartland USA near the Mississippi River.
 
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It must be challenging providing for a family, with ipads, cellphones, computers, tablets, etc.
There would have to be two incomes, for certain. Paying a mortgage, and raising children can't be easy today.

Our daughter did not have children, nor did the majority of my nieces & nephews. I think this is the new norm.
 
Pinky said:
It must be challenging providing for a family, with ipads, cellphones, computers, tablets, etc.
There would have to be two incomes, for certain. Paying a mortgage, and raising children can't be easy today.

Our daughter did not have children, nor did the majority of my nieces & nephews. I think this is the new norm.
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My kids are both married and in their early thirties, they and their spouses are all in agreement about not having kids.

Truthfully it makes me sad knowing I'll never have grandkids to spoil, but I get it and respect their choice.
 
I think my husband & were totally not ready to have a child.
Let alone that was born with 2 club feet.

After 2 years of dealing with that problem we had our second son.

We raised our sons near enough to their grandparents that they learned about hard work,,'the birds & bees'.

I tried to instill the love of reading, handiwork, cooking,, to enjoy the out doors , wild life.
We stress that the do well in school.

Both sons went to collage, the oldest learned some hard lessons , but went to work for the auto industry.
The oldest never married, some where during his life something happened.
Will be surprised if he ever marries.

The youngest played around during his first year of college.
When his girl friend's parents moved to eastern PA,,, he asked what should he do?
Husband told ,'You are 18, I can't tell what to do.'

That one did finally finish college & get job, married his girl friend.
They have 3 lovely daughters,.
We don't see them now that the girls as they are old enough be out in the world.

Daughter in law did remark that she thinks they won't have children.

Time well tell.
 
Rose65 said:
It's no business of anyone else's. Up to each couple of indeed person. Having children is not the sole reason for living. It is not always a blessing either.
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Well said Rose, you are a refreshing change from the negative vitriol that is more common than you might expect. Nicola Slawson of The Guardian newspaper, puts the differences so articulately, she hits the nail on the head.
 
I love children. But I don’t plan on having any of my own. It took me a long time to be able to say that out loud. And by “out loud” I mean whispering it with a hint of uncertainty so as not to offend. Because when you’re a married woman of a certain age with no kids, people have questions. Fertility advice. Pity. Judgement. Lots of judgement.

At gatherings I respond to the anticipated, “When are you having kids?” with a teasing, “Ohhh we’ll see hahahahaa,” and hurry over to the snacks. Because if I’m honest about not wanting kids, I’m never getting to the snacks. I’m getting cross-examined, so write Ursula Taherian in the Los Angeles Times.

The lady quotes some quite outrageous remarks: "Even though 44% of adults surveyed in 2021 said they are unlikely to have children, society pushes baby-making, still viewing motherhood as a woman’s primary role. Some people even feel moral outrage toward those who choose to be child free, according to a 2017 study. The Pope called us selfish and Elon Musk went as far as suggesting we lose our right to vote."

Click on the link, it's a well written piece with intelligent observations.
 
My ex and I never had kids. I don't think anyone ever called us selfish. At first I thought we were odd, but then I realized several of our married friends our age, didn't want children either. And I don't recall them being called selfish. You know what? Maybe this is just a new tool that can be used to express disapproval and divide "them" from "us." I could think of better tools for creating division, but people being what they are, this should not be that surprising anymore. It's what our country has become.
 
It also doesn't help matters that there are plenty of those on this planet who truly believe that the only reason women exist is to give birth and raise the children; to them, women don't exist for any other reason.

In spite of all the years gone by, some haven't progressed at all from whichever ancient Greek philosopher it was who said along the lines of, "It's unfortunate that there is no place for the unborn child to rest in other than the mother's womb; if there were, we wouldn't need women at all!" (The society he was living in at the time didn't know that to form a child you need both sperm and egg; they thought it was all sperm and therefore only the man was involved in the creation of life; the woman's womb was just a rental space for the baby.)
 
If people don’t want children they should not have them. They are expensive, and cause a lot of mental and emotional distress. OTOH, I can’t imagine being the old guy I am and not having my wonderful children and the wonderful grandchild. To each his or her own.
 

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