Chinese warships flexing muscles.

HoneyNut said:
which regulations/restrictions would you get rid of? I'm not familiar with them but I thought they basically protect the public from being poisoned by companies that are willing to destroy the environment to get rich? When I visited Chicago the tour guides on the river said that it has taken decades to get the water cleaned up and that it still isn't safe to swim in but they are continuing to work on it.
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Texas alone has the resources to provide enough fossil fuel to power our cars far into the future but are hampered by green regulations preventing any new refineries from opening while we plead with other countries who do produce major amounts of oil and power for help while they do not follow green regulations either. This is what does not make sense to me. The West is destroying itself with this agenda.
 

chic said:
Texas alone has the resources to provide enough fossil fuel to power our cars far into the future but are hampered by green regulations preventing any new refineries from opening
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Well I tried googling it and it sounds more like no one wants to invest money in building oil refineries because they think consumers might switch more and more to greener options. Probably the investors are correct but I don't think consumers are being forced to go green.
Also, I tried to find out how much we are having to import and it is kind of confusing between refined and crude, this is what I found. It sort of sounds like we already could take care of our needs if we didn't export a lot (I'm guessing the oil companies get higher prices from Europe than they can get locally).

The United States was a total petroleum net exporter in 2020 and 2021​

In 2021, the United States exported about 8.63 million barrels per day (b/d) and imported about 8.47 million b/d of petroleum,1 making the United States an annual total petroleum net exporter for the second year in a row since at least 1949. Total petroleum net exports were about 0.16 million b/d in 2021, and total petroleum net exports in 2020 were 0.63 million b/d. Also in 2021, the United States produced about 18.66 million b/d of petroleum and consumed about 19.78 million b/d. Even though U.S. annual total petroleum exports were greater than total petroleum imports in 2020 and 2021, the United States still imported some crude oil and petroleum products from other countries to help to supply domestic demand for petroleum and to supply international markets.​
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The United States remained a net crude oil importer in 2021, importing about 6.11 million b/d of crude oil and exporting about 2.90 million b/d. However, some of the crude oil that the U.S. imports is refined by U.S. refineries into petroleum products—such as gasoline, heating oil, diesel fuel, and jet fuel—that the U.S. exports. Also, some of imported petroleum may be stored and subsequently exported.​
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U.S. petroleum imports peaked in 2005​

After generally increasing every year from 1954 through 2005, U.S. gross and net total petroleum imports peaked in 2005. Since 2005, increases in domestic petroleum production and increases in petroleum exports have helped to reduce annual total petroleum net imports. In 2020 and 2021, annual total petroleum net imports were actually negative, the first years since since at least 1949.​
 
Hopefully it is just posturing. But they are pushing the envelope to the point that an oops could trigger something.


That being said when was the last time China fought a large scale war themselves. Russia had a similar issue and they'll be lucky to hold on to the little they took. Big militaries need big logistics and training programs. China will learn on the fly. How they adapt to set backs will be their key. Parades showcasing expensive weaponry are different than full scale island invasions. Has China even used landing craft on a large scale to deploy troops on a beach for training? My guess the pummel Taiwan first then come in later. Keep in mind the second they fire on Taiwan Taiwan will be firing on their fleet.

Considering island hopping/invasion bogged down the US in WWII at times the same will happen to China on Taiwan.
 
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chic said:
Texas alone has the resources to provide enough fossil fuel to power our cars far into the future but are hampered by green regulations preventing any new refineries from opening while we plead with other countries who do produce major amounts of oil and power for help while they do not follow green regulations either. This is what does not make sense to me. The West is destroying itself with this agenda.
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Do you have any evidence that what you wrote is true?

Oil companies aren't investing in new refineries because they're expensive and we're in the process of transitioning to electric vehicles, which will eventually decrease demand for oil. They don't want to put all that money into something that won't be needed in another decade or so.
 
SeniorBen said:
Do you have any evidence that what you wrote is true?

Oil companies aren't investing in new refineries because they're expensive and we're in the process of transitioning to electric vehicles, which will eventually decrease demand for oil. They don't want to put all that money into something that won't be needed in another decade or so.
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Maybe so, but that's not true for the rest of the world. The U.S. has the lowest carbon emissions of any other industrialized country and that takes into consideration the amount of fossil fuels we use. While we are closing coal fired plants, China has announced that they are building 20 new plants. Net gain is minus zero and probably much lower. We will never compete with China on industry, but we can pretend that we are doing the world a favor. It's almost as if people believe that if we have clean air in the U.S. it will stay here.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/06/chi...issions-exceed-us-developed-world-report.html
 
oldman said:
I don’t knew if we can stop buying Chinese goods. Most everything we use daily comes from there.
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I believe we can ..... but most folks won't put forth the effort to see what is & is not from Chinese manufacturing .

If it's pretty & shiny .... they'll buy it.
 
chic said:
We used to take care of ourselves until the environmentalists went nuts with regulations and restrictions. It makes no sense to become deliberately dependent on others when you don't need to be. :unsure:
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I agree here ..... while it is true reasonable regulations are needed . The "went nuts" part is what has IMO hurt us .

"It makes no sense to become deliberately dependent on others when you don't need to be. "

Trouble is ..... so many of our politicians/.... ahem leaders .... are heavily invested in forign manufacturing and oil producing.
 
rgp said:
Nuclear powered ...... I don't believe it carries any nuclear armament . Nor does the aircraft aboard.
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A number of the planes aboard the USS Ronald Reagan are capable of carrying and deploying nuclear missiles from their payload. It has been a long standing policy of the US Marines and US Navy not to disclose what weapons are in the payloads of their planes on carriers.
 
rgp said:
I believe we can ..... but most folks won't put forth the effort to see what is & is not from Chinese manufacturing .

If it's pretty & shiny .... they'll buy it.
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It’s tough to compete with cheap labor and companies that operate without government regulations and no EPA to answer to. They are able to produce goods without fear of being shutdown for violating air standards. With 1.2 billion people, workers come cheap. China has improved their pay to the workers. Today they can afford to buy things like refrigerators and stoves, whereas, just 25 years ago, they were still smoking most of their foods to preserve the quality. This is why our congress keeps complaining that we are not on an even playing field.
 
Been There said:
It’s tough to compete with cheap labor and companies that operate without government regulations and no EPA to answer to. They are able to produce goods without fear of being shutdown for violating air standards. With 1.2 billion people, workers come cheap. China has improved their pay to the workers. Today they can afford to buy things like refrigerators and stoves, whereas, just 25 years ago, they were still smoking most of their foods to preserve the quality. This is why our congress keeps complaining that we are not on an even playing field.
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I understand & to a large part agree but .......... I still stand by my opinion that the American people in general [if that's not too broad-brush] are just so caught up in "must-haves" that they will not deny themselves anything they [most anything] they want.

As i have noted on here in the past, there is a local jewerly store that advertises that they have used Rolex watches . Not at a price .... but at a monthly payment. If ones only concern is making the monthly payment .... then IMO they cannot afford ..... the watch, or whatever it may be.

Which IMO is why they do not bother to look at where something is made , or even what the quality might be , or not be, only what the payment is.

Look at diamonds , all the news about blood diamonds , children and their fathers having their hands chopped off .. in many cases on mere accusation of stealing small bits from the mines. people didn't care .... they wanted their personal adornment .

I wouldn never consider buying a diamond ...... or any "gem" for that matter.
 
rgp said:
I agree here ..... while it is true reasonable regulations are needed . The "went nuts" part is what has IMO hurt us .

"It makes no sense to become deliberately dependent on others when you don't need to be. "

Trouble is ..... so many of our politicians/.... ahem leaders .... are heavily invested in forign manufacturing and oil producing.
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Some see it as a way to keep other countries in check. We supply you with this, you supply us with that, makes countries codependent and less likely to war with one another. I believe that is their strategy.
 
rgp said:
I believe we can ..... but most folks won't put forth the effort to see what is & is not from Chinese manufacturing .

If it's pretty & shiny .... they'll buy it.
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Several years ago, the Made in China label was removed from a lot of items because Americans were indeed opting to buy domestic or from other exporters; willing to pay a bit more in most cases. But, as you probably know, On behalf of Chinese manufacturers, top business representatives of the CCP made it worthwhile for US incestors investors to gag and misdirect critics of China-made. And with help from the media and US legislators, the investors did that, and just kept investing and smoke-screening, and even intentionally allowing domestic prices to inflate.
 
chic said:
Some see it as a way to keep other countries in check. We supply you with this, you supply us with that, makes countries codependent and less likely to war with one another. I believe that is their strategy.
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Well,, I believe you are correct but ...... just like the "rules-of-war" it always seems we [ The U.S. ] are the only ones that adhere to the agreement .
 
Murrmurr said:
Several years ago, the Made in China label was removed from a lot of items because Americans were indeed opting to buy domestic or from other exporters; willing to pay a bit more in most cases. But, as you probably know, On behalf of Chinese manufacturers, top business representatives of the CCP made it worthwhile for US incestors investors to gag and misdirect critics of China-made. And with help from the media and US legislators, the investors did that, and just kept investing and smoke-screening, and even intentionally allowing domestic prices to inflate.
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I had the understanding that the FTC had a rule that all imported items must be marked with the country of origin and to some, or most degree that included fruits and vegetables. The market selling produce is supposed to have a sign stating where the item came from. In my grocery store, they carry three types of oranges. One sign reads “California” another reads “Florida” and another reads “Africa.”
 
With some of you being in California, I would think some of you have seen Naval ships. When I go to Hawaii to visit my son, I always make a point to go to Pearl Harbor to visit whatever ship or ships are in port. They are a marvel to look at and just looking at them makes me feel extra proud to be an American. And usually they aren’t the larger ships.
 
Moon Rat said:
I had the understanding that the FTC had a rule that all imported items must be marked with the country of origin and to some, or most degree that included fruits and vegetables. The market selling produce is supposed to have a sign stating where the item came from. In my grocery store, they carry three types of oranges. One sign reads “California” another reads “Florida” and another reads “Africa.”
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Yes, but there's a loophole. Country of origin can be coded instead of literally spelled out, and a huge number of specific types of items don't have to be labeled at all. And if I remember right, that FTC rule only applies to imported meat and produce. Has it expanded to other products?
 
Moon Rat said:
With some of you being in California, I would think some of you have seen Naval ships.
When I go to Hawaii to visit my son, I always make a point to go to Pearl Harbor to visit whatever ship or ships are in port. They are a marvel to look at and just looking at them makes me feel extra proud to be an American. And usually they aren’t the larger ships.
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I had to travel quite a distance to see them. I went to Port Hueneme and also the Island Naval Complex off San Diego.
 
oldman said:
I don’t knew if we can stop buying Chinese goods. Most everything we use daily comes from there.
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That's right. Over the years, many American corporations have moved their manufacturing to China....to take advantage of their lower labor costs. That has helped keep consumer prices down, but has literally made us dependent on China for many of the daily products we use. Only if the government increased the tariffs on Chinese goods...while at the same time offering major incentives to corporations who bring their manufacturing back to these shores, would this situation be reversed. However, that would result in increased prices for most products, and probably take years to achieve. So, its a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation.
 
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