Extreme old age

We don't have any kids either Keesha, luckily we share the same views on many things, he's two years older than me. We have old living wills, but they only address being kept alive on machines in the hospital, no mention of Alzheimers. We have to update our old wills, something we keep putting off for now.
 

SeaBreeze said:
We don't have any kids either Keesha, luckily we share the same views on many things, he's two years older than me. We have old living wills, but they only address being kept alive on machines in the hospital, no mention of Alzheimers. We have to update our old wills, something we keep putting off for now.
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This is an interesting thread. Uncomfortable but necessary to think about. What would you say in your will about Alzheimers? You don't have to answer if it's personal. I understand.
 
Lara, are you talking about saying something in a will, or in a living will? I assume you mean a living will; I don't think issues such as assisted suicide even come up in a regular will, which applies only after a person is gone.

For a living will, that's an interesting question. I think they only address keeping someone alive (or not) due to physical infirmities, not Alzheimer's. From what I've read about assisted suicide, the person himself has to take the pills; the "assistance" part only comes in when the doctor provides the pills, but the actual "deed" must be done by the person, after signing papers indicating that they understood exactly what they were doing. In the case of Alzheimer's, even in the early stages when they understood and knew what they were doing, it probably would never be legal. That's too much of a slippery slope.

So I suspect that even in those states that do permit medically assisted suicide, the Alzheimer's patients are out of luck.
 

Question for all: A person admits him/her self to a assisted living facility. What happens to a person with no family of any kind that is in a assisted living type facility and that persons money runs out? I'm sure state laws differ but I just wonder where could one go with no money and questionable competence.
 
Lara said:
What would you say in your will about Alzheimers? You don't have to answer if it's personal. I understand.
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I haven't thought about it seriously yet, and I don't think you can legally put in a will that if you develop Alzheimer's and are no longer able to care for yourself that you can be euthanized. But, you can probably put in writing that you don't want any Alzheimer's medications or ongoing care and feedings....then you will die sooner, but it won't be so peaceful as assisted suicide. Perhaps you can only request morphine to dull the pain of starvation? I have no idea.

I've read that some Alzheimer's patients have already attempted to commit suicide on their own, but weren't always successful in completing the task.
 
fmdog44 said:
Question for all: A person admits him/her self to a assisted living facility. What happens to a person with no family of any kind that is in a assisted living type facility and that persons money runs out? I'm sure state laws differ but I just wonder where could one go with no money and questionable competence.
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Good question. Maybe they get put into a state run nursing home?
 
I don't know about assisted living facilities, but I do know that a nursing home patient in this country would go on Medicaid. Their care would be completely covered, as soon as their net worth went down to something like $2000. (Their home doesn't count in that estimation.)

Not all nursing homes accept Medicaid patients, so they might have to be moved to one that does.
 
fmdog44 said:
Question for all: A person admits him/her self to a assisted living facility. What happens to a person with no family of any kind that is in a assisted living type facility and that persons money runs out? I'm sure state laws differ but I just wonder where could one go with no money and questionable competence.
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Medicaid which is health care for low income that is funded by federal government but administered by states steps in but even that has pitfalls. See this latest from Louisiana:

https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/09/us/louisiana-medicaid-cuts-nursing-homes-evictions/index.html
 
SeaBreeze ~ "Perhaps you can only request morphine to dull the pain of starvation?"

I have done 3 day fast diets and the only time I had pains was the first day, after that it is just a craving for food. It could be different with others. In long term starvation, you just keep getting dizzy and weaker and weaker. Anne Frank also said the same thing. My fast diet is to lose some weight (5-6 lbs) but mainly to clean my system of toxins, it takes 3 days to do that.
 
Yes PVC, I've also done fasts for several days in the past for the same reasons, and never had pain at all, but I was healthy and it was only 3 days. You're right though, the pain is not from starvation itself, but other processes going on. My aunt from my mother's side died in a nursing home from Alzheimer's, I was young, don't know all the details. More here.

With the impaired ability to move, a person in the late-stage of dementia is at risk for a number of medical complications like an infection of the urinary tract and pneumonia (an infection of the lung). Difficulty swallowing, eating and drinking leads to weight loss, dehydration, and malnutrition which further increases their vulnerability to infection.

In the end, most people with late-stage dementia die of a medical complication related to their underlying dementia. For instance, a person may die from an infection like aspiration pneumonia, which occurs as a result of swallowing difficulties, or a person may die from a blood clot in the lung as a result of being immobile and bedbound.

However, it's important to note that dementia itself is fatal. At times this is appropriately listed as the cause of death on a death certificate, as late-stage dementia is a terminal illness.

The big picture here is that while a person with end-stage dementia may technically die from an infection or other medical complication, it is their severe dementia that predisposed them to that complication and made them too weak to fight it off.

A Word From Verywell

While advanced dementia is incurable and will ultimately result in death, it's important to note that you can still provide comfort to your loved ones and play an active role in their care.

Hospice care is available and highly encouraged for individuals with late-stage dementia and includes strategies like comfort feeding, assessing and easing the pain, mouth care, engaging in pleasurable activities like music or soothing touch, and managing uncomfortable symptoms.

With this strategy, you are proactively providing love and support and nurturing your loved one without putting them through futile medical interventions.
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I don't know if it still happens, but the Netherlands used to offer assisted euthanasia, if the person was judged terminal by a group of doctors. The patient was given what was called a "mercy cocktail" that would allow the patient to drift off to sleep and in a short amount of time, breathing would stop.

This could be done in a hospice-like situation or at home. Family could be around to be with the patient as he left life.

My father had a DNR and died in the hospital. I was in the bed on one side, my mother was on the other and we had him in our arms as he struggled to breath and then gave up. How much better it would have been for him if he could have slipped off peacefully without the alarms screaming and all the ICU noises and people bustling around. The whole family could have been there to say goodbye to him if his death could have been "planned".
 
jujube, that is a very powerful post in favor of assisted euthanasia for someone judged to be
terminal by doctors. Very touching. I agree with you for a person in that state of health.

There is a lot to be said for a peaceful exit at that point in one's life.

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Keesha said:
Absolutely. Afterall we are soon approaching 2020. It’s about time some new options came about. We NEED changes desperately regarding this topic.
I’d buy a policy guaranteed. Then I wouldn’t have to worry about this cause I have to admit I don’t like the idea of totally giving up all my rights and living my final years miserable with other people in charge of everything. That’s not living.
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A problem [h=3]Veteran Pictures.[/h]I think with any assisted suicide program the problem is that the things so many of us don't want to have happen, like spending time unable to care for ourselves would be required before a physician or committee of physicians sign off that we are now beyond the possibility medical help.

Please correct me if I missunderstand this, as I might, but the systems I've heard about take the decision as to when this will be done away from the patient and into the hands of others. All the things that may concern us may be allowed to be done regardless of what we wanted when we were of sound mind.
 
LoneRogue said:
A problem Veteran Pictures.

I think with any assisted suicide program the problem is that the things so many of us don't want to have happen, like spending time unable to care for ourselves would be required before a physician or committee of physicians sign off that we are now beyond the possibility medical help.

Please correct me if I missunderstand this, as I might, but the systems I've heard about take the decision as to when this will be done away from the patient and into the hands of others. All the things that may concern us may be allowed to be done regardless of what we wanted when we were of sound mind.
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Then you make the decision yourself.

I have no desire to leave this solely the responsibility of someone else
No way!
No how!
 
In a discussion the other day most agreed that shooting yourself was a terrible thing to do to the person who has to deal with the aftermath.
 
LoneRogue said:
like spending time unable to care for ourselves would be required before a physician or committee of physicians sign off that we are now beyond the possibility medical help. ~ take the decision as to when this will be done away from the patient and into the hands of others. All the things that may concern us may be allowed to be done regardless of what we wanted when we were of sound mind.
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I agree, LoneRogue. Even if it is legal, it all becomes very complicated and time consuming and expensive. Like the 104 year old botanist. I was shocked when article said when he was unable to move wheelchair to get the drug moving through his veins, they had to re-ask the many questions from him before they injected the drug into his tube. I can understand the fear of being sued for murder, but geez so many technicalities. The guy was there to be euthanized, must have signed tons of paperwork already to have the deed done. And he WANTED to die and at 104 he had the right to. Must we have a TEAM of doctors declare that we are beyond medical help, and as you said, that will be way after we've already reached the end of our dignity.

I knew two fairly young men, in their 40's, who put a gun inside their mouth and shot themselves, two separate occasions. Nothing to do with health or old age, just desperation/depression. I felt sorry for their individual mothers who found them. I would like very much if the ''mercy cocktail'' that Jujube spoke about were available, but there would be reams of paperwork to get such a drug. There will always be people using that drug for the wrong reasons (murder one of them), that's one of the reasons the law is slow to provide the legality. The other reason is the social and/or the religious stigma (only god has the right to take your life). I am not religious and believe that since I did not have the right to refuse to be born, I should have the right to decide when and how to die.
 
It really is Sunny isn't it?...but I'm so heartbroken that people have to travel hundreds , nay thousands of miles when they are so sick, just to end their own lives. Their OWN !!!...
 
The problem is the older you get and the less mobile the harder it is to end it yourself.
In countries where the family always takes care of their parents at home, I wonder how this is handled.
I mean when they get very ill or in a lot of pain.
 
I know how I'm going to go, accidents notwithstanding. I don't like the "feel" of assisted suicide. I don't want some stranger doing anything to help me end my life, in some clinical setting. That just creeps me out. If things go my way, I'll bow out, my way. Also, the thought of dying "surrounded by friends and family," creeps me out, even more. I think dogs and cats have the right idea: Seek out an isolated, dark, comfortable place, and meet death in that location.
 
treeguy64 said:
I know how I'm going to go, accidents notwithstanding. I don't like the "feel" of assisted suicide. I don't want some stranger doing anything to help me end my life, in some clinical setting. That just creeps me out. If things go my way, I'll bow out, my way. Also, the thought of dying "surrounded by friends and family," creeps me out, even more. I think dogs and cats have the right idea: Seek out an isolated, dark, comfortable place, and meet death in that location.
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YES, I had thought of that earlier about animals. I agree with your whole post treeguy.
 
When I read obituary notices that often say "died surrounded by his/her loving family," I always get a bit skeptical. It sounds like patients' rooms in hospitals and nursing homes are filled with loving, caring relatives, providing emotional support up to the patient's peaceful last breath. From what I've observed in both kinds of places, that is not really the norm. Most patients seem to be alone, in a drug-induced sleep. Where are all those loving relatives?

Of course if they die at home, that's probably more likely.
 

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