Israel Has Declared War after Unprecedented Hamas Attack

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Rose65 said:
Any predictions on how this could end?
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Israel has two specific goals per Netanyahu's speech yesterday: "We have set two goals for the war: eliminating Hamas by destroying its military and governmental potential and doing everything possible to ensure our abductees can return home."

MSN link

Those are the goals and who knows how long or how much blood on both sides it will take to achieve them.
 
Lilac said:
The only mass slaughter was by Hamas against innocent families in their homes & young people at a gathering in the desert. Very slowly we are learning of how these people died at the hands of terrorists. No one should forget what happened that day. The terrorists who did this, along with those who have supported them, need to answer for what they did.

IMO, what Israel is preparing for is justice for those souls who were murdered & tortured.
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They are going to hunt them down like they did the terrorists involved in teh 1972 Munich Olympic terror attack/hostage situation

Mossad assassinations following the Munich massacre - Wikipedia

It took over 15 years but those Hamas terrorists that survive will be looking over their shoulder for the rest of their lives.
 
Rose65 said:
Any predictions on how this could end?
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That depends on who else gets actively involved militarily. It has the potential to become a global conflict; democratic nations versus autocratic nations; or at minimum, the US and its allies versus the Middle-East and its allies.

I predict that China's CCP would take that opportunity to finally invade Taiwan.

imo, it's best to let Israel deal with Hamas. We're supporting them, but not with active military support. And if Iran does the same for Hamas, this could remain a localized conflict. But that's a big if....imo.
 
I heard an interesting comment today. Hezzbolah may be a bit upset with Hamas. Hezzbolah is estimated to be about 10x stronger than Hamas. They certainly have a lot more rockets to aim at Israel, more armed men, and more sophisticated weapons The thinking goes like this. Both Hezzbolah and Hamas spotted various weakness in Israel’s defensenses. By striking first, Hamas has opened Israel’s eyes to those weaknesses and now Hezzbolah can’t take advantage of them as easily as they could have just a month ago. On top of that, American military might is now much closer, and can now come quickly to Israel’s aid by hitting Hezzbolah, thus making the cost of anttacking Israel all the greater.

Of course, Hezzbolah and friends may want a good old fashioned bloody war for their own reasons. It’s important that the USA and other countries not play their game by their rules. My guess is that this war may not be as fierce as it could be, but it will go on a lot longer as Israel methodically eliminates Hamas and some of its stronger supporters. Anybody in the market for an exploding mobile phone? Unless Hezzbolah forces the issue, they will have to wait their turn.

Who know fors sure? I certainly don’t. What I am nearly certain about is that there will be a lot of additional suffering in the area to add to the suffering we are seeing in places like Syria where Arabs are killing Arabs in the name of ??????

We’re going to have to show a lot of compassion to the millions of innocent victim of this violence.
 
Hamas is the radical wing of their cause, movement etc. But so much attention is on the depravity of the attack the goals or end game is being lost compared to a much more precise attack on military or political targets. Hezbollah might be a little more strategic in their thinking at this point.
 
Interesting stance from Israel right now - Israel says it will no longer be responsible for the Gaza Strip once Hamas is defeated. That means they'll no longer supply electricity, water, and goods of any kind, and have no interest in another occupation or any form of protection of the people.

Basically, after ridding Gaza of Hamas, they'll wash their hands of it. It would probably be up to Lebanon or Egypt, then, to take responsibility of the Gaza Strip. At this point, neither of them want to, but maybe after it's cleaned up?

It would be sweet if the Gaza Palestinians relocated to the West Bank. With Hamas gone, we could finally be looking at a 2-state solution.
 
Murrmurr said:
Interesting stance from Israel right now - Israel says it will no longer be responsible for the Gaza Strip once Hamas is defeated. That means they'll no longer supply electricity, water, and goods of any kind, and have no interest in another occupation or any form of protection of the people.

Basically, after ridding Gaza of Hamas, they'll wash their hands of it. It would probably be up to Lebanon or Egypt, then, to take responsibility of the Gaza Strip. At this point, neither of them want to, but maybe after it's cleaned up?

It would be sweet if the Gaza Palestinians relocated to the West Bank. With Hamas gone, we could finally be looking at a 2-state solution.
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Yes. Move the Palestinians to the West Bank and move the Israelis there to Gaza, after it has been rebuilt.
 
Gaza is a nice strip of land, nice coast. They could have built hotels for tourists on the water, but no, of course not, keep your people miserable and angry and blame someone else, instead of creating industry. Can't make them want a good life. Can't make them progress. It's up to them.

Sick of the BS, and getting tired of Neville Chamberlain wishy-washy comments. It's not so hard. Go forward or backward.
 
Isreali aeroplanes have tonight unleashed airstrikes of 'unprecedented' intensity across all parts of the Gaza strip, as it announced it was 'expanding' its ground forces' operations.

The aerial onslaught came with a warning from the IDF to Palestinian civilians still living in Gaza to move south as soon as possible, amid fears that the long-awaited ground invasion of the enclave may take place within hours.

The bombing, which observers described as much more ferocious and louder than previous days, coincided with electricity and communications blackouts in much of the besieged enclave.

According to one report the Israelis even unleashed 'bunker buster' concussion missiles to try and destroy the extensive Hamas tunnel network under Gaza.

IDF spokesperson Daniel Hagari telling reporters at a press conference today: 'In recent hours we have increased the attacks in Gaza.

'The air force widely attacks underground targets and terrorist infrastructure, very significantly.

'In continuation of the offensive activity we carried out in the last few days, the ground forces are expanding the ground activity this evening.'
The IDF said tonight it was expanding its bombardment campaign against Gaza, and was 'working powerfully in all dimensions' to achieve its military goals.

It was not clear whether this was a threat of a full invasion or a bigger but similar ‘probe’ to those launched on Wednesday and Thursday nights, with the troops returning by dawn.

Former General Wesley Clark, former NATO Allied Commander told CNN he believed the operation was a preparatory ‘softening up’ operation, rather than the full-scale invasion, adding that each probe yielded vital intelligence about how the Hamas defenders reacted.

Video footage of the 'unprecedented' bombing campaign saw Gaza's night sky light up bright orange, as the explosion was heard from miles away.
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IDF launches 'unprecedented' airstrikes in Gaza
 
Pepper said:
Gaza is a nice strip of land, nice coast. They could have built hotels for tourists on the water, but no, of course not, keep your people miserable and angry and blame someone else, instead of creating industry. Can't make them want a good life. Can't make them progress. It's up to them.

Sick of the BS, and getting tired of Neville Chamberlain wishy-washy comments. It's not so hard. Go forward or backward.
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It could also have become a very lucrative international port. Instead it's a rather small smuggler's paradise.
 
This is a piece in the paper today....

Has wokeism jumped the shark? In other words, have the radical Leftists who for years have exercised increasing power in our universities finally gone too far?

I dare to hope so. The recent disgraceful responses to the attacks on Israel that we have seen — from American university campuses to the streets of London and Sydney — have dramatically increased awareness that something is rotten in the state of higher education in the English-speaking world.

Some of us have been battling against the ideological takeover of academia for close to a decade. Each year, we have been getting better organised. But we have struggled to convince people in the real world just how bad things are.

The past three weeks may finally have changed that.

The expression 'jump the shark' was coined in 1977 when the scriptwriters of long-running comedy series Happy Days — into their fifth series and getting short of ideas — tried to pep up the storyline by having the main character, Fonzie, preposterously jump over a shark while on water-skis.
The campus Left's response to the attacks of October 7 was equally far-fetched and over-the-top — but immeasurably more offensive.

Let's remind ourselves what happened three weeks ago. Two Gaza-based terrorist groups inspired by Islamist ideology, committed to the destruction of the state of Israel and backed by at least one government, staged a trailer for a second Holocaust. In their savagery, they exceeded even the horrors perpetrated by the Russian butchers of Bucha in Ukraine.

More than 1,400 Israelis were killed, including children and even babies. More than 200 were kidnapped.

The idea Israel should do nothing in response to this outrage — other than ensure the flow of aid into Gaza — defies both human emotion and strategic sense. Only those wearing ideological blindfolds cannot see that.

Yet this seems to be the approach of some academics and student groups in a great many universities, not least in Britain.

Dr Kate Davison, a self-described 'queer historian of sexuality, psy-sciences & Cold War', who is also a lecturer in history at Edinburgh, not only tweeted that 'Palestine & trans human rights are the litmus test and most of you are failing half of it', but also expressed support for a statement by faculty members at Berzeit University — an institution in the West Bank — which celebrated the Hamas attacks as 'guerilla war tactics' by 'resistance fighters'.

Dr Sarah Liu, a senior lecturer in gender and politics, also at Edinburgh, liked a tweet on October 7 that asked: 'Did some people just think Palestine had to like file paperwork or something to be freed [?] this is what oppressed fighting the oppressor looks like.'
the rest here...

Deranged defence of Hamas on campuses could finally loosen wokeism
 
Mosab Hassan Yousef is the eldest son of Hamas co-founder Sheikh Hassan Yousef.“Since I was a child, I asked my father many questions about Hamas delusions, about their brutality, about their abuse of power, and he always justified their position,” Mosab Hassan Yousef said.“Then I was imprisoned with Hamas. I spent about 27 months in Israeli prisons where Hamas was torturing their own members … within Israeli prisons.

They killed and tortured hundreds of prisoners.“This is when I started asking myself the question: what if Hamas becomes the ruler at some point, what will they do to our people?”Mr Yousef said that when Hamas became the ruler of Gaza, their brutality didn’t surprise him.“This is my message: as an ex-Hamas member, as a son of one of Hamas’ founders, enough of this. If we don’t stop them now, the next war is going to be deadlier and only God knows what will happen next if Hamas is not finished as soon as possible,”

Mr Yousef said.“They opened the gates of hell on the Palestinian people.“They are willing to actually sacrifice many Palestinian children, the entire Palestinian people, and use them as fuel to … achieve their ideological agendas, their religious agendas.”


Full Interview.
 
So two questions:

Firstly how is it journalists are in Gaza, what of their safety? I can't imagine the amount of dedication that justifies staying right in the war zone.

Secondly, how and why has Gaza been cut off from the world - has such a thing happened before? Is this therefore war or genocide?
 
Rose65 said:
Secondly, how and why has Gaza been cut off from the world - has such a thing happened before? Is this therefore war or genocide?
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Rose, I'm going to give the benefit of the doubt and assume that your genocide comment concerns Hamas committing it, and not Israel. If that's accurate, it seems to be the case, yes.

McCaul Declares Hamas Committed Acts of Genocide, Crimes Against Humanity, War Crimes — Calls Upon State Department To Determine Same - Committee on Foreign Affairs
 
Hamas has called on Palestinians in the West Bank to 'mobilise' in support of Gaza.

The terrorist group called on those in the West Bank and '1948 territories' - a term used by Palestinians meaning Israel in reference to when it was founded - to take up arms as Israel's ground invasion begins.

Hamas reportedly said that it held Israel, the US and Western nations which support Israel 'fully responsible for the series of heinous massacres' against the people of Gaza, Al Jazeera reports.

It called on Arab nations and and the international community to immediately take action to prevent 'crimes and massacres' against Palestinian people, and a top official has said it is 'ready' for Israel's ground invasion.

Crowds of hundreds of people in the city of Ramallah, on the West Bank chanted 'If you have a rifle... you should either kill a Jew or give it to Hamas,' according to video from Palestinian news agency Shehab.Hamas

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Crowds of hundreds of people in the city of Ramallah, on the West Bank chanted 'If you have a rifle... you should either kill a Jew or give it to Hamas'

Hamas calls on Palestinians in Gaza's West Bank to 'mobilise'
 
hollydolly said:
Rose you should try and not worry about this so much, because what will happen will happen .. and making yourself so stressed over it won't change it unfortunately...
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Kind words to Rose for sure but ......

What is that old saying ?.....

All it takes for evil to trimuph .... is for good men to do nothing.

Note; Not sure that's a quote, but it's close.
 
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