It appears the U.S. economy is stalling.

[Flarbalard]

I know someone who owns a roofing company in Nebraska, all his employees and their families were deported. Some of those had parents that lived here for decades, working, paying their taxes-- deported.

He can't find replacement workers, so his company is falling farther behind. I've told it's the same story with other roofing companies in his area.

 

[Deya]

I live in the west and all I can say about this post is that fantasies are free. That’s definitely not what’s happening around here.

What I posted is what is happening in the area I live and know first hand what is happening. Instead of calling my 1st hand knowledge of my area, fantasy, give us some of your 1st hand facts on what is happening in your area.

 

[Deya]

I don't live in a big city. It is a small rural town that has seen little growth for years. I live within the city limits, but much of central Texas, and my county in particular, is agricultural: producing a variety of crops and livestock, including corn, wheat, and cotton.

Since I live in Texas, a border state, I am concerned about immigrants crossing our borders illegally, but I'm undecided on how I feel about laborer deportations and any effect they may or may not have on our farming communities, so I will set aside expressing an opinion about that.

I'll just stick with addressing the economy in general in my area, since you said you wanted to hear member's personal experiences, "not what anyone can hear on the news." and since you asked us, "Is the economy stalling?" [Where we live.]

Regardless of anything reported on the news, these are my actual personal experiences, some of which I've posted in other threads:

The new contract with my electricity provider is up 43% from my contract that just expired.
My natural gas bill is up 32% over what I paid last year.
My water bill has risen 20% in the past year and another increase is scheduled next month.
My homeowner's insurance has tripled in the past 3 years. I've already been advised that I will see another increase within 4 months when my policy renews.
I paid $210 / hour for a plumbing repair this year. The same plumber charged $175 / hour last year. That is a 35% increase in one year alone.

I use a lot of fresh produce, so I'm familiar with prices on it. Thankfully, those prices so far have remained relatively stable, but I have not seen any price reductions on produce where I live.

Almost every item I buy in the pharmacy section has risen, some items much more than others. A common digestive aid in the Walmart pharmacy section that I buy all the time cost $5.84 this week. Last year it was $1.57, an increase of over 350%. [I wish the increases I see were as low as 2.7%, which is the current inflation rate reported on the news. Maybe we should give the news credit for being too kind in their reporting on the economy.]

What has gone down? The only thing I'm (currently) seeing "down" where I live is gas prices - - - which fluctuate over time due to many global and domestic factors, supply and demand, seasonal variations, geopolitical events, etc. Gas prices are not indicative of the state of our overall economy.

Thanks for your personal experiences. With those kind of increases, I am glad I am not in Texas.

 

[David777]

Per @Flarbalard 's input...

In California building and construction industries, long before such reached other states, after decades of highest Post WWII population growth with suburban residential construction, there was a race to the bottom hiring given the way projects are bid, those many from south of the border that had skills and worked hard especially as teams. Over about a decade, that almost totally replaced native USA construction trades people. Those that remained were usually those natives managing crews or those performing special interior work. In the mean time, many people in states to the east just laughed at "the land of fruits and nuts" while our state was being flooded.

Wall Street corporations especially made sure politicians and their puppet media quietly ignored the invasion. The usual LIE was, "They are doing jobs, no others want!" Well tell that to a carpenter making a good wage that used to have a job.

Of course over years, the same situations moved east to other states. And as in construction, the same gradually developed in other occupations young people and unskilled once could count on. None of those laughing bozos are smiling anymore. Today, there are few native USA construction workers because they have been replaced while no natives with half a brain were stupid enough to go into a career facing that dilemma. Worse politicians have made sure it stays that way as the government pays chronically unemployed or unemployable people to do nothing.

 

[Fritz]

Per @Fritz 's input...

In California building and construction industries, long before such reached other states, after decades of highest Post WWII population growth with suburban residential construction, there was a race to the bottom hiring given the way projects are bid, those many from south of the border that had skills and worked hard especially as teams. Over about a decade, that almost totally replaced native USA construction trades people. Those that remained were usually those natives managing crews or those performing special interior work. In the mean time, many people in states to the east just laughed at "the land of fruits and nuts" while our state was being flooded.

Wall Street corporations especially made sure politicians and their puppet media quietly ignored the invasion. The usual LIE was, "They are doing jobs, no others want!" Well tell that to a carpenter making a good wage that used to have a job.

Of course over years, the same situations moved east to other states. And as in construction, the same gradually developed in other occupations young people and unskilled once could count on. None of those laughing bozos are smiling anymore. Today, there are few native USA construction workers because they have been replaced while no natives with half a brain were stupid enough to go into a career facing that dilemma. Worse politicians have made sure it stays that way as the government pays people to do nothing.

not sure why you quoted my name. i never said anything about construction workers.

 

[David777]

not sure why you quoted my name. i never said anything about construction workers.

My mistake, thank you for and now corrected. Was the post below yours.

 

[Deya]

I am curious as to where you obtained that information.

First hand from the labor places that hire and transport workers to the fields every day this time of year. I see the many vans full of workers every morning early. Also from neighbors that work in agriculture. Also from relatives in law enforcement. Oh, and then there is the many places that do landscaping and lawns. Same faces year after year and only the boss is a citizen. The others are on green cards and no one cares if they are legit or fake unless they commit a crime. Also from relatives that are prison guards.

 

[MACKTEXAS]

i don't know how much hiring is actually happening. in our facility we are getting no applicants and the few sparse ones we get are either not hirable or they are crappy employees that don't do their jobs or stay.

At least it sounds like your facility will consider applicants. Restaurants and stores here are either reducing staff or not hiring to prevent raising prices. Brookshires, our only major grocer, resisted installing self checkout, but they have it now. There used to be five lines with cashiers. Now there are two.

 

[Fritz]

At least it sounds like your facility will consider applicants. Restaurants and stores here are either reducing staff or not hiring to prevent raising prices. Brookshires, our only major grocer, resisted installing self checkout, but they have it now. There used to be five lines with cashiers. Now there are two.

is it prices or is it lack of applicants?

 

[MACKTEXAS]

is it prices or is it lack of applicants?

There are people here who need work and can't find it. I eat out most every Sunday and have noticed that it takes longer getting our orders and we have all noticed less staff on duty at more than one place.

 

[bobcat]

First hand from the labor places that hire and transport workers to the fields every day this time of year. I see the many vans full of workers every morning early. Also from neighbors that work in agriculture. Also from relatives in law enforcement. Oh, and then there is the many places that do landscaping and lawns. Same faces year after year and only the boss is a citizen. The others are on green cards and no one cares if they are legit or fake unless they commit a crime. Also from relatives that are prison guards.

I think perhaps what you meant to say was that no one locally that you're aware of has been deported.
I could accept that.

 

[Fritz]

There are people here who need work and can't find it. I eat out most every Sunday and have noticed that it takes longer getting our orders and we have all noticed less staff on duty at more than one place.

Where I work there are people out of work but we're not allowed to hire people with criminal records and many of them are not good workers. A lot of times we are short staffed because people call in all the time. We have one new girl that calls in every weekend she has to work.

 

[Muskrat]

I do not know much…but I know if you are a soybean farmer you are terrified right now. China buys a very large portion of our soybeans…and per the ag news there are absolutely no..zilch…nada contracts for soybeans to china. Farmers are once again begging for their very existence in the form of a bailout. This might help this year…but what happens if china buys from brazil again for the next several years?

 

[bobcat]

I always try to remind myself to cut the people south of the border a little slack. They were the real natives here until we forced them into a treaty at gunpoint. In 1848, the U.S. forced Mexico to cede 55 percent of its territory, including all of present-day California, Nevada, Utah, most of Arizona and New Mexico, and parts of Colorado, Wyoming, Kansas, and Oklahoma.

In exchange, the U.S. paid $15 million and agreed to assume $3.25 million in Mexican debts to American citizens.
Conservative defenders love to point to this payment as proof the acquisition was legitimate. But paying someone while holding a gun to their head doesn't make it a voluntary transaction. American troops occupied their capital and their government had collapsed, making Mexican resistance impossible.



Mexican Cession territory, 1848

The treaty promised to protect the property rights and citizenship of Mexicans living in the ceded territories. Within decades, those promises proved worthless. Californio families who had owned vast ranchos for generations found themselves fighting expensive legal battles in American courts to prove ownership of their own land. Many lost everything to lawyers' fees and discriminatory laws designed to transfer property to Anglo settlers.

Even the American generals who won the war later admitted its injustice. Ulysses S. Grant, who fought as a young officer, later wrote that it was "one of the most unjust ever waged by a stronger against a weaker nation…

We and the former countries we came from have a long history of taking what we want from the natives, including land and resources, and then calling them savages and immigrants, and ourselves natives. I don't feel comfortable living in that ivory tower. We can't undo what has been done, but I believe we should treat them with more kindness than we often do. JMO

 

[Deya]

I think perhaps what you meant to say was that no one locally that you're aware of has been deported.
I could accept that.

No, I said I know of less than 100 out of over 10,000 LOCAL that have been deported. Yes, I know of deportations, but not field workers that may have entered illegal, unless they are wanted for a serious crime. The idea that jobs are open because no body wants to work except illegals, is false in the three state area I am knowledgeable of. The agricultural labor places have more wanting to work than they have jobs. Sometimes, workers get in line over an hour early just so they can get picked. Most of these field jobs pay $20 an hour with truck drivers getting up to $40.

My husband used to work for one of the labor companies as a driver and overseer during the summer when he wasn't working for the school district. He still knows many of the former workers that have stayed and started landscaping and construction businesses.

We have hundreds that come to work every year from spring to fall. They usually go back to Mexico when fall harvest is over and have done this for years. We have had raids on drug labs, gangs, and places that are involved in human trafficking, but it was done by local law enforcement, unless it was interstate and then FBI and ICE were involved. It was always monitored for weeks or months, so they get the leaders and put a stop to it. No one was snatching innocent people off their jobs and leaving food to rot in the fields. If this is happening in other places, then maybe these areas need new law enforcement and leadership.

ICE wasn't called during pervious years because all they did was release these criminals back into the community. So law enforcement quit calling them and kept them in prison until recently, since the Feds will now deport and not put an offender back into the community to reoffend.

 

[bobcat]

No, I said I know of less than 100 out of over 10,000 LOCAL that have been deported. Yes, I know of deportations, but not field workers that may have entered illegal, unless they are wanted for a serious crime. The idea that jobs are open because no body wants to work except illegals, is false in the three state area I am knowledgeable of. The agricultural labor places have more wanting to work than they have jobs. Sometimes, workers get in line over an hour early just so they can get picked. Most of these field jobs pay $20 an hour with truck drivers getting up to $40.

My husband used to work for one of the labor companies as a driver and overseer during the summer when he wasn't working for the school district. He still knows many of the former workers that have stayed and started landscaping and construction businesses.

We have hundreds that come to work every year from spring to fall. They usually go back to Mexico when fall harvest is over and have done this for years. We have had raids on drug labs, gangs, and places that are involved in human trafficking, but it was done by local law enforcement, unless it was interstate and then FBI and ICE were involved. It was always monitored for weeks or months, so they get the leaders and put a stop to it. No one was snatching innocent people off their jobs and leaving food to rot in the fields. If this is happening in other places, then maybe these areas need new law enforcement and leadership.

ICE wasn't called during pervious years because all they did was release these criminals back into the community. So law enforcement quit calling them and kept them in prison until recently, since the Feds will now deport and not put an offender back into the community to reoffend.

Yes, and you also said: "No hard working law abiding farm worker is being deported, that is a false narrative to further one political agenda that is hate based." That was the blanket statement I was calling into question.

Again, I think what you meant was none locally that you're aware of. So, we are in agreement with that.

 

[Deya]

Yes, and you also said: "No hard working law abiding farm worker is being deported, that is a false narrative to further one political agenda that is hate based." That was the blanket statement I was calling into question.

Again, I think what you meant was none locally that you're aware of. So, we are in agreement with that.

Can you name any documented instance of LAWABIDING farm workers being deported? So far ones I have read about or seen on the news, were not law-abiding.

This is your thread, so I am off it, now that you are going to school us on American Indian history. It is part of my heritage, documented, and one thing that really upsets me is folks with political agendas bringing up Indian history that they know little about. We can all read what is online and googling seems to be treasured more than heritage, oral tradition, and first hand experiences.

 

[bobcat]

Can you name any documented instance of LAWABIDING farm workers being deported? So far ones I have read about or seen on the news, were not law-abiding.

This is your thread, so I am off it, now that you are going to school us on American Indian history. It is part of my heritage, documented, and one thing that really upsets me is folks with political agendas bringing up Indian history that they know little about. We can all read what is online and googling seems to be treasured more than heritage, oral tradition, and first hand experiences.

Whether I can document one or not is beside the point. Just because you aren't aware of any doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Furthermore, it's not Indian history, it's Native American history, and if you're disputing what I posted about it, then let's hear what you consider to be the truth that you are privy to that conflicts with the historical record.

 

[VaughanJB]

All stock market indices are at all-time highs today (according to Cramer on CNBC)! Is this a great (that is confusing) country or what!?

This is being hotly debated. You are correct, but there are questions about the people that analyze and report such data.

The economy is not doing good. People can see it every day at the gas station, in the grocery store. The IT industry is contracting. There are mass layoffs.

Yet, yes - the indices seem good. You can see the problem beginning to show in economies in France and the UK. Taking politics out of the equation, the fact is - there is no money left to invest in infrastructure. No money for tax cuts. Not without taking on massive national debt. The headroom for governments to take on debt to bring wealth to individuals (and especially the middle classes) is running out. The system is creaking.

Take a look at China. Things are very, very bad there right now. And not simply because of tariffs. Tariffs don't help, but it's been shaky for some time. We're approaching (imo) another global catastrophe.

 

[Deya]

Whether I can document one or not is beside the point. Just because you aren't aware of any doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Furthermore, it's not Indian history, it's Native American history, and if you're disputing what I posted about it, then let's hear what you consider to be the truth that you are privy to that conflicts with the historical record.

Excuse me! Not American Indian history? The word native isn't used by most tribes, especially the elders. That is a new term and used mostly by young folks. I don't care to get into a debate about American Indian history with those educated by a few sites on the internet. Most tribes identify by their tribe, but prefer being called American Indian rather than native. Discussing it on this forum serves no good purpose.

@VaughanJB In my area, the price of gas is down $2 a gallon compared to 2 years ago. Our utilities are about the same and any increases are very small. Food prices have dropped on most items and the rest has stayed about the same as it was 3 years ago. Wages have gone up substantially.

 

[Warrigal]

As far as I am concerned everything to do with money is unreal. By this I mean that it is as real as castles in the air and fairies at the bottom of the garden.

It is like a spider web, fragile, but a construction nevertheless. To rely on money and investments is foolishness.

Even money in the bank is unreal. It is just a number in a leger somewhere that can disappear like smoke when some other part of the illusion falls apart.

I stay sane by not worrying about things that are beyond my control.

 

[bobcat]

Excuse me! Not American Indian history? The word native isn't used by most tribes, especially the elders. That is a new term and used mostly by young folks. I don't care to get into a debate about American Indian history with those educated by a few sites on the internet. Most tribes identify by their tribe, but prefer being called American Indian rather than native. Discussing it on this forum serves no good purpose.

@VaughanJB In my area, the price of gas is down $2 a gallon compared to 2 years ago. Our utilities are about the same and any increases are very small. Food prices have dropped on most items and the rest has stayed about the same as it was 3 years ago. Wages have gone up substantially.

I tip my hat to you. You are likely the only person alive who has personally spoken with the elders of the 574 recognized tribes and discussed how they prefer being described. The rest of us aren't as well traveled as you and have not had the privilege of personal contact. Alas, we must educate ourselves by reading.

 

[MACKTEXAS]

As far as I am concerned everything to do with money is unreal. By this I mean that it is as real as castles in the air and fairies at the bottom of the garden.

It is like a spider web, fragile, but a construction nevertheless. To rely on money and investments is foolishness.

Even money in the bank is unreal. It is just a number in a leger somewhere that can disappear like smoke when some other part of the illusion falls apart.

I stay sane by not worrying about things that are beyond my control.

I think I know a bit about your faith from some of your other posts. I also respect it, and may share some of the same views. There are dangers in too much self reliance - life circumstances can change overnight, and nothing is certain, but it's okay to have opinions - even concerns - on the state of the economy.

 

[Trade]

As far as I am concerned everything to do with money is unreal. By this I mean that it is as real as castles in the air and fairies at the bottom of the garden.

It is like a spider web, fragile, but a construction nevertheless. To rely on money and investments is foolishness.

Even money in the bank is unreal. It is just a number in a leger somewhere that can disappear like smoke when some other part of the illusion falls apart.

I stay sane by not worrying about things that are beyond my control.

Let me take you down
'Cause I'm going to strawberry fields
Nothing is real
And nothing to get hung about
Strawberry fields forever
Living is easy with eyes closed
Misunderstanding all you see
It's getting hard to be someone, but it all works out
It doesn't matter much to me

 

[Deya]

I tip my hat to you. You are likely the only person alive who has personally spoken with the elders of the 574 recognized tribes and discussed how they prefer being described. The rest of us aren't as well traveled as you and have not had the privilege of personal contact. Alas, we must educate ourselves by reading.

There you go with unnecessary sarcasm. The Navajo and the Choctaw prefer in general to be called Indians, not natives. Their preference is their tribal identity, Choctaw or Navajo and they refer to their reservation as a Nation. Other tribes I personally know members of, prefer tribal name or Indian. I have talked to a few younger members that prefer native to Indian since "white folks" have told them being called Indian is insulting. The elders I know, use Indian because that is their history and they take pride in it. It is honoring their ancestors which is important in all American Indian tribes I know of.