Jane Goodall speaks about Conservation and why she's a vegetarian
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Debby
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- East coast of Canada
Sorry to burst your bubble Ralph, but Ms. Goodall is 100% right on everything she said.
Currently 1000 million acres of land in the USA is used for meat/animal production. That includes grazing, feed lots and all the land used to grow food for animals that are going to be eaten. By contrast, 3,000,000 acres is used to grow plants for human consumption.
To grow one pound of beef requires around 3000 gallons of water, compared to 25 gallons of water to grow a pound of wheat.
Then there's the tonnes of pesticides and herbicides used on the millions of acres of animal foods and the thousands of pounds of antibiotics used on all those animals, all of which is finding it's way into the water table, rivers, lakes and oceans of the world! I have a link to a study that says that a veg diet is more sustainable for the billions of people that will be on this planet in the next 30 years, than is a meat inclusive one. Taking into consideration, the pollution, the waste of resources and the toxic mess of pesticides, herbicides and antibiotics, and the results of overfishing, meat consumption is a decision to participate in the more rapid destruction of the environment.
There was a study by the FAOO back in 2006 that found that meat consumption is the source of 18% of GHG but there was a followup study by another group that put that figure at more like 51%. This factors in not only direct 'cow' methane, but the emissions of the equipment used to plant and harvest their food, transportation costs to slaughterhouses, as well as slaughterhouse costs, transport again to the store and your transportation costs. I can't be sure, but the second study may have included the costs of clearing land of the trees growing on it prior to it becoming 'farm' land. But whatever, even 18% for 'one item' shows that this 'luxury' is costing us.
As well, it is a bomb dropped into a world of biodiversity and it takes out other animals by sheer force of numbers and humans driven to protect their investments. One of the primary proponents of wolf destruction for example is ranchers. Then there is the loss of habitat because of land clearing for grazing and animal food production which affects every species and in the oceans, the by-catch that dies for nothing is also hurting the world beneath the waves.
I would also venture a guess that except for a few people with some specific digestive health issues, nobody really needs meat. If vegan athletes can be at the top of the pack, then there is the best proof that for an average person, it is entirely possible to live well without meat. In my opinion what may have happened millions of years ago is neither here no there. We're living in 2015, now we have the understanding and technology to thrive on a vegetarian diet and the planet cannot sustain what we're doing. Keep in mind, that by 2050 I think it is, the estimates are that there will be another 2 billion people on the planet.
And then there's the issue of the horrendous suffering as a billion animals a year (in the USA) go through the (dis)assembly line.....................
She was also right about my countries lousy record on conservation, not to mention food animal welfare standards. I found a comparison of our standards compared to the EU and we are failing dreadfully.
Currently 1000 million acres of land in the USA is used for meat/animal production. That includes grazing, feed lots and all the land used to grow food for animals that are going to be eaten. By contrast, 3,000,000 acres is used to grow plants for human consumption.
To grow one pound of beef requires around 3000 gallons of water, compared to 25 gallons of water to grow a pound of wheat.
Then there's the tonnes of pesticides and herbicides used on the millions of acres of animal foods and the thousands of pounds of antibiotics used on all those animals, all of which is finding it's way into the water table, rivers, lakes and oceans of the world! I have a link to a study that says that a veg diet is more sustainable for the billions of people that will be on this planet in the next 30 years, than is a meat inclusive one. Taking into consideration, the pollution, the waste of resources and the toxic mess of pesticides, herbicides and antibiotics, and the results of overfishing, meat consumption is a decision to participate in the more rapid destruction of the environment.
There was a study by the FAOO back in 2006 that found that meat consumption is the source of 18% of GHG but there was a followup study by another group that put that figure at more like 51%. This factors in not only direct 'cow' methane, but the emissions of the equipment used to plant and harvest their food, transportation costs to slaughterhouses, as well as slaughterhouse costs, transport again to the store and your transportation costs. I can't be sure, but the second study may have included the costs of clearing land of the trees growing on it prior to it becoming 'farm' land. But whatever, even 18% for 'one item' shows that this 'luxury' is costing us.
As well, it is a bomb dropped into a world of biodiversity and it takes out other animals by sheer force of numbers and humans driven to protect their investments. One of the primary proponents of wolf destruction for example is ranchers. Then there is the loss of habitat because of land clearing for grazing and animal food production which affects every species and in the oceans, the by-catch that dies for nothing is also hurting the world beneath the waves.
I would also venture a guess that except for a few people with some specific digestive health issues, nobody really needs meat. If vegan athletes can be at the top of the pack, then there is the best proof that for an average person, it is entirely possible to live well without meat. In my opinion what may have happened millions of years ago is neither here no there. We're living in 2015, now we have the understanding and technology to thrive on a vegetarian diet and the planet cannot sustain what we're doing. Keep in mind, that by 2050 I think it is, the estimates are that there will be another 2 billion people on the planet.
And then there's the issue of the horrendous suffering as a billion animals a year (in the USA) go through the (dis)assembly line.....................
She was also right about my countries lousy record on conservation, not to mention food animal welfare standards. I found a comparison of our standards compared to the EU and we are failing dreadfully.
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Shalimar
SF VIP
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- Vancouver Island Canada
Debby, I agree with you. The average North American consumes twice as much protein as needed. Canada's record on conservation, animal welfare, is appalling. We are a country that sponsors Eco-terrorism. Not surprising given the disconnect between the way non white immigrants are treated, versus governmental treatment of our indigenous population. I love my country, but remain deeply ashamed of many of it's current policies. Lots of work to be done.
Shalimar
SF VIP
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- Vancouver Island Canada
Piffle, Ralphy.
Debby
Well-known Member
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- East coast of Canada
And as I pointed out Ralph, what happened millions of years ago to bring us to the current situation is moot. The planet cannot support the number of people on it and those numbers that will be on it in a mere 25 years approximately, if those numbers continue to waste resources and continue to cause the environmental devastation that a 'habit' is causing. As I pointed out, today we have the understanding of nutrition and development of alternate sources of food that put us in the unique position of being able to feed ourselves a healthy, tasty and kind diet.
Not only that, but while our brains have grown speedily, it would appear that our ability to be compassionate towards the suffering of helpless creatures in our not so tender charge, has not kept pace. The violence and abuses that we humans across the planet subject every animal species to, is beyond belief and to our shame! I have spent years reading on this subject and the stories and videos of our 'regard' for the other creatures that share the planet are truly the stuff of nightmares and that condemnation includes where your breakfast begins.
The abuses run the gamut. From the annual butchery of 16,000+ water buffalo (cows and calves) in a single weekend in a Nepal festival where they are hacked to death by drunks, to the live shipping of hundreds of pigs every year to Hawaii (for those famous luaus's) in closed shipping containers loaded on the decks of ships where they are not fed often for a week a time as they sit baking in the sun, to the millions of newborn calves who end up chained in veal crates for their short lives, we are a tremendously cruel species. Dogs and cats hung, then beaten then boiled alive in Korea is no different from hunters blasting thousands of terrified pigeons to pieces, for fun in Pennsylvannia. Fur bearing animals stunned into temporary unconsciousness by bashing them against the ground in China and then skinned while they are alive brings us the joy of a strip of fur around the hood of a jacket. The end of the video that attended that particular last revelation is burned into my mind forever! It is all pitiless, we are all pitiless.
A million years ago????? And what is our excuse today for our inexcusable cruelty?
After many years as a vegan and after many sometimes angry discussions on the subject of the animals, I've learned to discuss without animus and to merely impart facts. What people do with those facts is out of my control so I choose to release that information to 'the universe' and hope that someone, somewhere finds that their heart has been awakened strongly enough that they decide to make changes in their lives.
Are these the same "respected scientific sources" that say climate change/global warming doesn't exist?
Every person on the planet is low on Iron. Meat especially liver provides the most human absorbable source. It would be nice to develop chelation food derivatives that would replace this, currently the only process is iv. Please don't go into hematocrit and current arcane medical dogma. I work with a clinic ( not as a patient) that cures people. Fe is required by both plants and animals in the electron transport system. Think of as the plant worlds gift to mammals during evolution.
vegans originally started this practice because they did not want to participate in the death throes of the animal and was practiced by early christians, which was a divergence, at that time, from Mitharism.
It's not likely that the picture you paint will change much.
vegans originally started this practice because they did not want to participate in the death throes of the animal and was practiced by early christians, which was a divergence, at that time, from Mitharism.
It's not likely that the picture you paint will change much.
This thread wasn't so much focusing on dietary deficiencies of being a vegetarian, rather upon the destruction of the environment by the meat industry. If you didn't watch the video, it would help if you do. Iron can be obtained from plant sources, for those unaware of this fact.
It's not a perfect world. The sooner people stop trying to make it a World of Disney maybe some of it can change, instead of disappointed when expectations and reality collide.
the absorption of Fe is a greater problem than in the past, especially in the us, is because of the large consumption of over the counter proton pump inhibitors. Fe absorption prefers an acidic enviorment, which is negated by these and antacids, used for heartburn. It can be helped somewhat by taking probiotics, or making your own sauerkraut if you are into it.
the absorption of Fe is a greater problem than in the past, especially in the us, is because of the large consumption of over the counter proton pump inhibitors. Fe absorption prefers an acidic enviorment, which is negated by these and antacids, used for heartburn. It can be helped somewhat by taking probiotics, or making your own sauerkraut if you are into it.
Shalimar
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- Vancouver Island Canada
Rt, you make me smile. I am guilty of many things, but naïveté is not one of them. I have experienced the brutality this world can offer. I have made it my life's work to change in some small way some of the effects of that horror. Disney has nothing to do with it. Reality is not fixed, but, like expectation, is open to change. I live in a gritty, but hopeful world.
AZ Jim
R.I.P. With Us In Spirit Only
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Just curious, do you have a credible link that states that?
Debby
Well-known Member
- Location
- East coast of Canada
First of all, where's your proof? When I looked it up (Ralph would be so proud that I used Google), I found that the WHO says 30% of the world is dealing with anemia. That's not the 'whole world'. It also said that it was the poorest and the most undedicated who are the greatest sufferers. Secondly I just had my blood work done last year (18 years of no meat consumption) and my iron levels were fine.
http://www.who.int/nutrition/topics/ida/en/
And you're right, what I've said here is unlikely to change very much. It seems that people are by and large, more interested in their own situation and traditions than the situations that others and particularly animals must deal with at our hands.
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Debby
Well-known Member
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- East coast of Canada
Easy escape Ralph. But it's kind of like filling a sieve with water and doesn't mean a lot. Besides, the chimps do eat meat. It's those great big strong gorillas that generally don't.
Son_of_Perdition
Senior Member
I for one am glad the internet has come out in support of popcorn, Cheez Whiz, eggs, coffee, peanut butter, red wine & butter.
And, if you eat those things you have less of a chance to develop dementia. If I could only get them to endorse the 'to die for' peach cobbler my wife buys at the Mennonite bakery.
And, if you eat those things you have less of a chance to develop dementia. If I could only get them to endorse the 'to die for' peach cobbler my wife buys at the Mennonite bakery.
Debby
Well-known Member
- Location
- East coast of Canada
Here's another explanation for the 30% deficiency rate of iron. I found it quite interesting as it is one more reason to call into question, our addiction to milk products. 5 minute video so it's not a substantial investment in time: http://www.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=597264
Shalimar
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- Vancouver Island Canada
Has anyone checked out the stats around lifespan, health of well-rounded vegetetarians? I have a friend of forty years, who has never eaten meat during that time. This individual takes care of themselves, and, at sixty, runs marathons, has a heart rate of seventy, and blood pressure of an eighteen year old. Takes no meds.
Shali, that sounds like my old friend in North Vancouver who is 93 now and has been a vegetarian/vegan since around 1971, when first I met her. True she has slowed down and can't hike up the mountain like she used to but she's still her old feisty self and very much alive. No medical conditions that I know of except some arthritis.