Just Decided to Become Pig Free

Debby said:
China has the Yulin dog meat festival every year. 10,000 to 15,000 dogs are slaughtered on June 20th and most apparently are bludgeoned to death. And throughout the year, upwards of 10 million die equally horrific deaths. Cats are also treated as horribly, and they are often boiled alive. An extreme end of a tradition on the continuum of violence.
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Really disgusting.
 

I like the idea of being vegan, but it would not work out in the household, as a practical matter. Also, I really like chicken....alot.
 
There is a family story of how, when I was a toddler, a friend and I got in with a sow and tried to milk her!

As she had a full litter feeding at the time I have since come to know ho lucky we were, nursing sows can be a bit touchy to say the least!

We always assumed that she accepted two grubby little urchins, well known to her anyway, were two of her own.
 

Yes anyone can put up pictures of 'cute little piggies' and conveniently forget that they turn rapidly into 250lbs. of ravenous eating machines. I help to keep rare breed pigs and if it wasn't for us small scale 'farmers', these breeds probably wouldn't exist. I don't eat large scale commercially produced pork from pigs kept in confined spaces and used as breeding machines. However, I am an unapologetic omnivore who likes meat (including pork) and we try to give our animals a good, if short, life.

If you don't like it, don't eat pork .

p.s I'm making venison (Roe deer) bourguignon for dinner.
 
Your comment Capt makes me think of little human babies and how cute they start out and what they turn into.

I used to be a church attendee and was committed to my church, my Lord, my faith, etc. But then one day, something changed and that faith began to change. Now, while I don't believe as I did, I try to keep in mind, the sensibilities of those folks that I know who are still devoted. While I sometimes enjoy digging deep into the old memory bank and discussing Biblical things I make an effort to not offend or denigrate their beliefs, instead choosing to allow them their 'opinions' while I have mine. I try to be considerate. I often feel that it would be nice if others afforded people who've chosen a lifestyle such as mine with the same consideration. My daughter, my own mother often forget I suppose whom they are talking to and I get to hear about their latest beef dinner or the KFC chicken they had last night or how much they love xyz, all of which conjure up the most tragic and horrific images in my mind.......but you know, as I was writing this I was suddenly reminded of a lesson that I realized a few years ago, and that is to never expect anything of anyone, because you're sure to be disappointed.

And like you Cookie, I'm blown away by the vast majority of people who refer to themselves as animal lovers and yet when it comes to the lifetime of suffering that animals receive at the hands of humans, there is no question that their participation in that suffering will continue. My only involvement comes by way of having a cat and a dog who are true carnivores (although the dog can manage with some plant foods) and I am grieved every time I feed them because I can't step away from it entirely. If I hadn't already had the dog prior to 'waking up' and if the cat hadn't reached out to us in the midst of his suffering, I would be entirely free of that cycle of violence to whatever degree is possible in this world.

My personal belief in the afterlife includes (from all of my reading and research on NDE's and physics, etc.) that life carries on and that we do this over and over again, each time making an effort to reach up to a new and grander version of ourselves. I also believe that we have choice as to the 'where' and 'how' of that experience, and based on this issue and how we humans so willingly commit violence and bloodshed against those in our society (global or local), I intend that my 'next time around' will not happen here.
 
I knew someone who had a pet pig and that pig was so affectionate. Always wanted to be petted and was very well taken care of. No piggy smell at all. The one thing that upset me about pet pigs was a few years ago it was a fad to have one of those small pot bellied pigs for a pet. Seems like a lot of folks got one. Many were just regular pigs sold as the smaller type. When they started to grow and put on the pounds people got rid of them. Many ended up in the slaughter houses. Some people near starved the poor things to keep their weight in check. Such a shame. I believe no breed of any animal should be popularized to such a degree that folks purchase them for that reason. Another perfect example was Taco Bell with the Chihuahua commercial. Many ran out and bought them also. After having them for awhile they decided they didn't care for the breed for one reason or another, so off they went to dog shelters where many were destroyed.
 
Capt Lightning said:
I help to keep rare breed pigs and if it wasn't for us small scale 'farmers', these breeds probably wouldn't exist. I don't eat large scale commercially produced pork from pigs kept in confined spaces and used as breeding machines.
p.s I'm making venison (Roe deer) bourguignon for dinner.
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I've seen the photos you've shared with us here of your beautiful pigs Capt. Very unique in appearance and quite obviously well cared for, you're the ideal example of what I was talking about when I said I respected the ranchers and farmers who treat their animals well! Hope you enjoyed your venison dinner, sounds good! :)
 
The first pigs we kept were British Saddlebacks. They arrived as cute little piglets and within 5 months they were around 100 kg (220 lbs). At full size they each ate around 4 lbs of pig pellets + vegetables per day, and drank a large amount of water. They had a great taste, but tended to be fat. For a change last year we raised 'Oxford Sandy & Black' pigs and they had a pretty obnoxious temperament. This year's pigs are 'Berkshire' boars which are very good natured, but ravenously hungry. They are slow growing and will not reach full weight till around November.

I would not think of having a pig as a pet, and we never give them names - just numbers.
 
We raise our own beef and poultry, we would not use enough parts of a pig to make it feasible to raise our own. We trade beef with a friend that does pigs. I know that for those that are several stages removed from the natural order of the Human food chain it may seem incredible, but we love,yes love our animals. I find it an awesome responsibility to shepherd these creatures though every step of their lives many times from conception to slaughter. My animals exist for a single purpose and that is to provide sustenance for my self and my family. My animals have all they need and more for a healthy content life and a respectful and proper final disposition.

If you are vegetarian or vegan,good for you, Eat as you like,but do not expect me to restrict or modify my dietary requirements to suit your belief. Nor will I allow you to infer that your lifestyle is somehow more inherently noble or pure than mine!
 
Robusta said:
If you are vegetarian or vegan,good for you, Eat as you like,but do not expect me to restrict or modify my dietary requirements to suit your belief. Nor will I allow you to infer that your lifestyle is somehow more inherently noble or pure than mine!
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Same. I have no desire to go the vegan route. I try to maintain a balanced diet though. Veggies with fish and chicken mostly. But do enjoy an occasional steak, pork chop and sometimes bacon with my eggs.:eek:
 
Robusta said:
If you are vegetarian or vegan,good for you, Eat as you like,but do not expect me to restrict or modify my dietary requirements to suit your belief. Nor will I allow you to infer that your lifestyle is somehow more inherently noble or pure than mine!
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I do find this part of your post interesting. I have not eaten meat in 25 years and have been plant based for 10. I don't think I have ever spoken or written something with this tone regarding my own views. I have worked at the same place for over 5 years. Most have no idea I don't eat meat.

I know there are some real jerks in the community that don't eat meat or eat plant based. I've been victimized by them since I'm overweight. Veganism has become a money making business like most things. While some of these people probably started out with great intentions, it's become about money and egos.

I don't donate of advocate for farm animals anymore. I'm just a person no one would guess eats plant based, based on my looks. Some of the posts in this thread went the predictable route.
 
Robusta said:
If you are vegetarian or vegan,good for you, Eat as you like,but do not expect me to restrict or modify my dietary requirements to suit your belief. Nor will I allow you to infer that your lifestyle is somehow more inherently noble or pure than mine!
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Even though I had never heard of vegetarians, since early childhood I have very rarely eaten meat. My family and friends enjoy meat and I have always cooked it for them. Feel it is a personal preference.
 
I suppose I may have come across as defensive. My cousin and her girlfriend are militantly vegan to the point of vandalizing and endangering my animals and property while trying to teach me the errors of my ways. Their efforts to "liberate" my cows ended with a three day old calf in a creek catching, pneumonia and the rest of the herd scattered across the road and on the neighbors place.
My defense mechanisms always kick in when I hear or see the V word.
 
Capt Lightning said:
The first pigs we kept were British Saddlebacks. They arrived as cute little piglets and within 5 months they were around 100 kg (220 lbs). At full size they each ate around 4 lbs of pig pellets + vegetables per day, and drank a large amount of water. They had a great taste, but tended to be fat. For a change last year we raised 'Oxford Sandy & Black' pigs and they had a pretty obnoxious temperament. This year's pigs are 'Berkshire' boars which are very good natured, but ravenously hungry. They are slow growing and will not reach full weight till around November.

I would not think of having a pig as a pet, and we never give them names - just numbers.
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Do you have any local retail outlets? I normally buy Puddledub, which I expect you are aware of, but I'm always up for a change!
 
No Laurie, we raise the pigs for our own consumption. Our friends who own the land, eat mostly pork and so have a greater share of the costs and the end product. If we wanted to go down a 'commercial' route, the pork would have to be professionally butchered and packed, adding to the costs. I'm afraid that small scale production is relatively expensive. You simpy can't produce 'home grown' pork for the cost of supermarket meat. From start to finish, a pig will cost about £220 and this will yield around 65 kg of pork. (note that we don't count our labour or infrastructure costs in this) About 40 kg will be 'prime cuts' and the rest will go for casseroles & sausages. If we wanted bacon, the pigs would be kept longer / heavier.

You can see that if we added set-up costs, labour, butchery, packing etc - to make a profit would be well nigh impossible.

Robusta, I'm so glad to hear you say that you love your animals. I think a lot of people don't understand that the vast majority of livestock owners, care deeply for the welfare of their animals and give them the best possible life. When you get out of bed on a cold morning, walk across a wet field to feed your animals, then possibly clean out their pens, check everything is fine - before you go home to wash and have breakfast - that takes a bit of committment.
 
Capt Lightning

Yes, I know of three local producers who went to the wall when St Andrews abattoir shut down, they simply couldn't afford the transport and extra welfare costs taking the pigs to the net nearest one.
 
:eek:fftopic: This thread is about avoiding eating pork, not about pig farming boys.

Exactly, not being defensive of course, but if you want to exchange farming tips start a new thread jeez. I'm not being noble I just feel that eating less or no animal products is healthier. I mean I feel mild guilt about fish. But I have a Koi tank in the kitchen and they eat...fish flakes. So in any case I can enjoy fish completely. My relatives were hunters and thought nothing of having heads and antlers on their walls...but that's not me.
 
Laurie said:
Well, excuse me!

I was not aware we were so rigid about staying on thread.
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We never have been in the past Laurie so don't let it bother you, it certainly doesn't bother me if a thread 'drifts away'.

I've seen many, many threads (some started by me) go several pages simply because they got off the original topic..........as far as I'm concerned conversation is conversation so if a thread 'drifts away' it ain't no biggie in my book.
 
Kitties said:
I do find this part of your post interesting. I have not eaten meat in 25 years and have been plant based for 10. I don't think I have ever spoken or written something with this tone regarding my own views. I have worked at the same place for over 5 years. Most have no idea I don't eat meat.

I know there are some real jerks in the community that don't eat meat or eat plant based. I've been victimized by them since I'm overweight. Veganism has become a money making business like most things. While some of these people probably started out with great intentions, it's become about money and egos.

I don't donate of advocate for farm animals anymore. I'm just a person no one would guess eats plant based, based on my looks. Some of the posts in this thread went the predictable route.
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I don't think veganism has become about money or egos at all Kitties. I think that there are people who follow that lifestyle and who are entrepreneurial in spirit who've decided to earn a living while producing products that meet their 'spiritual' philosophies and I can only ask, is there anything wrong with that? People who eat meat, raise pigs or have companies that make cheese.....why not people who choose to create things that are not produced at the cost of lives?
 
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Debby said:
I don't think veganism has become about money or egos at all Kitties. I think that there are people who follow that lifestyle and who are entrepreneurial in spirit who've decided to earn a living while producing products that meet their 'spiritual' philosophies and I can only ask, is there anything wrong with that? People who eat meat, raise pigs or have companies that make cheese.....why not people who choose to create things that are not produced at the cost of lives?
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I'll have to disagree. I'm not talking about companies who produce organic or plant based foods. Though I have to wonder if all they would welcome from me is my money.

I'm talking about some of the big names in veganism. Dr Mcdougall, Ingrid Newkirk. Not sure if I'm spelling their names right. They have made vicious comments directed toward fat people. They sell veganism as a way to be thin and healthy and people like me are bad for business. Though statistics show that people who go vegan for health reasons vs ethical reasons usually have a much higher degree of going off plant based diets.

I used to donate and attend events at at well known large farm animal rescue group. I had three negative experiences there. The first two I could almost ignore. Being treated lousy is my baseline. But when I heard the co founder state in a speech that vegans should be advocates by appearance as part of an overall speech, I was done. This was stated at an event I was at. I can't even tell you how much that hurt my feelings. I left the event in tears. I have nothing to do with this organization anymore. I'm bad for business and my looks are more important than who I am. I donated money to this organization and loved the animals. All they wanted out of me was my money and I can't visit the animals anymore.
 

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