Medical Aid in Dying (MAID)

[MACKTEXAS]

I’m more than ok with it.

In many situations it makes more sense to me than legalized abortion.

Fortunately at this time our legislators in Texas are not "ok with it." People who feel "lonely and have no significant health issues" (words used in my post you're replying to) may need counseling or therapeutic help in gaining a better perspective instead of being euthanized.

 

[BlueDragonfly]

I would have thought the same many years ago until I worked with a veterinarian and assisted in many euthanasias. I believe now that it is a wonderful thing to relieve a living being of their misery when tgeir condition is terminal. It is gentle and fast and I’d like it for myself when the time comes.

Killing an animal is completely different than killing humans. I, too, would like for it to go gentle and fast, but
I would never presume to make a decision that is God's.

 

[BlueDragonfly]

They are not supposed to.

Wow. I have no words...

 

[feywon]

@feywon, I would not welcome standardized legalization of euthanasia to cut the costs you're concerned about, "even when all quality of life (which each of us should get to define for ourselves) is gone."

Has it occurred to you that there are many people who may decide for themselves that "all quality of life is gone" simply because they feel lonely and have no significant health issues? Should doctors be standing by to euthanize them with the blessings of the state?

I am in fact quite aware of that, having been been suicidal for many years in my youth.

I know i am not and i doubt anyone here us suggesting such assistance should be 'on demand' without some kind of medical and psychological evaluations required. Rather i think as end of life is clearly approaching either due to a catastrophic illness/accident or cumulative deterioration of physical body it could be helpful.

Currently DNRs and living wills do provide some options. Are you against those as well?

 

[January]

@BlueDragonfly - Pepper is right - governments and laws should be secular and not tied to the laws of your religion.

If you feel assisted dying is wrong, don't take that option (easy to say now of course when you are not in pain from a terminal illness) but the option is there for those who want it and who meet the critieria.
You dont have the right to impose your religion on others.

I'm not sure what your critieria in other countries is but I'm sure it does not include people who feel lonely or are young and homeless

Here in Australia one must be over 18 yrs, of sound mind and have a terminal progressive illness likely t o cause death within 6 months or 12 months for neurodegenerative diseases such as motor neurone disease.

 

[MACKTEXAS]

I am in fact quite aware of that, having been been suicidal for many years in my youth.

(1) I know i am not and i doubt anyone here is advocating don't think any of us here is suggesting such assistance should be 'on demand' without some kind of medical and psychological evaluations required. Rather as end of life is clearly approaching either due to a catastrophic illness/accident or cumulative deterioration of physical body it could be helpful.

(2) Currently DNRs and living wills do provide some options. Are you against those as well?

(1) Your previous post (#41) said in your own words that each of us should get to define when quality of life is gone. So it's up to the patient, and when he says it's time, that's when euthanasia should be permitted. That viewpoint authorizes "on demand."

(2) No, I'm not against DNR's and a Medical Power of Attorney. I have both. If I become incapacitated or otherwise unable to make decisions, those documents direct the medical attendees whether or not to perform CPR if my heart stops, natural breathings ceases, etc., thereby allowing me to experience a natural death rather than extending my life by artificial means.

Euthanasia, in contrast, involves actively ending a person's life, either by a doctor administering lethal drugs, or by an individual self-administering a lethal dose. DNRs are legal everywhere in the U.S. whereas euthanasia and physician-assisted dying are legal only in specific states and jurisdictions.

[Post edited to remove 3 attachments.]

 

[MACKTEXAS]

I, too, would like for it to go gentle and fast, but I would never presume to make a decision that is God's.

I suspect the two of us may well agree on that, but our laws are not based on that context.

 

[Aunt Bea]

Fortunately at this time our legislators in Texas are not "ok with it." People who feel "lonely and have no significant health issues" (words used in my post you're replying to) may need counseling or therapeutic help in gaining a better perspective instead of being euthanized.

I hear you and understand your thoughts.

I believe it should be one of several options that each of us should be allowed to choose.

If the option is not for you, I can respect that.

 

[Happy Heart]

One aspect not yet mentioned is when the insurance companies claim they will no longer pay for treatment regardless of what the patient wants. If I recall correctly, this issue came up in Congress but I didn't follow the story. I just hate that a corporation would tell someone with the will to live that they are discarded because their treatment isn't in the best interest of the stockholders.

 

[papa tiger]

One feature the US never adopted is Medical Aid in Dying (MAID). Those over age 80 and those with terminal illnesses desperately need this kind of law. Why should dying folks have to suffer terribly for years just to die? I believe 11 US states have MAID but 39 states do not.

As death approaches, many folks use up their entire estates on medical bills, nursing care and nursing homes just to die in the end. This problem affects every social class. Some die quick but others die long, terrible deaths in pain and terrible impairment just to die.

I'm 90 years old and I do not fear death. I fear a long, SLOW death with pain, impairment and total loss of most or all of my accumulated wealth over many years. It would take a courageous government to bite the bullet and pass laws to enable the suffering to die. My only hope is that I die from a sudden heart attack in the end without a long, drawn out dying process.

Choose your day, walk up on the bridge late at night, say 3AM and just fall off accidentally! It's good now. You don't have to walk a mile, just 50' over the river. Seconds to rewrite wishes and done. If you're a great swimmer smacks your strong arm when you jump.

I once saw a show where the Tribe had moved on, the Indian old and feeble, no longer of use, all alone, sat outside his tent to die. That seemed sort of dumb.

Here I can just step off the road at Pere Marquette state park. Never met a dying person who didn't just want to die while lying in a hospital / nursing home bed.

They send them here to just die was the moto! Giving a darn about your stuff just seems a waste of foolishness. God gives you the right
to choose, freedom of choice!

 

[smiley]

Fortunately at this time our legislators in Texas are not "ok with it." People who feel "lonely and have no significant health issues" (words used in my post you're replying to) may need counseling or therapeutic help in gaining a better perspective instead of being euthanized.

true

 

[papa tiger]

My neighbor's friend is living a nightmare. Her husband was determined to end his life via handgun, and all he ended up doing was disfiguring his face and losing an eye. Their lives are now chaos...

Hand him another shell.

 

[papa tiger]

Oregon was the first state to offer death with dignity (aka assisted suicide).
Seems to be working so well here that folks from out of state are moving here to use it.
Its definitely my choice if/when I qualify.

Why make a big deal about paying to get knocked off. There are plenty of hi places to slip out on.
Leave a note, the person you hate the most did it, in an old shoe.

 

[smiley]

Killing an animal is completely different than killing humans. I, too, would like for it to go gentle and fast, but
I would never presume to make a decision that is God's.

if you read the current religious thread rolling along you may find that God may not want to be involved in making a decision for your death. He biblically speaking gave us free spirit to go and vegitate and propogate and be kind to all - I've never read in the bible where it says he/she [God that is] takes us away without our nod??

 

[papa tiger]

This is a complex issue. It provides potential for the government to incentivize Medical Aid in Dying to reduce the expense of long-term care, and it raises ethical concerns about devaluing life and shifting healthcare priorities.

But the average is people are basically worthless after 75. ... ... nothing of value and has freedom of choice about stuff.
Its like a rock band of the 70's perform with arthritis and fobbed music tracks.

 

[smiley]

it;s a method of choice that's all and as long as dealt with sensible and calmly and carefully - why not? I must confess have not come across a bible text that says " you must not kill oneself? or that God says I gave life and only I can take it away?

 

[Warrigal]

If I want to commit suicide, I don’t need anyone’s permission.

You only need to stop eating and drinking. In one week you will no longer be living.

My mother, aged 93 and pretty much nonverbal, did just that. There was no way that she was going to accept anything by mouth, and I refused permission for feeding by any sort of tube because I knew she would have fought like a tiger to resist that.

With the aid of some medication to calm the brain waves she spent her last week being visited by all of her relatives until she passed into a deep sleep before finally ceasing to breathe.

Hers was a good death, painless, and at the time of her choosing. Nothing illegal about it either.

 

[OldOld]

Some people suffer from paralysis, mild/severe stroke, spinal problem or loose control of bowel or urinal movement and/or have constant pain that only the morphine can put them into numbness state, in which case they will be in deep sleep all the time with no responsiveness any way. Their illness are incurable but not terminal, and their life expectancy is not less than 6 months, so they are not currently qualified for medical assistant dying in the states where MAID is legal now.

 

[January]

Choose your day, walk up on the bridge late at night, say 3AM and just fall off accidentally! It's good now. You don't have to walk a mile, just 50' over the river. Seconds to rewrite wishes and done. If you're a great swimmer smacks your strong arm when you jump.

my bold

which of course most people with end stage terminal illness cannot do.

 

[PurplePower]

@feywon, I would not welcome standardized legalization of euthanasia to cut the costs you're concerned about, "even when all quality of life (which each of us should get to define for ourselves) is gone."

Has it occurred to you that there are many people who may decide for themselves that "all quality of life is gone" simply because they feel lonely and have no significant health issues? Should doctors be standing by to euthanize them with the blessings of the state?

I have no problem with that. It’s really no one else’s business.

 

[January]

You only need to stop eating and drinking. In one week you will no longer be living.

My mother, aged 93 and pretty much nonverbal, did just that. There was no way that she was going to accept anything by mouth, and I refused permission for feeding by any sort of tube because I knew she would have fought like a tiger to resist that.

With the aid of some medication to calm the brain waves she spent her last week being visited by all of her relatives until she passed into a deep sleep before finally ceasing to breathe.

Hers was a good death, painless, and at the time of her choosing. Nothing illegal about it either.

When I used t o work in Aged Care you sometimes found that - people who just, for no apparent reason, stopped eating - and then soon after passed away
Non communicative and advanced dementia residents - so I dont think they could have thought it out - but somehow just took this step.

and if they have previously signed an advanced care directive or their family decide for them - then they are not tube fed.
This was usually the case - the only people on tube feeds came in t o the facility with them already , very rarely was one instigated after they were a resident and then only if family insisted. It would not be something we encouraged.

but that is passive euthanasia - ie not doing anything to prolong life but not actively ceasing it.

Not the same as VAD or MAID.

 

[PurplePower]

Fortunately at this time our legislators in Texas are not "ok with it." People who feel "lonely and have no significant health issues" (words used in my post you're replying to) may need counseling or therapeutic help in gaining a better perspective instead of being euthanized

Some people cannot be “cured” of lifelong severe clinical depression. Unfortunately, death with dignity laws generally exclude anyone with any signs of depression. Again, I say, it’s no one else’s business.

 

[BlueDragonfly]

if you read the current religious thread rolling along you may find that God may not want to be involved in making a decision for your death. He biblically speaking gave us free spirit to go and vegitate and propogate and be kind to all - I've never read in the bible where it says he/she [God that is] takes us away without our nod??

LOL Well, there's a thought....

 

[BlueDragonfly]

@BlueDragonfly - Pepper is right - governments and laws should be secular and not tied to the laws of your religion.

Your opinion.... And just because you say it is so, does not make it so. Even if you use lots of words to tell me, or others, that we are wrong because we have an opinion contrary to yours.

If you feel assisted dying is wrong, don't take that option (easy to say now of course when you are not in pain from a terminal illness) but the option is there for those who want it and who meet the critieria.
You dont have the right to impose your religion on others.

You're in Oz. Don't presume to understand what rights I have as an American. Over here, everyone imposes their fill-in-the-blank on everyone else.

I'm not sure what your critieria in other countries is but I'm sure it does not include people who feel lonely or are young and homeless

Here in Australia one must be over 18 yrs, of sound mind and have a terminal progressive illness likely t o cause death within 6 months or 12 months for neurodegenerative diseases such as motor neurone disease.

Again, I am against murder - no matter what wordage is used to make it seem not so wrong. Not because I feel so, but because of my belief system that tells me so. The one that you "don't like", blanket judging 'born agains'.

On that note, I will not engage you further. It's a waste of both of our time and Matrix's patience.

 

[MACKTEXAS]

I hear you and understand your thoughts.

I believe it should be one of several options that each of us should be allowed to choose.

If the option is not for you, I can respect that.

But the average is people are basically worthless after 75. ... ... nothing of value and has freedom of choice about stuff.
Its like a rock band of the 70's perform with arthritis and fobbed music tracks.

I have no problem with that. It’s really no one else’s business.

Some people cannot be “cured” of lifelong severe clinical depression. Unfortunately, death with dignity laws generally exclude anyone with any signs of depression. Again, I say, it’s no one else’s business.

I hit the "like" button on each of your posts because you took the time to reply . Thank you. I respect your right to your opinions / beliefs.

Whether or not we agree on this issue, I feel no need to further explain, modify, or retract the views I've already expressed in my earlier posts.