Military has indeed probably been hiding alien info

Mitch86 said:
There are probably billions of stars and planets harboring intelligent life. However, distances are so vast they will never find us and we will probably never find them. Humans are made out of solid material and liquids. Those aliens could be gaseous, fluid, solid or subatomic. It's all fantasy at this point.
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Carl Sagan thought so, but after the release of the 2000 best seller Rare Earth, Why Complex Life is Uncommon in the Universe by Ward and Brownlee, most astrobiologists now expect complex intelligent life is rare while primitve life as in bacteria and viruses are common. I also expect panspermia has spread DNA organic life including here to Earth. And Ultimate Intelligent Entities, aka UIEs, are far far more likely than intelligent entities with magic like god powers.

Any aliens that can travel light year distances between star systems are likely non-organic as in essentially immortal if not physically destroyed AI Artificial Intelligence. So distance limitations are unlikely. And as a science person, a whole lot of favorites of science fiction writers will IMO forever be impossible even for ancient UIEs.

I'm also one that expects many ideas used by science fiction writers will NEVER be possible including:

  • time travel
  • teleportation
  • black hole wormhole travel
  • parallel universes, simultaneous space multidimensions
  • reading organic minds from a distance
  • bringing back to life never saved organic life from dust
  • deflector shields against weapons
 

For all we know we HUMANS may be descended from aliens who dropped in 1 million years ago. A human manned space ship may have crash landed here on the way to somewhere else and the male and female survivors created a few Adams and Eves.

I believe that "life" can be solid state, liquid state and gaseous state.
 
How about those 8’ tall aliens seen meandering around someone’s backyard following a supposed UFO crash near Vegas? And since Vegas was the site, was Elvis on board with the ET’s? Inquiring minds wanna know… 🛸

 
Life is just a bunch of atoms and molecules in the right environments and are arranged in ways that are governed by laws of physics. As far as we know, those laws, whether we understand them or not, are consistent throughout the universe. Given the vastness of an almost infinite universe, it is statistically impossible for there not to be other Earth like environments, where the same laws would generate other forms of life. It's also likely that some environments that are not even Earth like could support life that we lack the imagination to consider.
 
Humans also tend to think in terms of life that is out there right now existing in our time frame. But in the last 14 billion years, stars and planets have been popping in and out of existence, along with any life that exists or has existed on them. In my mind, I can picture a greatly sped up geologic time, where pockets of life are constantly popping up and disappearing like flashbulbs throughout the vastness of space. In the big picture, the universe is anything but stable. It's been here for a long time, and has a lot more time to go. Long after intelligent life on Earth is gone, it will be popping up somewhere else, or it has already flashed and we have already missed it when we came on the scene.
 
David777 said:
Carl Sagan thought so, but after the release of the 2000 best seller Rare Earth, Why Complex Life is Uncommon in the Universe by Ward and Brownlee, most astrobiologists now expect complex intelligent life is rare while primitve life as in bacteria and viruses are common. I also expect panspermia has spread DNA organic life including here to Earth. And Ultimate Intelligent Entities, aka UIEs, are far far more likely than intelligent entities with magic like god powers.

Any aliens that can travel light year distances between star systems are likely non-organic as in essentially immortal if not physically destroyed AI Artificial Intelligence. So distance limitations are unlikely. And as a science person, a whole lot of favorites of science fiction writers will IMO forever be impossible even for ancient UIEs.

I'm also one that expects many ideas used by science fiction writers will NEVER be possible including:

  • time travel
  • teleportation
  • black hole wormhole travel
  • parallel universes, simultaneous space multidimensions
  • reading organic minds from a distance
  • bringing back to life never saved organic life from dust
  • deflector shields against weapons
Click to expand...
This article mentions scientific support for parallel universes and asks the question "Do we live in a multiverse".
https://www.space.com/32728-parallel-universes.html
 
Dave03 said:
I find it exciting to think about.

I fully believe that there are other life forms out there.

It's kind of presumptuous for us to think that, in the entire universe, we're the only ones.
Click to expand...
Yes. Just look at some of the alien life right here on earth.

No oxygen​

This newfound creature, a loriciferan identified as an undescribed species of the genus Spinoloricus. The creature has specialized organelles so that it can survive without oxygen. Scale bar is 50 microns.

This newfound creature, a loriciferan identified as an undescribed species of the genus Spinoloricus. The creature has specialized organelles so that it can survive without oxygen. Scale bar is 50 microns. (Image credit: Roberto Danovaro et al., BMC Biology.)
This newfound creature, a loriciferan identified as an undescribed species of the genus Spinoloricus. The creature has specialized organelles so that it can survive without oxygen. Scale bar is 50 microns.

Live Science newsletter​

 
OneEyedDiva said:
This article mentions scientific support for parallel universes and asks the question "Do we live in a multiverse".
https://www.space.com/32728-parallel-universes.html
Click to expand...
Thanks @OneEyedDiva, that was a good balanced read. What I strongly disagree with are those (often science fiction enthusiasts) that think it is possible for such universes to occupy the same 3-dimensional space with our own. The notion of universes with different fine tuning properties outside our own has more credibility though I would lean towards that as less likely versus it all at this point being similar. Also lean towards ideas of infinite 3-D space beyond our own Big Bang universe as it would be odd given an infinite vastness. Also illogical IMO are ideas that in infinite space with infinite universes, there are infinite copies of each of us and our lives. Chaos theory destroys such ideas given infinite variations.
 
Well today's news is relating the big reveal of our lifetime may be tomorrow, Wednesday 7/25/2023 to Congress. As this science person has related several times, the probability that other advanced intelligent entities exist in our universe is now overwhelming given what we know about the inevitability of even we Earth monkeys soon being capable of creating non-organic AIs.

https://nypost.com/2023/07/25/ex-to...s-new-details-on-pentagons-retrieval-of-ufos/

A former top US intelligence officer says defense officials told him UFOs have been recovered — and that bombshell details about the extraterrestrial craft are set to be revealed to Congress on Wednesday. “I’ve been told that we have recovered technology that did not originate on this Earth, by officials in the Department of Defense and by former intelligence officials,” said Christopher Mellon, the former deputy assistant secretary of defense for intelligence, to NewsNation’s Chris Cuomo Monday night. Mellon said UFO whistleblower Dave Grusch, a former intelligence official, is set to drop explosive new testimony before Congress regarding the Pentagon’s alleged spacecraft retrieval program this week.

“The objective here, I think, and the opportunity, is for the American people to come to better understand why it is that so many in Congress actually take seriously the idea that there are UFOs, UAP [unidentified aerial phenomena] that are violating US airspace and the associated rumor, allegation, that we may have in our possession off-world technology recovered from someone else’s space program,” Mellon said.

Can watch live tomorrow at this youtube site at 10am EDT or 8am PDT.

https://www.space.com/ufos-congress-hearing-livestream-july-2023
 
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Bloomberg posted an on-line article about an hour ago.

Close Encounters With UFOs Described to Congressional Committee​

By line Kim & Davidson

Another nothing-burger. No surprise there. Take away being, "The Senate is considering a bipartisan measure that would force the government to disclose reported sightings of such objects and what it learns about them".

Operative word being 'considering' (bolded in the quote by me). Considering is government speak means that nothing will ever happen. Yet another waste of taxpayer time and money.
 
I watched part of the hearing, but saw nothing startling about UFOs. Just reports that a lot of pilots who are not named believe they have seen strange things, which we already know. It will probably give life to more conspiracy theories, and it may or may not help to establish a central clearing house where all reports can be gathered, which won't hurt, but does little to establish any credibility based on hard physical evidence. Meanwhile, more serious problems facing the country and the rest of the planet get worse. I will say that the senators at the hearing were polite, at least while I watched.
 
I think the hearing was to keep the issue before the public and to pressure the media and the public to demand answers from the government. Congressional members pointed out that private companies have much more info on this topic than Congress does. They said they were denied classified information from these witnesses and it was said several times that Congress oversees military intelligence and private companies working in this area instead of the other way around. It seems that there is a power struggle going on in an attempt to get more information out to the public.
 
ArnoldC said:
Bloomberg posted an on-line article about an hour ago.

Close Encounters With UFOs Described to Congressional Committee​

By line Kim & Davidson

Another nothing-burger. No surprise there. Take away being, "The Senate is considering a bipartisan measure that would force the government to disclose reported sightings of such objects and what it learns about them".

Operative word being 'considering' (bolded in the quote by me). Considering is government speak means that nothing will ever happen. Yet another waste of taxpayer time and money.
Click to expand...
I fell asleep and missed about half of the hearing which I watched live on YouTube. I'm pretty sure that when live streaming ends, the hearing will remain on YT. @JustDave I know what you mean. From what I saw, there were still a lot of things that for security reasons could not be mentioned. Still, that there are credible witnesses to these events or cover ups about same and that congress sees fit to take the situation seriously, may be helpful in establishing that they really do exist.

@David777 Re you thanking me for the article on parallel universes. You are welcome, of course.
 
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Hearing went well with well prepared questions that won't allow the cover-uppers to twist or deny anything put into the hearing record. That said, those ignorant of what this first phase was about and that were expecting little green men to be exposed will blabber about how the hearings did little. All the serious questions were blocked from being made public as Grusch kept repeating that he wasn't allowed to make such info public only at SCIF hearings. My expectation is there are some big people [a$$h....] in the Pentagon really squirming now wondering how they are going to continue to hide all this because the next phase of the hearings will have the same whistleblowers testifying in SCIFs, to now very annoyed and frustrated congressional people. Those are Sensitive Compartmented Information Facilities (acronymed SCIFs and pronounced "skiffs") that serve as secure rooms where those with top-secret clearance can view some of the country's most classified information.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...gress-david-grusch-whistleblower-live-updates

Here’s a recap of today’s developments:

  • The US government conducted a “multi-decade” program which collected, and attempted to reverse engineer, crashed UFOs, former intelligence official David Grusch told the hearing.
  • Grusch, who led analysis of unexplained anomalous phenomena (UAP) within a US Department of Defense agency until 2023, claimed he had been denied access to secret government UFO programs, said he has faced “very brutal” retaliation as a result of his allegations. He claimed he had knowledge of “people who have been harmed or injured” in the course of government efforts to conceal UFO information.
  • Grusch told lawmakers that “non-human” biologics had been recovered by the government, but he had never seen an alien body. Grusch has also not seen the alleged alien craft himself – he says his claims are based on “extensive interviews with high-level intelligence officials” – and skeptics have noted that accusations that the government is hiding information on UFOs are nothing new.
  • The Pentagon has denied Grusch’s claims of a cover-up. In a statement, a defense department spokesperson said investigators have not discovered “any verifiable information to substantiate claims that any programs regarding the possession or reverse-engineering of extraterrestrial materials have existed in the past or exist currently”.
  • Grusch’s allegation that the federal government was hiding this evidence of extraterrestrials from Congress sparked a firestorm in June, prompting the Republican-led oversight committee to launch an immediate investigation.
  • Other witnesses at the hearing were David Fravor, a former navy commander who recalled seeing a strange object in the sky while on a training mission in 2004.
  • Ryan Graves, a retired navy pilot who has since founded Americans for Safe Aerospace, a UAP non-profit, claimed that he saw UAP off the Atlantic coast “every day for at least a couple years”. The sightings were “not rare or isolated” and were being witnessed by military aircrews and commercial pilots “whose lives depend on accurate identification”, Graves said.
 
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David777 said:
Hearing went well with well prepared questions that won't allow the cover-uppers to twist or "just deny it" anything put into the record. That said, those ignorant of what this first phase was about and that were expecting little green men to be exposed will blabber about how the hearings did little. My expectation is there are some big people [a$$h....) in the Pentagon really squirming now wondering how they are going to continue to hide all this because the next phase of the hearings will have the same people testifying in SCIFs. Those are Sensitive Compartmented Information Facilities (acronymed SCIFs and pronounced "skiffs") that serve as secure rooms where those with top-secret clearance can view some of the country's most classified information.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...gress-david-grusch-whistleblower-live-updates

Here’s a recap of today’s developments:

  • The US government conducted a “multi-decade” program which collected, and attempted to reverse engineer, crashed UFOs, former intelligence official David Grusch told the hearing.
  • Grusch, who led analysis of unexplained anomalous phenomena (UAP) within a US Department of Defense agency until 2023, claimed he had been denied access to secret government UFO programs, said he has faced “very brutal” retaliation as a result of his allegations. He claimed he had knowledge of “people who have been harmed or injured” in the course of government efforts to conceal UFO information.
  • Grusch told lawmakers that “non-human” biologics had been recovered by the government, but he had never seen an alien body. Grusch has also not seen the alleged alien craft himself – he says his claims are based on “extensive interviews with high-level intelligence officials” – and skeptics have noted that accusations that the government is hiding information on UFOs are nothing new.
  • The Pentagon has denied Grusch’s claims of a cover-up. In a statement, a defense department spokesperson said investigators have not discovered “any verifiable information to substantiate claims that any programs regarding the possession or reverse-engineering of extraterrestrial materials have existed in the past or exist currently”.
  • Grusch’s allegation that the federal government was hiding this evidence of extraterrestrials from Congress sparked a firestorm in June, prompting the Republican-led oversight committee to launch an immediate investigation.
  • Other witnesses at the hearing were David Fravor, a former navy commander who recalled seeing a strange object in the sky while on a training mission in 2004.
  • Ryan Graves, a retired navy pilot who has since founded Americans for Safe Aerospace, a UAP non-profit, claimed that he saw UAP off the Atlantic coast “every day for at least a couple years”. The sightings were “not rare or isolated” and were being witnessed by military aircrews and commercial pilots “whose lives depend on accurate identification”, Graves said.
Click to expand...
I agree with you. And thank you for the recap. What struck me, having started watching it late, is the retaliation Grush said he and some of his colleagues faced. At some point, I will watch more of it on YT.
 
David777 said:
Carl Sagan thought so, but after the release of the 2000 best seller Rare Earth, Why Complex Life is Uncommon in the Universe by Ward and Brownlee, most astrobiologists now expect complex intelligent life is rare while primitve life as in bacteria and viruses are common. I also expect panspermia has spread DNA organic life including here to Earth. And Ultimate Intelligent Entities, aka UIEs, are far far more likely than intelligent entities with magic like god powers.

Any aliens that can travel light year distances between star systems are likely non-organic as in essentially immortal if not physically destroyed AI Artificial Intelligence. So distance limitations are unlikely. And as a science person, a whole lot of favorites of science fiction writers will IMO forever be impossible even for ancient UIEs.

I'm also one that expects many ideas used by science fiction writers will NEVER be possible including:

  • time travel
  • teleportation
  • black hole wormhole travel
  • parallel universes, simultaneous space multidimensions
  • reading organic minds from a distance
  • bringing back to life never saved organic life from dust
  • deflector shields against weapons
Click to expand...
In 1947 when I was 10 years old, we got the Reader's Digest in class and each student picked an article to report on. I chose a story on UFOs in what I later believed to be Area 51. I was interested but soon after there seemed to be a blackout on any information. Years later when I had trouble sleeping, I would listen to Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell. I think it aired from 1:00 to 5:00 AM. It featured some weird theories but an occasional guest was an expert on UFOs which confirmed much of what I had read. I also found the "remote viewing" segments by military personnel fascinating.
 
David777 said:
Hearing went well with well prepared questions that won't allow the cover-uppers to twist or deny anything put into the hearing record. That said, those ignorant of what this first phase was about and that were expecting little green men to be exposed will blabber about how the hearings did little. All the serious questions were blocked from being made public as Grusch kept repeating that he wasn't allowed to make such info public only at SCIF hearings. My expectation is there are some big people [a$$h....] in the Pentagon really squirming now wondering how they are going to continue to hide all this because the next phase of the hearings will have the same whistleblowers testifying in SCIFs, to now very annoyed and frustrated congressional people. Those are Sensitive Compartmented Information Facilities (acronymed SCIFs and pronounced "skiffs") that serve as secure rooms where those with top-secret clearance can view some of the country's most classified information.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/l...gress-david-grusch-whistleblower-live-updates

Here’s a recap of today’s developments:

  • The US government conducted a “multi-decade” program which collected, and attempted to reverse engineer, crashed UFOs, former intelligence official David Grusch told the hearing.
  • Grusch, who led analysis of unexplained anomalous phenomena (UAP) within a US Department of Defense agency until 2023, claimed he had been denied access to secret government UFO programs, said he has faced “very brutal” retaliation as a result of his allegations. He claimed he had knowledge of “people who have been harmed or injured” in the course of government efforts to conceal UFO information.
  • Grusch told lawmakers that “non-human” biologics had been recovered by the government, but he had never seen an alien body. Grusch has also not seen the alleged alien craft himself – he says his claims are based on “extensive interviews with high-level intelligence officials” – and skeptics have noted that accusations that the government is hiding information on UFOs are nothing new.
  • The Pentagon has denied Grusch’s claims of a cover-up. In a statement, a defense department spokesperson said investigators have not discovered “any verifiable information to substantiate claims that any programs regarding the possession or reverse-engineering of extraterrestrial materials have existed in the past or exist currently”.
  • Grusch’s allegation that the federal government was hiding this evidence of extraterrestrials from Congress sparked a firestorm in June, prompting the Republican-led oversight committee to launch an immediate investigation.
  • Other witnesses at the hearing were David Fravor, a former navy commander who recalled seeing a strange object in the sky while on a training mission in 2004.
  • Ryan Graves, a retired navy pilot who has since founded Americans for Safe Aerospace, a UAP non-profit, claimed that he saw UAP off the Atlantic coast “every day for at least a couple years”. The sightings were “not rare or isolated” and were being witnessed by military aircrews and commercial pilots “whose lives depend on accurate identification”, Graves said.
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Dave, let's say the US military had indeed somehow obtained advanced technology from an alien source, and that they are the only military on the planet to possess that knowledge.

Can you think of any reasons why it would be imperative they keep it a secret?

I can.
 
Alizerine said:
In 1947 when I was 10 years old, we got the Reader's Digest in class and each student picked an article to report on. I chose a story on UFOs in what I later believed to be Area 51. I was interested but soon after there seemed to be a blackout on any information. Years later when I had trouble sleeping, I would listen to Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell. I think it aired from 1:00 to 5:00 AM. It featured some weird theories but an occasional guest was an expert on UFOs which confirmed much of what I had read. I also found the "remote viewing" segments by military personnel fascinating.
Click to expand...
Your account of Coat to Coast made me think of a friend I connected with a long time ago on a now defunct Boomer site. Her screen name was C2C Listener. When asked how we chose our screen names, she said hers meant Coast To Coast Listener. That's how I first found out about the show, but I never listened.
 

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